bit of advice about teenager who's lying and stealing

moggylover

unixgirluk wrote: »

I think the counsellor is a very good idea and I think we'll pursue that. She's never seen me as the enemy as I've always taken time to listen to her but it even infuriates me when she promises me she won't do it again and then does.
I gave her an incentive the last time she got into trouble to stay out of trouble. I said to her if she could get to the summer holidays without trouble, attending every class and get an A in at least one class test I'd take her shopping and give her 50 quid to spend. At the time she said "easy, I can do that no problem. Can we go to jane norman and quiz and then for pizza"? My answer was yes and I got a huge grin and she promised me she'd behave. Then this happens. :mad:

Lots of smaller rewards - on a much shorter time scale - like hourly and daily - lol work - bigger ones with unrealistically longer time periods do not! Best way would have been to say: how about we work towards that treat day by day and together - then award stars or points for every tiny bit of good behaviour - and add them up. Plus, I read that list of things that she had to do and felt totally overwhelmed! You IMPROVE one thing at a time!! Often about 10 things improve all at once without you instantly noticing it - but you give them just ONE aim at a time.

Total equivalent example: oldest son went through a period of getting into trouble at break times at school at 10 - not because he was actually being maliciously rough - but cos he needed to let off steam and was a big lad who knocked other kids over in his enthusiasm - and the school confirmed knocked - not pushed. Suggest to them that they and I did a star for not doing it! Tiny little school of 30 odd pupils btw - but headmaster didn't grasp idea either - ONE star for all 15 breaks in the week! Forget at one break and run without looking that had stuffed the whole week - may as well not bother other days! Other teacher and I took over - 1 star for each of the shorter breaks - and two for the lunch hour at school - and then I gave three a day at home when he came home with his contact book and showed me. They save their stars and get a truly TINY reward for 25 and can then save them further for a SLIGHTLY bigger reward at 50 etc., at school - the rewards can be a simple thing like a rubber or a marble - and even 100 stars only gets them a small drawing pad so nothing ott!

Within two weeks - he was getting 13/14 stars at School and the wonderful infant school teacher made a point of being in the playground so that he did not get falsely accused as the other kids had got into that always blame so and so cos he is a sitting duck mode - he was happier, other kids happier - me and school happier! Infant school teacher was wonderful - she turned him around in so many ways - just by telling him often that he was a good boy - just for minor behaviour like passing a pencil to someone or fetching her something - and would never berate him if he got over-excitable - just look a little dissapointed - and ask him to come and help her with something as he obviously had lots of energy and she was tired/rushed, etc.

It works - but only the ADULTS can make it happen!

moggylover

splishsplash wrote: »

Read it again - I said JUST FOR ONCE and IN THE SPIRIT OF THE DAY...in the context that a successful day out would reap far greater rewards long term than yet another tongue-lashing which leaves everyone feeling 'she had to ruin it, didn't she!' and the little girl feeling 'why should I bother, I can't do anything right'.

I don't for a minute find it acceptable that a child would kick her father at any time, nor do I find it acceptable that a child would ever tell lies, but you have to pick your battles. In the light of the OP, those are a bit further down on the list of priorities for now. Once the bigger stuff is sorted, then start on the other things.

Incidentally, OP, you say several times 'why doesn't she learn?'.... it seems to me she's doing an excellent job of learning to give up before she starts.

If you tackle the bigger things one at a time - most of the other little things just melt away in the process - and one day you realise that they went without you even noticing!

moggylover

unixgirluk wrote: »

The cake thing, I felt so sorry for my godson. I told youngest I'd tell them it fell on the floor but that she'd done wrong etc. She opened her mouth and thought it was funny telling my godson she'd eaten his cake! :eek:
I've reassured her many times I'm here for her, I'm usually the ones that goes and calms her down and each time she moans and says its not fair she wants to be trusted and each time I say to her "if you keep doing things like this why would people want to trust you. You have to show people you can be grown up".

I'm going to try and reintroduce postive behaviour rewards see how that goes but at the moment I just feel it goes in one ear with her and out the other. Sorry I'm ranting, I do love her and I want the best for her but I feel like I'm hitting my head off a brick wall.

Positive reward exercise EXCELLENT IDEA - but remember - small and achievable steps - and smallish but achievable rewards!

moggylover

Oldernotwiser wrote: »

Sorry, I think this whole unconditional love thing is something we've picked up from watching too many American "Oprah" type programmes. It may be true if you've actually given birth to a child but I don't think it's true otherwise. I'm afraid that this isn't a fashionable thing to say but I'm being honest here. Nobody loves someone who behaves badly and I don't think there's any point pretending that this is true.

Love isn't about what you can get or enjoy from someone - love just is! It doesn't count the cost - although it can get lost in the other emotions that are thrown up by bad behaviour!

What we all want to see happen - is for that little girl to become the lovely one she CAN become! Criticism and punishment is not going to work - that has been tried - so love that asks only very small things - a smile, a hug, a hand with a small task - and gives back freely is the next step!

