war with parents - are we being mean

henpecked1

Thank you for all your replies. I am sorry the harsh reality has upset some.

OK, 60 miles was a generalisation, it is in fact my jorney time to work, they are about 48-52 miles according to theaa.co m . I didnt think for a moment the road policing unit would be on this forum.

The fact I left home at 16 stems from the unhappiness of living at home. You see my parents would often fight with each other verbally and physically. I was always a mummy's boy up until i reached 13. My dad realised this early on and I think was alittle jealous. My father would always twist and spin anything that happened to create an argument against me so he could drag mum on his side. I remember at 12 at Xmas being whispered by him "as it is Christmas the war between us is on hold until afterwards".

My dad used to hit me. Until I reached 12 and I threatened to kill him in retaliation I think then he realised I reached adulthood.

I was 10 and living in their 2 bed house when they had my sister. She was in their room for 6 years until I had left, there was never any plan about whether we should have separate bedrooms. I decided at 16 to move out and strike it on my own, I moved in with a girlfriend. I was having secvond thoughts just before I moved out to be told by my mother she was glad I was leaving.

My Dad over the years desperte to have one child on side gave my sister everything. I wasnt jealous because I could see what he was doing. Even now at 20 she doesnt have a job, isnt forced to pay £10 a week board and when she spends £50 on make up and complians she is skint, my father will always say "here here, have a tenner to keep you going" Any parent would surely be setting an example and laying the ground rules, but no. So I watch my sister month after month sat on the sofa wrapped up ina a duvert watching TV each day as a product of what is wrong in that house.

Why did I leave my daughter there? Because I want my daughter to know and love her grandparents. I had stupidly hoped, with the same mentality that cheated on women stay with their partners, or abused wives put up with it , that they would honestly change. Once their GD was bestowed upon them, they would treat it like it was the most precious thing in the world. I saw it with the mother in law and I hoped those feelings of wanting the true best would actually come through.

Yes I have been stupid. I should have realised that they would never change, I realise that now. This was never a set up situation designed to fail and cause a split. I genuinely wanted it to work, I kept reminding them that things were wrong and right up until my old man twisted what I said to suit himself that night, I wanted to maintain a relationship.

The problem with reading posts is that you can take a very critical view and see where people have gone wrong and lash out. I do not need sympathy but my parents have given me one very wise lesson, how not to treat children.

henpecked1

OneWingedAngel wrote: »

You should think yourself lucky henpecked, I never lived with my mum didnt know my Dad til I was 14 neither of them have contact with myself or my daughter on a regular basis despite my efforts. You should be glad yours are there for you and willing to do this for you despite their faults. Perhaps you could offer to help them clean the house since they looked after your little one for you. You can't keep taking from them and give nothing but bad back to them. They're obviously trying to do better. It sounds like nothing would be good enough for you anyway as everytime something is pointed out to you about your own faults you put the blame back onto them! So your sister has been affected by her growing up because she doesn't work and watches TV? I know people who had the perfect life growing up and still do this. Give them a break and offer your support to them. It could be that they are merely having difficulty coping now they are alone and are perhaps depressed. Make some time for them. Take them out for dinner to say Thank you or have them to your house for dinner and to see your daughter.

I have taken them for dinner many a time. They are not people to realise their own faults.

The fact is they promised to do X, lied and did Y. That is where the issue lies.

woody01

But, at the same time, I will point out that children raised in "dirty dog households" are generally healthier - because they develop the natural immunity

What a load of rubbish.

FATBALLZ

You can either have dogs in a house, or you can have babies in it. Not both. It's like drink driving as far as I'm concerned, it will probably be ok, but it's a pointless risk that can be done without.

paddy's_mum

I've thanked your post #73. I understand what you are saying.

However, perhaps you need to recognise that there does come a point where an adult has to use whatever wisdom they have and cannot afford to simply trust. You wanted to believe that your parents would change, and yet experience alone should have told you that it was so unlikely as to be in the realms of the Virtually Impossible.

I think it's your stated willingness to discard all knowledge/experience and instead trust to luck that alienated so many responders in this thread. Which rather begs the question of why would you want a baby/small child to "know" such spiteful, manipulative, filthy people ... one of whom by your own words is known to be violent towards a child!

I accept that you now realise that you were stupid, and to coin a phrase, that you cannot make a silk purse out of a sow's ear. May I end all and any comment by me in this thread with this observation?

