Which way around should it be?

milliebear00001

mountainofdebt wrote: »

I always remember a girl - who wouldn't say boo to a goose - giving a Christmas card to a JW, who promptly put it in the bin.

We all were gob smacked at the rudeness of the JW - even if your religion doesn't do Christmas, I bet your religion does politeness.

I agree though - OP you're going to have mega issues when your little one goes to school as everything gets announced in the play yard - regardless of whether you want it to or not ......and are you really going to put the card your little one makes you in the bin - I would be putting money on no personally.

The only Jehovah's Witness I have ever known used to accept Christmas cards and send a thank you card in return - I thought that was an extremely gracious way of dealing with the dilemma of how to acknowledge the thought behind the sending of a card to her, while not becoming involved in the actual celebrating.

gingin_2

Jinx wrote: »

As an atheist I do celebrate christmas, I celebrate another excuse to get everyone around me that I love and ply them with food, alcohol and pressies.

Hallelujah!

Hub

Lunar_Eclipse wrote: »

I hope to and assume most people think the same. Why do you think that's not possible?

I haven't lied to mine so far and whilst we do have visits from Santa (whom neither of my kids believe is real), I never lied about him. Asked anything directly, from anyone, and I would never lie. There are numerous ways of avoiding the truth without actually lying! Having said that, I have already declared I wouldn't repeat this behaviour (facade about FC) because of the deceit.

You're deluded. It's human nature to lie. From telling a child they'll get square eyes from watching too much tv, to eating all their vegetables will make them grow up big and strong, to telling them all the biscuits have gone. You'll lie hundreds, possibly thousands ofvtimes to your children, just to protect them if nothing else.

jellyhead

mumps wrote: »

I can't believe how hard it is to get an advent calendar with a religious scene on it, I mean why would you want a Ben 10 advent calendar.

My inlaws get them from a stall at their church. I don't know if a christian bookshop would sell them?

Lunar_Eclipse

Hub wrote: »

You're deluded. It's human nature to lie. From telling a child they'll get square eyes from watching too much tv, to eating all their vegetables will make them grow up big and strong, to telling them all the biscuits have gone. You'll lie hundreds, possibly thousands ofvtimes to your children, just to protect them if nothing else.

I couldn't disagree with you more. I don't believe or accept that it's human nature to lie. I can't help but wonder why you believe that actually.

I've never said anything like that to either of my children, and am as sure as I can be that I haven't ever lied to either of them, so I see no reason why that should change. I think honesty is incredibly important. Or rather, I don't see any benefit in lying. It's never worth it in the long term. I don't understand why it would be preferable to lie about biscuits being finished (for example) than to simply explain that I'd rather they ate something healthier/more filling and making a few suggestions for them. Or just let them have the biscuits!

Mostly, I'm gobsmacked that anyone thinks it's normal to lie, especially to one's own children. What message does that send them?

I'd also rather be deluded than think it's normal, and thus justify, lying to my own children on a regular basis (although I accept the above examples are fairly harmless lies.)

mildred1978

mumps wrote: »

. I wish there was a secular celebration so that Christians could celebrate the religious festival separately from the razzle dazzle consumer festival that people call Christmas.

.........

I hope this doesn't seem offensive, I don't mean non Christians shouldn't be able to join in with the celebrations just like I have enjoyed Eid or Diwali or Hanukkah parties. It just feels like what people call Christmas isn't really anything to do with Christmas, I hope that makes sense, I'm not well at the moment and I'm not sure that I am making sense.

It's probably more of a "winter festival" than Christmas without the religion, but people seem to get very offended by that suggestion.

I don't understand AT ALL how "Christmas doesn't have to be religious". How can it not be?

jellyhead

Lunar_Eclipse wrote: »

Whilst we do celebrate Christmas and Father Christmas is a part of it, I wouldn't do the whole 'Santa thing' if I could turn the clock back. However, I also haven't lied to my children about it. We've pretended and played make believe, which I think is why children find the whole experience so magical. In all honesty, my children rationalised FC couldn't possibly exist before their first Xmas at school aged 4 & 5.

