Need help with saying no to someone while not falling out

mrcow

skintchick wrote: »

Only for the first bit when we have worship. After that the children go out to their groups (like Sunday school only we don;t call it that).

If they were kept in they;d run riot while people were trying to listen to the sermon!

The idea of creche is so that parents can enjoy the sermon without having to look after their children.

No-one would want the kids in the whole service - all the old people would complain for a start!

But would your child run riot? I bet she wouldn't.

I refuse to let my children go into any creche/Sunday school facilities when we're at church as I want them with me. They've always sat perfectly, listen and sing on cue. When they were tiny, they were on my lap and used to bring a small toy. But they were 100% fine.

Just because other people are doing it, it doesn't mean you have to. Pulling your daughter from the creche would remove any leverage they had in terms of trying to make you supervise it.

I'd just do it.

poet123

Brighton_belle wrote: »

The OP and her husband spends hours and hours helping others in the church...does that count for nothing in your book? This is a chance for others to give back a little to them.

The crux of the matter for me is whether all the parents do take a turn on the rota, if they do then imo, regardless of whatever else she does the OP should too. If they don't then she should not feel obligated to do so.

mysk_girl

The brownies by us does have a rota for parents to help. Once per term is requested, which should mean they have one parent helper each week. Obviously if you really can't (new baby, illness etc) they won't force you but it is strongly encouraged. Most parents are happy to help with this minimal amount.

mogchops

silvercar wrote: »

There are exceptions when parents are on site, when the amount of care any child receives is less than 2 hours and when no financial payment is made for the care.

Are you able to link me to something that states that? I would be really interested to see it - genuinely - not sarcastically (lol) as that is not what we have been led to believe!

silvercar

poet123 wrote: »

The crux of the matter for me is whether all the parents do take a turn on the rota, if they do then imo, regardless of whatever else she does the OP should too. If they don't then she should not feel obligated to do so.

But Donna is instigating this rule for the creche when it doesn't apply to other areas, not even the older children.

If they are short of people, this is an ideal opportunity to encourage young people in the community to start giving something back by helping out. There could well be 16-18 year old girls studying childcare who would like to help out. No reason to restrict it to parents.

sassyblue

apesxx wrote: »

If it was me I would just send her a message stating that I am really looking forward to the play date, but as I have already expressed my decision re the crèche I am not willing to talk about it any further and if the conversation is going to come round to this, then I'm very sorry but I will have to cancel x

^^^ THIS ^^^

A text saying 'no' is easier to do than a face to face 'no', make sure you do it.

If you don't this is what you'll have to expect from your meet up..... Donna knows she can persuade you, she's already managed to get an extra years help since you last said no by getting her hubby to ring you, so it's much easier for her to meet you for coffee and twist your arm again than it is to find new people to help. How many hours do you put in already, remind her of this (especially if yours are way more than hers!)

Who suggested the meet up anyway.... Donna? If so, ask yourself why.

You owe her NOTHING, for someone of the church she is nasty for not enquiring after your recovery, she could have at least sent a card!

Do you have caller display for your landline phone? It's invaluable to ignore those who you know are calling to annoy you, like another call from her hubby. Get your hubby on side to expect some comments and be ready to back you up. And you need some stock replies....
'Is that so?'
Really?
Are you sure?
Riiiiiight......

Unless you put your foot down skintchick she is going to pester you, how she reacts is entirely up to her, stay calm and give her no ammunition and DON'T offer to help her find someone else, JUST SAY NO.

silvercar

mogchops wrote: »

Are you able to link me to something that states that? I would be really interested to see it - genuinely - not sarcastically (lol) as that is not what we have been led to believe!

I'm googling around, can't find exactly what I'm looking for but have a look here, particularly point 12.

http://www.salford.gov.uk/d/registration-not-required.pdf

Also point 2 (under 2 hours), point 9 (religious study), point 12 (care provided for the convenience of parents who plan to stay on the premises).

