kids lost all respect.

aliasojo

Errata wrote: »

No bad dogs, only bad owners. You are now reaping what you sowed and I have not one ounce of sympathy for you but shedloads for the two kids.
Get yourself to a parenting class and find out what you should be doing and how to do it, although I suspect it may be way too late.

That was my immediate thought when I read this thread.

I also then wondered, if the Mum wasn't coping well previously, why were things not tackled a long time ago. This type of behaviour doesn't happen overnight, I think maybe Mum & Dad have just not been seen as a united front by the lads and just as a dog will push the boundaries of a weak owner, so will children of less than firm parents.

I do have sympathy though, parenting doesn't come with a guidebook and it's difficult to know where to draw the line sometimes. I give the OP credit for now clearly stating 'this is a problem and help me do something about it'.

OP things will definitely get worse before they get better, your lads have had their own way up until now. They have learned that a certain type of behaviour seems to work for them. You need to break that thought and introduce a new family dynamic. That's not going to sit well with the lads and they will instinctively push against it even harder for a while.

It's not too late. But you do need to be strong from here on in. You need to talk properly with your wife and decide if you can work together or if maybe you need to part company. Either way, the lads need strong leadership. Note...that doesn't mean you need to be the loudest and strongest, you just need to be reasonable, firm and unbending when it comes to discipline. You need to show them there are consequences to everything and you need to back up what you say with action, don't just go through the motions.

Unfortunately 13 is a bad age with regards to testosterone boosts. One of mine said he woke up one day just feeling angry and he was like that for a long time. He had no idea why. The Doc told us he had likely had a huge surge of testosterone (because of puberty) around that time and this was how it had affected him, he also had a lump on his chest above one nipple which was apparently also down to the testosterone surge.

Good luck. You're going to need it.

euronorris

DatabaseError wrote: »

there can be loads, 2 weeks ago we had a great day at the seaside together. One of them (the sleepy one today) posted this on facebook the day after,
"- i dont see you as much as i should, i never wanna get out of bed when your home but i regret it by the end of the night coz we would have a really good day:) loveyou x"

This, and the 'I'm gonna get kicked out of school cos I'm gonna be naughty' comment has me thinking that this is mainly about you being away, and how much they resent it (despite what they say).

They clearly enjoyed the day out with you, but the staying in bed until it's too late says to me that they are angry with you for not being there at other times and now want you to 'work for it'.

The comment about school is screaming out 'pay attention to me!'. I suspect this bad behaviour may first have occurred the first time they noticed your absence. They didn't know how to express themselves clearly so started playing up. If they didn't get reassurance then and your wife gave in for a quiet life, then they learned that (as far as they are concerned) that no one cared they were upset but did care if they played up. And it's continued like that ever since.

You can change things, but it will take time and perseverance. You'll need to schedule regular family outings, chats etc. And, can you change your working pattern?

onetomany

im sorry if this sounds harsh, but you work away for 6 months, sounds like mums bean struggling you come home mum goes on holiday the next day to met a blike she talks to on internet and the boys are playing up? noooooooooo the adults are not playing the right roles , you wife shouldnt be away (even if she does need a break) she should have waited untill you had bulit your relasonship up with boys im sure they must feel abanden by their mum and left with a stranger also i would like to add shes gone on holiday using credit cards to pay and you have lost your job? surely the money issuie is going to add to your problems, try to stay calm with your boys and remind them as offten as you can on how much you love them tell them and show them by trying to spend as much time as posible with them eg go to local park and watch the local footie, get a dvd and popcorn in maybe start a project? like decarate a room but its just you and the boys project good luck

sassyblue

I was going to suggest you need to get another job, one that doesn't take you away from home, but l see you've been made redundant.

I'm not surprised your wife's gone away, she's had a lot on her plate day in day out for too long. She's been virtually a single parent for months on end to two unruly kids, l'm not surprised she's let them get away with alot so she can have some peace. Albeit the wrong thing to do because it breeds further trouble...

Teenage boys can be hard work, they can be angry, lazy, mouthy and other things, you need to find something the 3 of you can enjoy doing together to start to form a bond, respect is EARNED. If mum can get involved all the better.

You can turn this around, you need to be firm, consistent but BE THERE. You made a comment about your wife spending money, emptying the bank account or something. You need to find a job locally, sit down together and make sure she doesn't spend more than you have (if she does this often), there's lots of money saving tips on this board.

