HTC Desire Vodafone 500mb Fair Usage Policy

danielz000

kingy_dc2 wrote: »

Hi,

Just received email about my contract which has T&C's "your price plan 2010" dated march 2010 attached. All other T&C's ive seen being talked about are the July 2009 ones Not sure how to upload them here tho? If anyone can help it would be much appreciated.

Just dont know why they dont have these on their website yet...

Cheers

Chris

Save the T&Cs in a txt or doc file and upload it to MegaUpload or Rapidshare... PM me a link and I'll post it on here...

EDIT: The link is http://rapidshare.com/files/387170755/Terms_and_Conditions.pdf.html

danielz000

Yet they still say that I am not entitled to terminate my agreement??

They'll keep saying that too... Why would you expect them to say anything different?

I just cancelled mine, explained why in a letter... and paid them the remainder of my 30 days notice by cheque...

danielz000

KevinM2k wrote: »

I think youve got to be careful cancelling your DD, last thing you want is a CCJ to your name.

Although you could probably get that removed anyway because of this.

Just found this:

You're also sent an Admission Form. Don't ignore this form - send it back within 14 days. If you're late, the CCJ may be issued anyway in a default judgment.

This form is your chance to put your side of the story before the CCJ is decided on.

Your CCJ options

You have 5 options:

..

If you think you owe less than is claimed, send the forms back explaining why. You should pay what you think you owe straight away or ask for time to pay.

..

Dispute the claim If you don't think you owe anything, return the Defence Form to the court, setting out your side of the argument.

...

N20Y1D

I didnt see it posted on here, (i know it was mentioned) so just thought i'd post it incase anyone missed it:

Hi All,

Here are the questions you've asked and their respective answers:

1) Can you send me a link to your fair usage policy which is referred to in the link you provided?

It's right down at the bottom, under "General". It says "All Vodafone services offered free or under unlimited subscription are subject to our Fair Use Policy. If, in the reasonable opinion of Vodafone, your use is excessive, we may ask you to moderate your usage. If, after we have asked you to moderate your usage, you fail to do so, we reserve the right to:

a) charge you for the excessive element of your usage at your price plan's standard rate;

b) throttle your usage; or

c) suspend or terminate your service in accordance with your airtime terms and conditions."

2) Could you also confirm at what rate we will be charged? Is it still £5 per 500mb, and if so, where is this rate written into the contract we agreed?

Yes, it's £5 per 500MB. In the General section of our Terms and Conditions, it's stated that you will be charged if you go over. The rates at which this will be charged are covered here.

3) What is your definition of a month?

Depending on which billing system you're on, it'll be either the first day of the calendar month to the last day, or it'll be a date specified on your bills right the way through to the same date of the next month. My bill for example shows usage charges up to 15th of each month, so my month runs 15th-15th.

4) Are vodafone going to say that the 500mb is a cap and not FUP or unlimited? Can you confirm that this is still a soft-limit, and that the Fair Use Policy will have a limit above 500Mb which use over will be considered abuse?

It's not a cap, as our announcement explains you won't be charged immediately. Instead, we'll notify you of your usage as per the fair usage policy in your Terms and Conditions.

5) Why was I told that going over my 500MB FUP exactly seven times would trigger charging? Is this correct?

This isn't correct. There isn't a predefined number of occasions. If you continuously exceed your data allowance, you will be notified and contacted first and if you choose to continue using data out of bundle you might incur charges.

6) Where are these charges coming from?? Why can't I find my standard rate of charge, is it because you never had one? And now you are deciding to impose it and you are changing my terms and understanding of our agreement? Can you please provide a link to where I can view the "published rates for my price plan"?

I do remember a time a while ago where we had a standard rate of charge for data of £2 per MB, but this hasn't been listed in our Terms and Conditions for a good while. There isn't currently a standard rate published from what I understand, so the situation is as per 2).

KevinM2K, no changes have been made and nobody has been charged yet, so it's not currently possible to request cancellation of your account. With this in mind, we won't be emailing anybody regarding this topic.

Just one last thing, whilst I appreciate your reasons for not being too happy with the change in charge, TheLibertine does make a really good point here about the value provided by our services. I know a lot of you aren't happy and want to leave, but there are many great reasons to stay with Vodafone.

Thanks,

Tom

eForum Team

KevinM2k_2

Funny that isn't it ... i quote:

"KevinM2K, no changes have been made and nobody has been charged yet" then in the next paragraph he writes:

"whilst I appreciate your reasons for not being too happy with the change in charge"

So first paragraph, says no changes are being made, second one says about people not being happy with the change... contradicting him self or what?

N20Y1D

Bitterwallet update:

http://www.bitterwallet.com/vodafones-data-charges-some-answers-but-more-questions/29508#more-29508



We’ve now been in contact with Vodafone over the past day, trying to determine the facts about their new data charges, but we’re struggling to get a completely straight answer. There is, however, very worrying news if you are a Vodafone customer.

Last week Vodafone suggested that new charges for excess data would be automatic; there was no mention of a new service to warn users about excessive usage: “We are planning to introduce Out Of Bundle charging for Pay Monthly customers from 1st June 2010… no Out Of Bundle charges will happen this month but they will take effect from 1st June.”

As a result of this, Vodafone offered to cancel contracts-without-penalty if customers would see an increase in their bill – that post has now been deleted, but you can read the text here – it clearly stated that Vodafone intended to modify the terms of customer contracts; if they do, Vodafone will be in breach of their own contract and Ofcom’s General Conditions for not providing adequate notice.

Then Vodafone appeared to backtrack – the detail about modifying the terms was dropped, and instead Vodafone focussed on the fact they were enforcing the Fair Use Policy that is a standard clause in agreements. We took Vodafone to task, because they failed to answer fundamental questions about the changes, and their customers seemingly agreed; the topic on their forum has now received 1,300 posts in ten days.