I was fortunate that my son was younger - and that I got help with the situation (and i was totally sceptical at the start - being an older and rather rigid parent myself - spare the rod, etc.) BUT despite the cynical psychological mumbo jumbo knockers the reward, reward, reward system is actually swiftly successful - and the rewards need only be hugs - kisses, and kind words much of the time - especially where the child has been pretty starved of them!

moggylover

unixgirluk wrote: »

I know this is a difficult situation and not easy to solve as every child is different. We asked her if she wanted to watch a DVD we'd got (one both her and her brother wanted to see) and we got a flat no. So we left it at that. we did offer. There's been more texts on her phone this time from one of the so-called friends and lets just say it wasn't pleasant. I know we're in a catch 22 situation with this one but had she had the phone she would have seen the text anyway so we decided to let her see the message. I suppose I was hoping she might see that these people just are using her for their amusement and think its funny that she gets into trouble. Her reaction however was that it couldn't have been her 'pal' that sent it in other words total denial. I did wonder whether she just said this to cover how she's really feeling and I reminded her about my godson's offer for her to go along to the cinema with him and his friends (male and female, so she can meet them. He offered this without prompting even after the cake incident) and told her everything would be ok. I think she knows herself that her so-called friends are setting her up for a fall every single time. But I don't think she'll admit that to us at the moment, maybe after she moves schools and settles in which she says she is really looking forward to.

I think it was unnecessarily cruel to do that! This girl knows her "friends" are rotten - but she feels she has no-one else either! Rubbing salt in the wounds will only make her resentful towards you all.

YOU are the adults here - turn this around - that is the job you signed up for - you have had some very good advice from many of the people on this site - use it! But cruelty will not do it - being coaxed with love and rewards will.

moggylover

unixgirluk wrote: »

Its a catch 22 situation with that too. She says she doesn't want people judging her on past behaviour (fair enough). I've told her I don't like lying and yes I told her it was probably wrong for me to tell my godson a fib about the cake but I told her I was trying to protect her. There have been so many people (roughly her age) have turned their back on her because of her antics I suppose I was trying to give her a second chance. She asked me if my godson would introduce her to people so she would get to meet people in the area where I live then when I set it up she said she couldn't be bothered and moaned she was bored yet quite happily met up with my colleagues daughter I mentioned earlier in the thread. We've told her she can't have it all ways, she can't ask to meet people then refuse then complain she's bored.

I should think she is TERRIFIED of meeting these wonderful people whom she has to live UP to!

Please try to take on board that you will not help by criticising her current "friends" for the reasons posted by SplishSplash. Just pretend to yourself that they no longer exist - and find ways to take up tiny amounts of her time yourself whilst you build her self esteem. She will drop that crowd when she feels confident that she is a nice enough person to DESERVE better friends - and that confidence will have to come from her family standing by her and making her see that she IS a worthwhile and loved person.

moggylover

unixgirluk wrote: »

She was asked three times, including both her Dad and I talking to her calmly and asking her if she'd like to come through and watch the film (she was told what the film was).
As for my godson he's put up with a lot from the youngest (told to us by her brother and he wouldn't make up stories), things that had I been put through at his age I wouldn't have wanted anything to do with the person doing them. Its not that he's soft, I think he genuinely wants her to fit in as he's sees behind the facade of bad behaviour.

Thank God your Godson is a lovely person then! Maybe ask him if he thinks everyone should just let up on the criticism?

One thing that was pointed out at parenting classes > don't be surprised if you find yourself annoyed/disturbed when the bad behaviour actually does improve - you have been used to having a scapegoat to dump all of the c*** in life upon - when that scapegoat is gone - you actually have to face the fact that other things in life may not be so good!

moggylover

Oldernotwiser wrote: »

Having high expectations of people is a good thing; one of the problems in schools today is that many teachers have low expectations of their pupils.

When someone like the OP is doing so many right things and the step daughter is doing so many wrong it's very hard to tell her that SHE has to be the one to change. I find that very unhelpful, having been in a similar situation. Of course there'll be less conflict if the child is never punished and is praised where no praise is warranted but it's not what I think is the right way to bring up a child!

The only time I got the situation in hand was when I accepted the fact that it was my fault that we had gotten there! The OP may be doing some of the right things, some of the time - but the simple fact is that it IS the adults that have to change first.

Not once have I seen any of the really concerned and helpful posters on here suggest no punishment, or unwarranted praise - merely lots of small praises for any small thing that might be done right - like watching tv quietly for half an hour - all that needs is a gentle touch as you go past and an I love you, you know> without qualification of "when you are like this" is even better. Or a small comment about looking lovely when you know she has washed her hair or something - small positives DO bring big rewards.

This child is broken - beating her with a big stick will not mend her!

moggylover

unixgirluk wrote: »

I have already answered that one. We tried last night to get her involved and we'll keep trying. I came on here asking for support and answers.

And you have had lots of really good ones (and a few less than helpful ones) - but I think we need to see you accept that you are asking for too big changes all at one go.

If you give up at each hurdle and go back to criticism - why should she keep trying!

moggylover

Not taking over the thread - as I have been accused of before - just trying to reply to points as I read the whole thing and caught up!

Sorry if that looks like a long lecture at the end - it isn't meant to be - and is not criticism of what you HAVE been doing - just encouragement to double the effort and keep trying.

Good luck - will keep popping in - so keep us all posted - and go and give her a hug for no bloody good reason at all - tell her it is from me - and that I will be wishing her well, if you like. She can even PM me if she likes - sometimes it is easier to just let it all out to someone who you will never have to meet!


Don't be beaten - you can do it - if I can, anyone who wants to can.