Good luck, your only problem really is that for too long all 4 of you have not been working together as a family, it can be changed, do it now before your wife comes home and she'll be more inclined to work with you too.

carefullycautious

DatabaseError wrote: »

full time father would rely upon my wife's part time supermarket wage, so no. I need to get a job pretty quickly before the bank empties (might have a careful month or so)
thinking about camping, not got any gear, but i guess the essentials are a tent, airbeds and sleeping bags, maybe a pan for beans and sausages...

You could stay in youth hostels. Cheap and cheerful

victory

http://www.yha.org.uk/

jfdi

Why should they love & respect you? What have you done FOR THEM (excluding bill paying - they're kids, they don't have to get that yet!)?

They appear to be desperate for Love & Attention & will get it any way they can - & if it's not for being good, then it'll be for being naughty.

Listen to them, talk to them, laugh with them & love them. If you've both grounded them right over the years you've time to turn it around - but Love & Approval & Attention & Firmness (as in consistency etc) & honesty is imperative from now on. No regrets, no turning back - be all you can for them.

And a camping trip sounds like an excellent idea - no escape & you'll all HAVE to sort it - but make it at least a week, 2 if possible. You need to integrate the changes in you ALL before returning home.

Welshwoofs

Dear oh lord...

Forget all the fluffy, huggy 'tell them you love them more often' stuff. What you have here is a failure to train your children. You've stated they were 'difficult' from birth - kids aren't difficult unless you LET them be difficult. If you give them everything they want and set no boundaries then you can fully expect to rear belligerent little sods who think the world owes them a living and who won't take instruction from anyone. They then end up the sort who can't stay in a job because "I'm not getting up for 9am innit", "He can't tell me what to do" etc etc.

The teenager sleeping? What you should have done is given him two warnings to get up and if he didn't heed that you should have thrown a bucket of cold water over him. I can guarantee he'd find it hard to sleep in a wet bed. If they're grounded and they get out the window....nail up the window. DON'T let them speak to you with disrespect, tell them firmly that the next time they do so there will be consequences - tell them exactly what the consequences are and stick to them.

You've left it very late, but if you don't instill some discipline in them now they'll end up jobless and with ASBOs. Forget about taking them on holiday - they've done sod-all to deserve it from what you've said. Instead I'd say that IF they can work with you and turn this around, THEN there'll be a holiday.

victory

DatabaseError wrote: »

she's not been in touch with them, that I'm aware of.
as to me leaving when she gets back, that's not a decision that's been made yet, wife and i need to do a lot of talking,
boys do know there are big problems

I am having trouble with this, the one thing, two things I absolutely adore and would walk over hot coals for are my sons, without question, I could never contemplate going on holiday and not checking in at least once a day, I know USA to UK will be costly but not even a text? Chat via skype, an internet cafe to send an email?

One minute they have their mum there, then mum goes and you return, then they have you but no contact with mum.

The boys certainly do know you both have big problems and they have them too now.

If you were made redundant surely every penny counts and putting a hol on a credit card? Uhm

aliasojo

victory wrote: »

I am having trouble with this, the one thing, two things I absolutely adore and would walk over hot coals for are my sons, without question, I could never contemplate going on holiday and not checking in at least once a day, I know USA to UK will be costly but not even a text? Chat via skype, an internet cafe to send an email?

One minute they have their mum there, then mum goes and you return, then they have you but no contact with mum.

The boys certainly do know you both have big problems and they have them too now.

If you were made redundant surely every penny counts and putting a hol on a credit card? Uhm

Clearly I don't know the background and as such I can only offer an opinion based on what the OP has said so far, but I suspect Mum has been pushed to the end of her tether and is maybe at the 'I've had enough too' stage.

People can do things that are not very sensible when they feel like that (like putting a holiday on a credit card). They can also feel like they just need to get away and need peace for themselves before they break.

I spent around 3 solid years talking myself out of leaving every single day when my middle one was playing up. I can understand just how 'pushed to the edge' you can feel sometimes. Maybe Mum needed time out? Worn down people are not always able to see things clearly and often act emotionally. Getting away and not calling home fits that, imo.

I get the feeling she's pretty much been left to get on with things a lot and her behaviour now, could well be just a result of everything that's happened and isn't really too surprising.

Mind you, that's just me surmising and I could be wrong.....for all I know she could be as happy as hell and partying every night.