Children love to pretend they believe. Mine was 7 when he asked me straight out if father christmas was real - he'd suspected for a couple of years (and he told me straight out at 4 or 5 that he was having none of the tooth fairy, he just didn't believe a word of it). The following year he told me he wished I had lied to him because he WANTED to believe, and now that I'd admitted the truth to him he couldn't pretend to himself. We still tracked santa on NORAD though. He was really pleased that he got a little brother because now he can pretend it's all real for his brother's sake.

I'm sure that many kids of 7 or younger know it can't really be true, but the magic is just so lovely. My youngest still hopes to meet puff the magic dragon one day, and I suspect that I'll be breaking the news about christmas to him when he starts high school - but not all kids are like my youngest, bless his little heart

**curlywurly**

mildred1978 wrote: »

I don't understand AT ALL how "Christmas doesn't have to be religious". How can it not be?

It's not at all religious in our house. We don't have any religion. For us it is a time of year, not one day, where we enjoy the company of friends, colleagues and most importantly family, where generations of our family have created everlasting memories of tradition involving fun, happiness, Father Christmas, presents (from the VERY silly to the much-wished-for), lots of food and treats, a sparkly tree, hopefully snow (alas not often), cards sent to and received from old friends we don't see often, watching old films on TV (plus whatever TV specials they wheel out that year), time off work, and total amazement and glee on the faces of the children.

I will never forget the look on my daughter's face when she first believed in Father Christmas - the finding of the stocking, the amazement of FC knowing exactly what she wanted, the year that FC left a footprint of snow by the fire, the pure joy of seeing the half-eaten carrot and the crumbs of the mince pie... etc etc ... I wouldn't change any of that for the world, and my daughter now 12 has not suffered in any way by believing in a Fairy Story...

Nowadays, aside from the special presents, our Christmas day is a chance to celebrate just being together, and to be thankful for everything we have ... religious or not, I think it's nice to take some time to do that, and for us Christmas is that time. It has absolutely nothing to do with religion for us.

milliebear00001

**curlywurly** wrote: »

It's not at all religious in our house. We don't have any religion. For us it is a time of year, not one day, where we enjoy the company of friends, colleagues and most importantly family, where generations of our family have created everlasting memories of tradition involving fun, happiness, Father Christmas, presents (from the VERY silly to the much-wished-for), lots of food and treats, a sparkly tree, hopefully snow (alas not often), cards sent to and received from old friends we don't see often, watching old films on TV (plus whatever TV specials they wheel out that year), time off work, and total amazement and glee on the faces of the children.

I will never forget the look on my daughter's face when she first believed in Father Christmas - the finding of the stocking, the amazement of FC knowing exactly what she wanted, the year that FC left a footprint of snow by the fire, the pure joy of seeing the half-eaten carrot and the crumbs of the mince pie... etc etc ... I wouldn't change any of that for the world, and my daughter now 12 has not suffered in any way by believing in a Fairy Story...

Nowadays, aside from the special presents, our Christmas day is a chance to celebrate just being together, and to be thankful for everything we have ... religious or not, I think it's nice to take some time to do that, and for us Christmas is that time. It has absolutely nothing to do with religion for us.

Christmas is clearly nothing to do with religious belief for a HUGE number of people in the UK, which is barely Christian anymore anyway in any real sense.

I adore Christmas, but for me, it's the coming together of family, present giving, thinking of others, fun, frolics. good food and rest and relaxation that I love. Nothing to do with God or faith.

Christmas has strong roots in the winter festivals from long before Christianity and many of the symbols of Christmas are not faith related. Perhaps I should start getting my kids to call it 'Winterval' instead!

balletshoes

mildred1978 wrote: »

It's probably more of a "winter festival" than Christmas without the religion, but people seem to get very offended by that suggestion.

I don't understand AT ALL how "Christmas doesn't have to be religious". How can it not be?

dead simple - in this country, Christmas can be anything you want it to be ! To me its nothing to do with religion, its about spoiling my daughter, and enjoying lots of time with my family.