Vodafone’s Head of Web Relations, Jakub Hrabovsky has been in touch with Bitterwallet, so here is a selection of the dialogue from our emails:

BW: Vodafone is still talking about making some sort of change to the standard terms and conditions, and by doing so there’s a question over how much notice should have been given to customers. Will there be a change come 1 June?

JH: There will be no pricing changes; we’ve always reserved the right to charge for out of bundle usage since the launch of mobile internet.

BW: The question was about the standard terms, not pricing; will there be a change to standard terms from 1 June?

We posed that final question at 5 o’clock yesterday and are still waiting to hear from Jakob. Next:

BW: Can you please provide a real-life example of a customer who reads and replies to 10,000 emails, reads 8,000 BBC news stories and uses no mobile applications whatsoever?

JH: I can’t point out individual users unfortunately but at the same time don’t want to be evasive. The reason why we quantify the data allowance in this way is that we know that 500Mb or 1GB of data used on mobiles mean very little to our customers. More importantly they want to understand how much they can use their mobile, what it’ll cost them and that the network provides superior experience.

BW: I understand the need to quantify data usage for the sake of the customer, but you haven’t explained why this example fails to recognise the use of applications? Quoting data usages in terms of emails and BBC news stories is utterly meaningless in 2010. Why not an example that states 500MB allows you to watch a certain number of 3 minute YouTube videos, stream X hours of music on Spotify per month and use Facebook for X hours per week?

JH: Not sure why apps aren’t mentioned and you’re right we should look into this.

And finally, Vodafone’s official clarification on what you’ll be charged for ‘excessive use’ from 1 June, and for the rest of your contract:

JH: Nobody will incur any out of bundle charges before being sent an Text alert and contacted by Vodafone first which effectively means that you would have received two months notice before being charged.

BW: If a customer is charged for excessive use in the third consecutive month, how does play out in later months? For example, if a customer doesn’t exceed 500MB in the fourth month, but then exceeds it in month five, will they be charged immediately (since they have exceeded it in the past), or will they be given another month’s grace? There’s no clarification on this.

JH: Once you have been contacted and consulted you may incur charges for out of bundle use at any point.

For customers with the best part of 18 or 24 months left on their contracts, that can hardly be described as a Fair Use Policy; you can can exceed 500MB in two consecutive months just once – after that, if you exceed the threshold just once, Vodafone are happy to charge you. Can that even be considered a Fair Use Policy?

Vodafone only declared that usage above 500MB would be considered ‘excessive’ two days ago – before that the figure was a guide, nothing more, and ‘excessive use’ had no definition – Bitterwallet reader Matt was sent contract details after renewing just last month, and the figure of 500MB wasn’t mentioned. On previous occasions Vodafone staff have suggested the term applies to customers using far greater amounts of data.

Vodafone still hasn’t officially notified customers of the changes yet, except through their forums. When they do, we’ll have more information for you.

CaptainD_2

So they have 18.3 million customers, and this issue affects 3% of them. Thats 549,000 people.

(3% of their customers regularly exceed the limit according to stats which they have provided)

So they look to profit a cool £2.8 million per MONTH from introducing these charges, minimum, at a rate of £5 per user, per month.

Thats nearly £33 million per year they will generate from this little scam.

I'm not adding an extra £5 per month from my wallet to the grand total, they can go and f**k themselves. I agreed to a fixed price of £45 per month all in, which would cover all my useage. Thats it, no more.

danielz000

CaptainD wrote: »

I'm not adding an extra £5 per month from my wallet to the grand total, they can go and f**k themselves. I agreed to a fixed price of £45 per month all in, which would cover all my useage. Thats it, no more.

Cancel then dude! You can share my boat! lol

dank_2

I have just this minute finished speaking to someone from Vodafone after I sent a complaint here: http://campaigns.vodafone.co.uk/complaints/

The chap on the line turned into a bit of stumbling mess. I asked him to raise my data 'cap' to 1Gb, he said he couldn't do that.

He then went on to explain why they were bringing in the new rules, because "3% of users who use the service are having a detrimental affect on the service of others".

I then asked him if he thought that my average of 650mb per month was 'excessive', to which he responded that it wasn't. So then why should I get warnings about my usage? Er...

He said that they (Vodafone) haven't decided how to proceed with the changes, but it was likely that if I went 1mb over the allowance I would get a warning. If I continued, I would then be charged £5.00 for the privilege. I asked him if this would give me room to cancel my contract. "Erm, er..." came the response.

I felt genuinely sorry for him. He didn't have a clue what was going on and seemed as much in the dark as most of us. He did let on that they've had loads of negative comments about the changes. Hardly surprising.

So what next? Wait for the warnings and tell them to shove it? Or try and cancel my contract before 1st June?

mbailey

andywicks wrote: »

I have just spoken with Karen Jones in customer services regarding the termination request I sent through yesterday following Tom's announcement at 1505. She said that, as it has not been announced when the new charges will be implemented, I am not entitled to terminate my agreement under clause 11.2.c. Now, forgive my naivety, but where in clause 11.2.c does it state that the date of implementation is relevant?

Yesterday I sent an email to Vodafone asking the following


and last night I received this response:


Looking at clause 11.2.c:


1 - Vodafone have announced that they will introduce new charges
2 - The new charges, when applied to my last month's usage would increase my total call and usage charges by more than 10%
3 - I have notified Vodafone before the increase takes effect

Yet they still say that I am not entitled to terminate my agreement??

Andy

Do you not have to actually be billed the charges first before you can cancel?

As Tom has pointed out, it could be a 2-3 months after the 1st june start date before they actually charge someone, and only then can you actually terminate your contract?