Would you end your marriage (or relationship,) if your partner didn't want children?

dazster

If my partner announced that she wanted children I'd give her the heave-ho. Fortunately we established many, many years ago (and before we did anything as committing as jointly buying a house) that we both wished to be child-free.

Consequently I am unable to comment on whether there is anything special about the bond between parent and child, but if it's all about nurturing and protecting a being that is entirely dependent then cats can serve that function with considerably less hassle and expense (albeit with regular grief, thanks to their relatively short lifespans).

happyandcontented

Goldiegirl wrote: »

You can say it if you want to, it doesn't bother me.


There are many forms of love - it is unrealistic to believe that everyone will experience every single type of love in their life, and I won't experience the love for a child as a mother. But I have chosen that, so there's no problem- and no problem that others will experience this

I don't think it unrealistic that many people will have experienced most types of love; spousal, child, friend, parental, sibling, animal for example.

Jagraf wrote: »

Clearly very many parents do not feel responsible for their children, and clearly parental love doesn't need to stem from a young age. I don't think it is contentious, I just think that everyone experiences love differently, so you may feel its a different kind of love, but others don't.

As I say, all love is experienced differently from one person to the next. One type of spousal love can be as strong as a parent child love.

I suppose the only difference is that biological parenting is essentially egotistical.

Which type? I didn't say it wasn't as strong, I said it was different, unlike other types of love, and a different bond because it is made up of different component parts.

Person_one wrote: »

Even if you absolutely think something is true, that doesn't mean you have to go around saying it. If its insensitive, or hurtful, or patronising, does the fact that you believe it mean its ok?

Well, it is the other side to the coin. Is it ok that those who made a choice to be childfree denigrate those who have kids? Is it ok to say as has been said on here, that they think the mother child love is just the same as any other love so being child free doesn't mean they are excluded from that club?

I doubt anyone would go out of their way to be insensitive but why is the wrong only on one side?

Having children or not having children is a personal choice but it doesn't change the facts, the love felt for a child is not the same love one feels for a spouse so if you don't have a child you haven't experienced the same type of love that the majority (obviously there are exceptions) of people feel for their child.

FBaby

Consequently I am unable to comment on whether there is anything special about the bond between parent and child, but if it's all about nurturing and protecting a being that is entirely dependent then cats can serve that function with considerably less hassle and expense (albeit with regular grief, thanks to their relatively short lifespans).

This is as insulting to parents as parents saying that there is no love like that of children (yet not the first to refer to the emotion that goes with protecting a child as somewhat similar to caring for a cat!). Unless of course you were being sarcastic!

Torry_Quine

heartbreak_star wrote: »

I once got told I would never know what real love is because I will never hold my own baby. (Imagine that said with drama and flounce.)

Apparently there's only one kind of love in the world.

Silly woman.

Thankfully, the other people in the room were as hopelessly bemused by this as I was and we just continued chatting about how our lives were going.

HBS x

I have had that said to me which is horrible,not least as I very much wanted to be a mother

happyandcontented wrote: »

Of course, but it is not quite the same. The element of total responsibility because you have brought that child into the world or parented it from an early age adds another/different dimension.

I am not quite sure why that is a contentious statement, but it does appear that those who are childfree/less would rather that it was not said. It is a bond that is not exactly replicated by any other relationship, in my opinion of course.

Again, it is a choice that is very personal and should not be questioned by others.

Of course its contentious. We can't grade love in that way

happyandcontented

Torry_Quine wrote: »

I have had that said to me which is horrible,not least as I very much wanted to be a mother


Of course its contentious. We can't grade love in that way

Then I very much understand why it would be hurtful to you, but not why others who are childfree by choice would feel that way.

I think contentious was the wrong word, unpalatable would be more correct.

We grade love all the time; when we put our spouses before parents, when we say blood is thicker than water, when parents say they would save a child over their spouse if in a life threatening situation. That is grading love, again, it is not nice to address it but that is what we are doing.

Torry_Quine

happyandcontented wrote: »

Then I very much understand why it would be hurtful to you, but not why others who are childfree by choice would feel that way.

I think contentious was the wrong word, unpalatable would be more correct.

