Anyone Child Free By Choice?

mrcow

Pete3278 wrote: »

I'm not the one resorting to ridiculous comparisons and school yard insults now, am I?

Grow up.

Some people are so thin skinned.........[rolls eyes]

Pete3278

mrcow wrote: »

Some people are so thin skinned.........[rolls eyes]

I'd sooner see comments on here about the original subject matter, your petty sniping is boring, irrelevant and detracts from this interesting thread. Is it 'thin-skinned' to dislike being campared to a racist neo-nazi? I think not.

After all, have I made any such comparisons about anyone else here? Actually, have you made any valid points about being CFBC on here? I've certainly not read any....

Uniscots97

the one I find hard to swallow when you are child free by choice is the ones who want to dump their kids on you, thinking you won't mind babysitting..... well sorry I do..... it was their choice to have a child so don't ask anyone else to look after it. A good friend is at her wits end with her sister who had a little boy and now expects my friend to look after him EVERY weekend. The odd one she didn't mind, then it got more and more frequent, to the point she wouldn't turn up at the arranged time to pick him up. My friend had to resort to something quite nasty to shock her sister which was after looking after her nephew for 4 nights in one week (including her working full time, the sister btw doesn't work at all and prefers drinking with the new boyfriend who doesn't like her son..... she was already pregnant when she met this charmer so goodness knows what he was thinking), she called and called her sister and 3 hours late her sister turns up. Now my friend ended up in a lot of trouble with her work as she was meant to be working extra hours, her sister knew this. So once her nephew was picked up she waited till her sister had got home then called and said the next time she did that to her (She lost an extra shift of work as well as her boss had to get someone else last minute), she would phone social work to come and get the child straight away. Now it was drastic yes, and my friend's sister hasn't spoken to her (just nasty messages on facebook) but where do you draw the line? My friend thinks that her sister has realised that having a child wasn't for her..... too late.

SandC

Yes, I had my brother say to me in the past that I should spend more time with my nephew..... now I would always babysit if I'm free, I don't think I've ever said no just cos I didn't feel like it. But I did have to point out to him that quality time with my nephew was not babysitting for him which would involve 1 or 2 hours with him before his bedtime, followed by 6 further hours sitting in their house watching telly waiting for them to come home sozzled. All said in a jocular fashion by the way but he got my point.

Sounds like your friend's sister would be using her whether she was child free or not to be honest. It's a very difficult one because I'm sure she does want to spend time with her neice, just not all weekend, every weekend, which I agree is about her sister being able to enjoy herself and not about aunt/neice bonding.

[Deleted User]

I have experienced this before too. I travelled to London to see my cousin and was really looking forward to catching up with her after a couple of years. However, she had other ideas. She left her two kids with me, thanked me for looking after them and swiftly went away to pamper herself, saying she never gets any time to spend on herself. It wasn't the kids' fault but I did resent having to look after them for over 8 hours without having any say in the matter. My cousin turned up later on, suitably refreshed and once again ready to look after her kids. I understand her priorities have changed since having her kids but she has no time to spend with other members of her family any more, seeing them more as babysitters. Needless to say, I haven't bothered visiting this cousin since.

Uniscots97

It has happened to me too (with family), to the point of the child being left and the doorbell rung! They seemed to think because I was older (then single but now married) that I didn't have a life or friends and sat and twiddled my thumbs. Needless to say the little incident with the child being left on the doorstep was the last, unfortunately I think there's too many people out there unwilling to admit they don't want kids when in fact there's no shame in it.... the shame comes when you bring an innocent life into the world you don't want, can't care for or heaven forbid resent.

[Deleted User]

unixgirluk wrote: »

I think there's too many people out there unwilling to admit they don't want kids when in fact there's no shame in it.... the shame comes when you bring an innocent life into the world you don't want, can't care for or heaven forbid resent.

I wish I could thank you ten times for the above comment! If only more people understood this when they claim child-free people are selfish. In fact, making the decision not to have children is no more selfish than making the decision to have them. Selfishness only comes into the equation when a parent neglects or otherwise puts their own needs above those of the child.

catkins

Deleted_User wrote: »

I wish I could thank you ten times for the above comment! If only more people understood this when they claim child-free people are selfish. In fact, making the decision not to have children is no more selfish than making the decision to have them. Selfishness only comes into the equation when a parent neglects or otherwise puts their own needs above those of the child.

