Are new cars really as bad as they say?

seatbeltnoob

daveyjp said:

Newer cars really are far better than what they were 40-50 years ago (points, carburettors anyone? Spark plug and valve gap to check regularly to ensure smooth running, WD40 and easy start in the boot), but I'm not sure the modern vehicle is far superior in reliability to those built 30 years ago.  

Lots of modern 'improvements' have caused me grief, in particular DSG gearbox, DPFs.  Now we have oil soaked belts disintegrating, adblue systems etc etc.  The nature of modern manufacturing with huge conglomerates such as Stallantis and VAG having the same components in lots of brands means a fault in one brand can affect many others.

What we do have now is the ability to consider which are the lemons very quickly, avoid brands within the conglomerates if there is an inherent fault, home in on brands which make reliable vehicles and offer good dealership experiences.  Both these are reasons why Toyota and Lexus top the ratings tables.

The thread has taken an anti-EV direction. that was not my intention. I was just asking for ICE cars 20 years ago and now. 

VW had reputation for being bulletproof back in early 2000s, my car is a testament to that. But I will not be buying VW now. The fuel efficiency requirement forced car markers to efficiency out of the drive train, running gear and engine. 

Piston riggs were loosened up to reduce friction on piston travel... which meant some of the wiuld burn through 1L of oil every 600 miles because the piston rings didnt have proper seal. I was eyeing up a touran as my next car, a model 140ps car which has a turbo charger AND supercharger to get a modest 140 bhp... two expensive parts that can fail unexpectedly making them unreliable as family cars. 

Toyota went the right way, keep building the same old tried and tested engine and gearbox, and to meet fuel efficiency requirement, just bolt on a small electric battery pack and motor and creep up the power a little bit so they can meet emissions/ 

WellKnownSid

seatbeltnoob said:

daveyjp said:

Newer cars really are far better than what they were 40-50 years ago (points, carburettors anyone? Spark plug and valve gap to check regularly to ensure smooth running, WD40 and easy start in the boot), but I'm not sure the modern vehicle is far superior in reliability to those built 30 years ago.  

Lots of modern 'improvements' have caused me grief, in particular DSG gearbox, DPFs.  Now we have oil soaked belts disintegrating, adblue systems etc etc.  The nature of modern manufacturing with huge conglomerates such as Stallantis and VAG having the same components in lots of brands means a fault in one brand can affect many others.

What we do have now is the ability to consider which are the lemons very quickly, avoid brands within the conglomerates if there is an inherent fault, home in on brands which make reliable vehicles and offer good dealership experiences.  Both these are reasons why Toyota and Lexus top the ratings tables.

The thread has taken an anti-EV direction. that was not my intention. I was just asking for ICE cars 20 years ago and now. 

VW had reputation for being bulletproof back in early 2000s, my car is a testament to that. But I will not be buying VW now. The fuel efficiency requirement forced car markers to efficiency out of the drive train, running gear and engine. 

Piston riggs were loosened up to reduce friction on piston travel... which meant some of the wiuld burn through 1L of oil every 600 miles because the piston rings didnt have proper seal. I was eyeing up a touran as my next car, a model 140ps car which has a turbo charger AND supercharger to get a modest 140 bhp... two expensive parts that can fail unexpectedly making them unreliable as family cars. 

Toyota went the right way, keep building the same old tried and tested engine and gearbox, and to meet fuel efficiency requirement, just bolt on a small electric battery pack and motor and creep up the power a little bit so they can meet emissions/ 

Toyota also use low tension rings - several generations of hybrids having a huge oil consumption problem due to them. Won’t be covered under Relax.

Use of thin walls from cylinder to water jackets - for faster warm ups - have plagued head gaskets where coolant hadn’t been religiously changed on time and turned acidic and etched through the tiny section.

Arunmor

born_again said:

Porsche, are not a run of the mill car manufacture, that the general public are buying on a daily basis (only in their dreams). You are looking at £60K for the cheapest. 
Which hardly fit's the EV marketplace with people moaning about paying £30K for a EV 

The average price for a new electric vehicle (EV) in the UK is around £50,000, though it can range from the low £20,000s for budget models to over £100,000 for luxury vehicles.

Getting pretty close!