I don't want to distract from the thread, but that is my understanding.

skintchick

Wow! So many responses, thank you everyone.

Just to clear a couple of things up.

REf CRB checks. Everyone who helps at the creche was asked some months ago to do a CRB check. I have no idea if everyone has, but I haven;t done mine yet because I was going to have surgery and knew I'd be off the rota for a while after, and I planned to come off the rota.

I also have a CRB check for my work with BfN, which is for working in the exact same room as where we hold the creche (in the children's centre which is on our church's site, and currently run by the church's charity), so I felt it wasn't urgent.

As for the services and children. We are evangelistic. We have long services of nearly two hours, which start with half an hour of worship then there are notices while the children go out, and then there is over an hour of teaching.

Many people take notes during this. It's not child-friendly at all. Someone likened it to an evening class and that is exactly right.

If my DD were not in the creche she would need to either be upstairs with Oh on those weeks he is doing the older kids, or somewhere else entirely.

It's not appropriate for children to be in that part of our services, unless we are having a family service which is shorter with less teaching.

Someone else said that Donna and Fred don't sound nice. They are our assistant pastor and his wife!! I've had a few issues with leadership recently and the post by WestonDave has really highlighted that for me.

Our leadership has increasingly become domineering and autocractic, and it's something I'm very uncomfortable with, but I've prayed and do feel God wants me in this church, so it's a tough one.

I appreciate that some people think that I should do the creche but that's simply not going to happen any more - it is not where God is calling me, I have too much to focus on to continue with it, and I feel that doing it resentfully is worse than not doing it at all.

God does love a cheerful giver, but that doesn;t mean we have to do everything we're asked and force ourselves to be cheerful about it, it means we should do those things which we can do cheerfully, and I did do creche cheerfully for a year, but now I resent it.

If the church does indeed now have a rule that parents must all be on the children's rotas, then there are a lot of people with older kids who are going to have to start doing something!

The truth is that there is no such rule - Donna and perhaps Fred too have made it up. But we are not a dictatorship and things like that have to be agreed by leadership.

I know the problem with church issues is that unless you "get" church you find it mystifying, and I did hesitate to post on here, but I didn;t want to gossip with other church members about it as I felt it would be undermining of Fred and Donna to do so, and I felt that despite the secular slant on here, there would be some good wisdom. After all, many of the issues are cross-cultural, it's not entirely a church thing.

I'm reading all the replies and taking them all in. Even those I disagree with are helping me clarify why I don't want to do the creche and why I feel it's inappropriate to have this "rule", so it is all very useful, thank you.

poet123

silvercar wrote: »

But Donna is instigating this rule for the creche when it doesn't apply to other areas, not even the older children.

If they are short of people, this is an ideal opportunity to encourage young people in the community to start giving something back by helping out. There could well be 16-18 year old girls studying childcare who would like to help out. No reason to restrict it to parents.

I think it is more usual to have a parent present with pre schoolers than school age children so I can see the distinction.

With regard to having all and sundry help, that may not be what other parents want, they may want more experienced people than 16/18 year olds taking care of their children.

The OP hasn't come back to say whether she knows or has found out if they all do take a turn. It rather sounds as if she thinks that she does enough, and regardless of whether all the other parents are on the rota she shouldn't have to be.

ETA within our church all the young parents who used the creche were on the rota, the ones with older children on the Litany rota, and the older congregation members on the tea/cake/flower rotas. It was a natural order in some ways.

lostinrates

silvercar wrote: »

I'm googling around, can't find exactly what I'm looking for but have a look here, particularly point 12.

http://www.salford.gov.uk/d/registration-not-required.pdf

Also point 2 (under 2 hours), point 9 (religious study), point 12 (care provided for the convenience of parents who plan to stay on the premises).

I don't want to distract from the thread, but that is my understanding.

I just glanced, but what about bigger babies and toddlers? That link says children 3 and over doesn't it?