I don't honestly see how choosing not to have children can be called selfish. Having children is selfish really if you think about it because you have a child because you want one - what other reason can there be?

Judging by the amount of people who have told me I will be lonely when I am old and have no one to look after me I would also say quite a few people have children so they will have someone to look after them when they are old!

There were various reasons that me and OH decided not to have children - we do actually both like children a lot. Amongst them were the fact that I was the higher wage earner and would have wanted to give up work for at least 5 years to bring up a child and we could not have afforded it. Also we both feel the planet is overpopulated and did not want to add to it and also both feel this world is pretty horrible and did not want to bring children into it. I cannot see anything selfish about those reasons.

A lot of people have children when they really cannot afford to, when they have nowhere to live, when they live in awful conditions, when they know they may pass on a hereditary disease etc - surely bringing a child into those situations is selfish?

[Deleted User]

catkins wrote: »

I don't honestly see how choosing not to have children can be called selfish. Having children is selfish really if you think about it because you have a child because you want one - what other reason can there be?

Judging by the amount of people who have told me I will be lonely when I am old and have no one to look after me I would also say quite a few people have children so they will have someone to look after them when they are old!

There were various reasons that me and OH decided not to have children - we do actually both like children a lot. Amongst them were the fact that I was the higher wage earner and would have wanted to give up work for at least 5 years to bring up a child and we could not have afforded it. Also we both feel the planet is overpopulated and did not want to add to it and also both feel this world is pretty horrible and did not want to bring children into it. I cannot see anything selfish about those reasons.

A lot of people have children when they really cannot afford to, when they have nowhere to live, when they live in awful conditions, when they know they may pass on a hereditary disease etc - surely bringing a child into those situations is selfish?

I agree entirely. I had this conversation with a friend who has 3 children. He argued that having children forces (most) parents to put another person before themselves, thus the selfish argument. However, I do think that most parents see their children as an extension of themselves or part of themselves and so they wouldn't be so inclined to put someone else's children or another human being's needs above their own, which is selfish. In addition, they have made the CHOICE to have children, when they could have decided not to. Being a parent does not make someone selfless. After all, they have brought a child into a difficult world and, as being human is equated with a lot of pain and suffering, simply being born means that person is going to suffer in their life, which the parents have exposed them to. This is a point that could be argued all day...

I do think the majority of parents see things quite differently to the majority of CF people. For example, overpopulation would not prevent people who eventually become parents from having children, nor would the possibility their children would suffer greatly in their lifetime or have a mental or physical illness. I imagine parents rarely consider the fact that, in all likelihood, their children will at some point in their lives have to suffer the death of their parents, which is one of my reasons for not having children (though admittedly, not the most prominent). People have children for various reasons but they all seem to relate back to 'I': I want them, I don't want to be lonely, I want someone to love me unconditionally etc. So yes, I agree with the previous poster that parents are selfish. I'm not saying they are MORE selfish than people who choose not to have children as ultimately we all do what we want for whatever reason, but they're no less selfish by any means. Perhaps their choice requires them to place the needs of another person before their own which the child-free choice does not, but that is the consequence of bringing a vulnerable person into the world and is not in itself selfless. The day that people recognise that they did not have their children for the children's sake (because who can honestly say this given the above arguments?) and that child-free are no more selfish than they are, will be a joyous one!

Peater

catkins wrote: »

Also we both feel the planet is overpopulated and did not want to add to it and also both feel this world is pretty horrible and did not want to bring children into it. I cannot see anything selfish about those reasons.

Agreed. To elaborate on your points with my views:

People haven't figured out yet that the earth only has a finite level of land and resource. We are all forced to recycle and buy special light bulbs but what's the use if we are still allowed to have as many children as we want? 'Children' are the biggest polluter on the planet. If you don't have a child, you can drive the biggest gas guzzling car you like, throw litter out of the car window and pour the used oil into a river. It still won't go a modicum towards the amount of damage inflicted by 1 baby. But politicians would'nt dare recognise that overpopulation is the real contributor to climate change and act upon it as each little darling is a potenial consumer ready to prop up thier budget spreadsheets.

We (as a global society) are marching blindly towards the apocalypse. At the moment we are busy fighting over oil, but when the lights go off, we will be fighting over basic commodities such as land and food. Don't rest assured that this won't happen for centuries. There is a distinct possibility of this happening within OUR lifetimes, let alone our children's. I certainly would't want any child of mine to have to live through that.

/rant