Need help with saying no to someone while not falling out

Brighton_belle

securityguy wrote: »

People who go to the pub and leave their children with random strangers because they love alcohol more than they love their children are bad. People who go to the church and leave their children with random strangers because they love sermons more than their children are shining moral examples to us all. Aren't we lucky that there are people who have their priorities right, to show the rest of us where we're going wrong?

They aren't left with random strangers - they are left with members of the church who will all have gone through a 'membership course' on joining, attend mid week meetings in small groups in members homes and be known personally through the leadership system and family centred nature of the these sort of churches. Christian parents , as part of being good parents would expect to continue to learn and grow in their faith through teaching and study.
Running down all christians for everything they do weakens any arguement I think. There are decent people who are christians and rubbish ones, just like in other walks of life.

silvercar

securityguy wrote: »

People who go to the pub and leave their children with random strangers because they love alcohol more than they love their children are bad. People who go to the church and leave their children with random strangers because they love sermons more than their children are shining moral examples to us all. Aren't we lucky that there are people who have their priorities right, to show the rest of us where we're going wrong?

If that is your view and your contribution to this thread, you really would be better offering your knowledge on threads where you have a better understanding.

silvercar

securityguy wrote: »

People who go to the pub and leave their children with random strangers because they love alcohol more than they love their children are bad. People who go to the church and leave their children with random strangers because they love sermons more than their children are shining moral examples to us all. Aren't we lucky that there are people who have their priorities right, to show the rest of us where we're going wrong?

More akin to wanting your child to learn the piano so leaving them with a piano teacher who will aid their understanding better than you sitting down and playing the piano with them. Then afterwards you can get together and discuss what they learned in their session.

onlyroz

silvercar wrote: »

More akin to wanting your child to learn the piano so leaving them with a piano teacher who will aid their understanding better than you sitting down and playing the piano with them. Then afterwards you can get together and discuss what they learned in their session.

Not really, because the piano lesson is for the benefit of the child whereas the sermon is for the benefit of the parent.

I take my son to swimming lessons on Saturday because he benefits from them. The rest of the weekend we spend doing things as a family. I go to my own swimming session on a Wednesday night, after the kids have gone to bed, because I don't want one of my own activities to eat into precious family time.

skintchick

Nicki wrote: »

Does your church have elders skinty or is it just run by the pastor and Fred? I'd always take something like this to the elders if it happened to me and just lay out how it was affecting me and ask for their guidance. If Donna has made this up and it hasn't come down from the leadership I am sure they would do what is needed to sort it out.

Are Donna and Fred the same couple who upset you recently on Facebook. If so, is your upset about that influencing how you feel about doing the crèche, or could your response to the Facebook thing be contributing to how they are behaving now? Do you all need to get together and clear the air about everything?

WE do have elders Nicki but I'm not sure that any of this creche stuff has been run past them. I think that if today doesn't go well I will have to go to the elders about it, I'm just rather surprised at the turn it has taken!

They are the same couple, yes, but the creche stuff has been going on for a year. I wanted to come off the rota for some time, so it's not affected by that, I don't have a massive issue with that anyway I was just very upset at the time and so ranted on the appropriate thread to get it out of my system.

I don't think the two are linked for either of us.

skintchick

daisiegg wrote: »

Sorry to take the thread briefly off course but I was raised Catholic and some of the stuff being mentioned is alien to me - what exactly is 'worship' and what does a 'worship leader' do?

You;ve had a really good response to this already but for me being a worship leader means that I spend the week before the Sunday I am leading getting a band together out of our pool of musicians, and praying about what God wants me to do.

I pray over the song choices I make and the scriptures I might read out, and we then meet an hour before service to practice.

during the week I will also talk to my pastor and the person leading the service, and the person speaking (usually all different people) to hear what they are doing and if they have any ideas to offer.

I prepare the song choice and order which takes a couple of hours.

Then on Sunday I lead the band in the music while listening to the Holy Spirit to know what God wants. Songs will change, or be dropped, people will read out Scripture or speak in tongues or bring a prophecy or interpretation of the tongue.

My role is to keep the worship section of the service on God's course, and to have appropriate material prepared.

It's very different to a traditional stand-up-sit-down kind of service.

Nicki

Brighton_belle wrote: »

They aren't left with random strangers - they are left with members of the church who will all have gone through a 'membership course' on joining, attend mid week meetings in small groups in members homes and be known personally through the leadership system and family centred nature of the these sort of churches. Christian parents , as part of being good parents would expect to continue to learn and grow in their faith through teaching and study.
Running down all christians for everything they do weakens any arguement I think. There are decent people who are christians and rubbish ones, just like in other walks of life.

Mmmm. I help out at the creche at our church but am not a formal member, so have never done a membership course, nor am I able to attend home groups more than very occasionally. The pastor and elders do know me by name, but I'd hesitate to say they know a lot about my background or abilities to look after kids (or lack of the same).

However, there is no expectation at our church that everyone who leaves their child in the creche should take a turn helping there. I didn't go on the creche rota until we'd been attending church for about 2 years, during which time 1 (and then 2 when my youngest was born) of my kids used it. I volunteered to do it then as I like spending time with little ones, and my turn on the rota is about once every 3 months. Most of the ladies who do help in creche have older kids, or even grandchildren, though there are also half a dozen mums of kids still using it.

skintchick

Nicki wrote: »

Mmmm. I help out at the creche at our church but am not a formal member, so have never done a membership course, nor am I able to attend home groups more than very occasionally. The pastor and elders do know me by name, but I'd hesitate to say they know a lot about my background or abilities to look after kids (or lack of the same).

However, there is no expectation at our church that everyone who leaves their child in the creche should take a turn helping there. I didn't go on the creche rota until we'd been attending church for about 2 years, during which time 1 (and then 2 when my youngest was born) of my kids used it. I volunteered to do it then as I like spending time with little ones, and my turn on the rota is about once every 3 months. Most of the ladies who do help in creche have older kids, or even grandchildren, though there are also half a dozen mums of kids still using it.

You're still not a random stranger though.

At my church we have about 200 people who come (not all are church members) and I know everyone to some extent, some better than others. I certainly don't feel I'm leaving DD with a random stranger!

KiKi

onlyroz wrote: »

You see, my weekends are precious as it's the time that I get to properly spend time with my family. The idea of going off to do something separate to them on my precious sunday is just baffling.

That's your perspective - but I think it perhaps shows a lack of understanding as well of the 'house' churches or a child being in a 'creche' in this sort of circumstance. In 'house' churches / evangelical church, it tends to be like a pretty large family - everyone knows everyone to some degree or other. You're going somewhere for, say, 1.5 hours as a family. You will be with your kids for the coffee, for the worship, catching up with friends, and your kids will probably be running around the hall like lunatics with the other kids they've been growing up with, their whole life! In terms of what you're doing, it's not unlike going out with a whole load of friends where your kids are playing together or sitting with you - except that perhaps for half an hour they are with other adults, either perhaps playing or learning, whilst you're listening to whoever's speaking or sharing that morning.

Also, your weekends might be precious because of your time, but not everyone's in that position. Plenty of people put their children into nursery during the week when they don't *have* to because of work commitments - but see it as important for their socialisation. And for people who are Christian and church go-ers, it's not just about Sunday morning, it's about your whole life and approach to life, so it's important to spend time with the 'family' that you're in as a church.

JMO, of course.

poet123

That, again, is one perspective of church. We went to church as a family and our children remained with us for the service.