HTC Desire Vodafone 500mb Fair Usage Policy

Seajays

gjchester wrote: »

The amount of data is not the issue, if it was 1GB, 10gb or 100GB people would still claim this is restrictive.

Please look at the last ASA ruling on this finding IN FAVOUR of vodafone. (http://asa.org.uk/Complaints-and-ASA-action/Adjudications/2009/12/Vodafone-Ltd/TF_ADJ_47835.aspx)

There has *ALWAYS* been a fair use policy and it's always been Vodafones right to charge for excessive use. It's also Vodafones right to determine what is excessive use at all times.

First of all the Advertsing Standards Agency (ASA) is a bit of a red herring here. They are purely concerned with how Vodafone advertises services. In fact, regardless of ASAs nonsensical rulings on the word "unlimited" in the past (although for a contrary ruling see here ), you will note that Vodafone have now magically removed all reference to the word "unlimited" on their web site when used to refer to mobile internet. I think that says something in itself does it not?

The crux of the matter in the T&Cs is the definition of the word "excessive". They are relying on their T&Cs to set this charge, but the T&Cs do not state any numerical limits - they just state what would reasonably be considered "excessive".

Saying "that's up to them to determine" is not true - it is a contractual term, so in fact it would be up to a court of law to determine, if this contractual term were to be contested instead of simply accepted by the customer. I believe that I am a "reasonable" person, and cannot see how my normal usage of the phone for what it was designed, and advertised to do could be considered "excessive", so that's where the real battleground lies.

I think that Ofcom ought to be the ones to step in with some clear regulation on this, and maybe Otelo, however they have both shown themselves to be relatively toothless in the past, so I'm not going to hold my breath. I will however be instigating formal complaints with them in due course.

If I do get charged, that's when I'll take this to court, contesting the application of the charge on the basis that my usage is not excessive, and therefore the clause in the T&Cs does not come in to play. It would be interesting to see some real usage statistics for people with the same phone as me for example - not some notional 3% across their entire customer base, which is entirely inappropriate as a comparator given the widely differing capabilities and functionality of "internet ready" phones.

TheLibertine

gjchester wrote: »

Using the term unlimited when it's not is not just vodafone, all telecom co's do it from Vodafone to Virgin Media.

Yes it's dishonest to most people but the ASA have repeatedly rules that unlimited can mean limited o 500mb, the last time was in december.

http://asa.org.uk/Complaints-and-ASA-action/Adjudications/2009/12/Vodafone-Ltd/TF_ADJ_47835.aspx

It's clear from the ajudication the ASA accept people know unlimited means 500mb so they are unlikely to change their minds this time over it.

Ok but read what Vodafone told the ASA in more detail...

Vodafone believed that their approach was consistent with the ASAs position on unlimited claims. They maintained that their fair usage policies were intended to ensure that a small minority of excessive users did not adversely affect the quality and availability of their services for others. For instance, they were concerned that some atypical users might be using their services for purposes that were not permitted, principally for commercial purposes. Consequently, Vodafone believed that their approach was fair and reasonable and that the use of the unlimited claim was not misleading.

Lie, lies and more lies. The point is the ASA need to be looking at this on a phone by phone basis (that was the gist of my complaint to them). Thye obv don't understand the theory because they talk generically, whether the ad refers to a Desire or a ten-yr old phone, I don't think they understand the concept of data usage and instead accept Vodafone's stupid 3pc figure.

N20Y1D

Net counter on my phone is showing that today alone i have used 65mb, i havent downloaded a single thing aside from the cancellation letter, i havent streamed and only really browsed this site and vodafone eforum..

However i didnt switch the phone onto plane mode which i normally do overnight, and when i checked it first thing this morning it was showing 46mb.

I have the facebook widget, email (set to download only 10kb each mail), beautiful widget clock/weather, friend stream and three sky news widgets... i have this morning added engadget.