We grade love all the time; when we put our spouses before parents, when we say blood is thicker than water, when parents say they would save a child over their spouse if in a life threatening situation. That is grading love, again, it is not nice to address it but that is what we are doing.

'Grading love' is one thing but saying that real.love is only your own child is just wrong.

happyandcontented

Torry_Quine wrote: »

'Grading love' is one thing but saying that real.love is only your own child is just wrong.

It is, if we are lucky enough lots of us have many experiences of real love, but the love felt for a child has another dimension.

Your signature alludes to your love for God being the greatest love, and I think most parents would say they feel like that about their kids, which in no way devalues the love they feel for spouses, God or anyone else they care about.

Lily-Rose_3

Doesn't this mummy/childfree war always go on on message forums, and there are always opposing factions. They are either people thinking they are right and everyone else is wrong, and anyone who doesn't do what they do is a fool, and cannot POSSIBLY be happy. Or they are people who say live and let live, and it's down to personal choice. And there are people who see fit to attack and berate anyone who doesn't make the same life choices as them, whilst coming up with one story after another that suits their agenda.

The fact is that there IS no one-size-fits all. Some parents have a wonderful relationship with their children, and they've had an enormous amount of joy brought to their lives because of them, and some people are genuinely more than happy to not have any.

Then there are some parents who admit their life would not have been such a struggle without kids, and it was harder than they expected, and it did hold them back on things they wanted to to. (Although I believe that that is the exception rather than the rule.) And then we have the childfree who bitterly regretted their choice, and it consumes much of their waking hours, thinking of the children they never had. (Although I believe that this is also the exception rather than the rule.)

Upshot is, no matter how the childfree and the parents say they are antagonised by each other, it's not just being a parent (or not!) that attracts criticism. People get bashed for all sorts of life choices. EG, for renting, and not owning a house, for having an old car, for not going to university, for taking a so-called 'soft degree' at uni, for being overweight, for being flat chested, for being single, for being married, for having only ONE child, for having 2 boys and no girls - (oh what a shame you never had a girl,) for having 2 girls, (oh what a shame you didn't have a boy!)

One colleague of mine a few years ago got attacked by 2 women because her husband had not had a vasectomy! Just because THEIR husbands had had one! 'Why should YOU have to be responsible for the contraception?' they cried 'make HIM take responsibility!' They had had 2 kids, and weren't planning to have any more, but the woman and her husband were only 33!

And I am sure most 'stay at home mums' can come up with a tale or two, of how they have been attacked by family, acquaintances, so-called friends, neighbours, etc, for not working! (Ooooh, *I* wouldn't like to be 'kept' by a man! How can you possibly have any dignity?!'

And because people are talking about things that happened 30-odd years ago, that doesn't mean that they have been harbouring it and dwelling on it all that time, and they can't let it go, and that they were not secure in their life choices. People are only mentioning things because they are relevant to the conversation. Moreover, most people WERE and ARE happy and secure with their life choices; it's other people who weren't and aren't!

I mean are we not meant to mention anything from the past that may have annoyed us? Or upset us? Because this means we have dwelled on it all these years?! Most people will mention something if it's relevant to the conversation, even if it happened many years ago; it doesn't mean it's bothered them all these years though!

If someone says they are being slated for something that I was slated for in the past, then I will probably remember it briefly, and mention my experience. Why wouldn't I? LOL. Doesn't mean I have been dwelling on it for many years, and I think about nothing else! It's just because the subject came up!

Torry_Quine

happyandcontented wrote: »

It is, if we are lucky enough lots of us have many experiences of real love, but the love felt for a child has another dimension.

Your signature alludes to your love for God being the greatest love, and I think most parents would say they feel like that about their kids, which in no way devalues the love they feel for spouses, God or anyone else they care about.

For the last time I said that the love for a child isn't the only 'real ' love and that is what is wrong.

Actually my signature is about God's love for us

happyandcontented

Torry_Quine wrote: »

For the last time I said that the love for a child isn't the only 'real ' love and that is what is wrong.

Actually my signature is about God's love for us

You said my statement was contentitious and I didn't say that, I mentioned another dimension to love.

You also said that you can't grade love and then you agreed with me that in fact we all do this.

I am going to leave this with you now because I don't want to cause any distress.