Given all that has gone on over so many, many years, if there were such an offence as Criminally Naive, do you think a court and a jury would find you guilty or innocent?

thorsoak

[QUOTE But, at the same time, I will point out that children raised in "dirty dog households" are generally healthier - because they develop the natural immunity
=woody01;30637645]What a load of rubbish.[/QUOTE]

Is it? See http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/life_and_style/health/article3835497.ece

ceridwen

FATBALLZ wrote: »

You can either have dogs in a house, or you can have babies in it. Not both. It's like drink driving as far as I'm concerned, it will probably be ok, but it's a pointless risk that can be done without.

Probably true I would think.

When my parents spent some time looking after young babies whilst having a dog (ie their grandchildren) - they were very aware that the dog was a very placid, good-tempered dog. Even so - they watched out when the dog and babies were together and all they ever noticed was the dog sighing heavily and getting up and moving away when the babies started pulling at him. The dog would have been shut out of the room if he had misbehaved himself at all - but there was never any need to because of how placid he was. Most dogs wouldnt put up with it though I suspect.

ceridwen

Okay - O.P. was naive to trust his parents to the extent he did. Most of us have been naive in our time and most of us want to feel our parents will behave like proper "parents".

I think we can now all accept that O.P. clearly has dysfunctional parents now though and understand why he is now distancing him from them - if a bit belatedly.

ariarnia

FATBALLZ wrote: »

You can either have dogs in a house, or you can have babies in it. Not both. It's like drink driving as far as I'm concerned, it will probably be ok, but it's a pointless risk that can be done without.

I don't know about that. I wouldn't think it pointless to teach a child how to interact with animals and to teach the child some early lessons in discipline and responsibility. We always had dogs every year since before my brother was born and he was 9 years older than me- my step-father used to show dogs at crufts - Beagles and Russian Black Terriers.

We had two rules for pets in our house:

1. Pets Before People - when you get in and your tired or sick or whatever, you have to see to the animal first as you've taken responsibility for the animal and they're dependent on you - this taught me to understand responsibility and obligation, dependence and reliance.

2. Animals are animals and people are people, people are the boss of animals - a fairly basic one, but that to treat animals like people is intrinsically bad for the animal and can confuse it and that this is unfair on the animal. Our dogs never slept on the sofa/beg, never got scraps from the plates (any scraps we put in the food bowls), were disciplined by all family members (which is to say only one family member at any given time but not only ever told of by one making the others soft touches), and knew (not through physical force) that people were dominant. - again I think from a young age this taught me that animals are not substitutes for people and to respect and animal for what it is rather than try to turn it into a child or cuddly toy.

These two rules have set me in good stead when it comes to keeping my temper with animals (don't get angry when an animal does something you don't want, understand why it does it and understand how to teach it not to, understand things from the animals point of view, not by making them human and being angry that they don't react like people), and by extension, computers, plants, random acts of fate, and some people.

And also the approach I've learnt with animals has meant that I've never had a problem handling animals from rats to horses with confidence, I don't expect them to act like humans so I'm not surprised when they don't; and I've never had trouble controlling the behaviour of my own animals unless someone's been interfering ( for example the MIL is spoiling my cat something rotten at the moment because she doesn't have any problem what so ever letting the animal lick her plate clean or demand to go out when ever the cat wants, thus meaning the cat is being demanding, stropy, noisy, and stealing food - things she never did before meeting my MIL)

I don't think dogs are an intrinsic danger to children; dogs that are confused by lack of consistency, or as to the 'pack' hierarchy in the family and that get jealous or play with children unsupervised can be a danger to children until the child is old enough to understand how to treat the dog or if the dog has been taught how to behave with the child.

That is to say our dogs could be left with baby chickens, kittens and babies and they would ignore them completely, they had been trained to do so. I have a picture of 'my' dog, Taz, looking uncomfortable and moving away because a chick was following him round pecking at his fur.

Yes, dogs are a risk factor - but so are having square or rectangular coffee tables, or a pond even with a net. I never had a problem with the dogs, but I do have a scar on my head where I fell and cracked my head when I was about 5 and was running in the lounge.

jackieglasgow

OP you have my every sympathy, I too have been the abused, returning child, seeking approval and love from the parents, and have them let me down over my own children too.

My parents weren't slovenly they way you describe yours, but they did have very different opinions on how to raise children. Although they had been abusive to me in the past, I wanted them to have changed, and wanted them to love my children, which I have no doubt they do. But they let me down once in the way my children were treated, and I have cut them off completely. I will not let my children down, or let anyone else let them down the way my parents didme. Keep away from them, they will never change, you are not being unreasonable, and there is nothing wrong in you giving it "one last chance". But you and they have had it and it didn't work. Give it up as a done deal. Their comments about learning to unlove the baby tells me everything I need to know about what kind of people they are. Draw a line under it, and get on with being the kind of father you never had.