If possible i would love to leave my phone on the side charging all weekend and just see how much data it consumes without me even touching it, however that isnt possible so i am going to try and get into the habit of resetting the counter at 11pm every evening and seeing how much it consumes between then and 6am.

danielz000

danielz000 wrote: »

Hi All,

A new cancellation letter for you all... Just fill in the blanks:

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/32798431#Comment_32798431

Mine's signed and the cheque is written. Will post it tomorrow by recorded delivery.

Dan

Sent at 8:40. DD cancelled.

N20Y1D

Just looking at the usage vodafone give for 1gb:

You also get a staggering 1GB of data - enough for 10,000 web pages, over 16 hours of streaming video and generally getting the best from your apps.


So by halving that for 500mb it equates to 166 web pages or 16minutes streaming a day.

This is obviously without taking into account usage needed to get the best from you apps.

No wonder they want to start charging people who go over........

N20Y1D

danielz000 wrote: »

Sent at 8:40. DD cancelled.

What did you say when you called up?

KevinM2k_2

I think youve got to be careful cancelling your DD, last thing you want is a CCJ to your name.

Although you could probably get that removed anyway because of this.

danielz000

N20Y1D wrote: »

What did you say when you called up?

**** calling them. They're useless. I just calculated how much I would owe them if I give them 30 days notice and sent a cheque for that much. I posted the new letter previously... The calculations you need to do are at the bottom of the letter.

If I had called them, they'd just tell me I'd have to pay a termination charge or I can't cancel, this way, if they have anything to say, it'll be in writing.

I think youve got to be careful cancelling your DD, last thing you want is a CCJ to your name.

Tell me about it mate... I'm worried about that but **** it. I read another forum post somewhere stating that if there was a contract dispute they can't register a CCJ or something... Hopefully that's right...

kingy_dc2

Hi,

Just received email about my contract which has T&C's "your price plan 2010" dated march 2010 attached. All other T&C's ive seen being talked about are the July 2009 ones Not sure how to upload them here tho? If anyone can help it would be much appreciated.

Just dont know why they dont have these on their website yet...

Cheers

Chris

andywicks

I have just spoken with Karen Jones in customer services regarding the termination request I sent through yesterday following Tom's announcement at 1505. She said that, as it has not been announced when the new charges will be implemented, I am not entitled to terminate my agreement under clause 11.2.c. Now, forgive my naivety, but where in clause 11.2.c does it state that the date of implementation is relevant?

Yesterday I sent an email to Vodafone asking the following

Andy_Wicks_12_May_2010_20:35 wrote:

Can you please confirm whether a new out-of-bundle charging structure is being implemented on 1st June.

and last night I received this response:

Vodafone_13_May_2010_21:40 wrote:

Hello Mr. Wicks,
I confirm that new out-of-bundle charging structure will be implemented from 1st June 2010.
In this service, you will receive texts if you are about to exceed the limit and will be informed about the charges applicable if you exceed the limit.
Mr. Wicks, trust this helps.

Kind regards,
Parin Gajjar
Vodafone Customer Services

Looking at clause 11.2.c:

11.2. You may end this Agreement by writing to us if:
(a ) we don’t do something fundamental that we should have done under this Agreement within 7 days of you asking us in writing;
(b ) we tell you that there will be an increase in the line rental charge by more than the increase in the Retail Prices Index ("RPI", calculated as a percentage) since the last line rental increase and you write to us before the increase takes effect;
(c ) we increase your Charges in the UK which have the effect of increasing your total call and usage charges (based upon your usage in the previous month) by more than 10% and you write to us before the increase takes effect; or
(d ) we change this Agreement to your significant disadvantage including the change or withdrawal of Services (we will tell you if this is the case) and you write to us within one month of us telling you about the change. This does not apply where the change relates to Services which can be cancelled without termination of this Agreement.

1 - Vodafone have announced that they will introduce new charges
2 - The new charges, when applied to my last month's usage would increase my total call and usage charges by more than 10%
3 - I have notified Vodafone before the increase takes effect

Yet they still say that I am not entitled to terminate my agreement??

Andy