The big fat Electric Vehicle bashing thread.

[Deleted User]

Martyn1981 said:

Plus the Dacia Spring at around 100 miles, and €20k, but not in the UK (yet?)

Another cheap EV with poor safety - 1 star Euro NCAP.

Seems like a lot of manufacturers are scrimping to try to get the price of an EV down - it is a dangerous path to take for the sake of saving a few quid on fuel.

Some of them keep getting recommended on this thread repeatedly without mention of that:

Dacia Spring 1 stars
Renault Zoe - 0 starts
MG5 - not even submitted for testing

I think this should be made really clear when recommending these cars to people reading this thread. There are EV city cars that have achieved 5 stars such as the ID3 or 4 stars for the Fiat 500e / Corsa / Peugeot 208.

Brie

apologies if this has all been gone through already but I haven't read the entire thread.

my problems with getting an EV are:

• initial cost - there are no second hand ones I'm willing to buy due to the issues with the limited life of used batteries and I can't afford a new one.  I looked into this through a work scheme but it was going to cost a huge amount (to me), was going to be 6+ months before it would be delivered and there was no total cost for the purchase as it was a lease to purchase deal with a settlement payment required at the end that wouldn't be known until the initial 3 years were up.

• charging - there are almost no charge points where i live.  there are a couple at the local Tescos but the next ones are a couple of miles away.  there are none where i work and none near there either.  I could of course charge the car at home but would need to get an electrician in to install an outlet. not a huge issue for me but this is not an option for the vast majority of people who live here.  people living in flats or without off road parking have no way to take advantage of the saving of charging at home overnight and are held to ransom by whatever "filling stations" are available near them.  Which as mentioned above are too too few and far between.

I like the idea in general but think that like so many new technologies there will be great leaps forward* in the next few years which will lower prices and make these easier to own.  Until that happens I'll be driving my petrol car.

*I'm reminded of the introduction of calculators when i was at school.  A schoolmate's parents were very keen for him to have one and spent a fortune getting an early scientific model.  It cost hundreds.  I eventually needed one a couple of years later at uni and spent the massive amount of $25 to get a quite simple one.  The same one was being given away with laundry detergent about 6 months later. 

Ibrahim5

Patience is a virtue.

Martyn1981

[Deleted User] said:

Martyn1981 said:

Plus the Dacia Spring at around 100 miles, and €20k, but not in the UK (yet?)

Another cheap EV with poor safety - 1 star Euro NCAP.

Seems like a lot of manufacturers are scrimping to try to get the price of an EV down - it is a dangerous path to take for the sake of saving a few quid on fuel.

Some of them keep getting recommended on this thread repeatedly without mention of that:

Dacia Spring 1 stars
Renault Zoe - 0 starts
MG5 - not even submitted for testing

I think this should be made really clear when recommending these cars to people reading this thread. There are EV city cars that have achieved 5 stars such as the ID3 or 4 stars for the Fiat 500e / Corsa / Peugeot 208.

Hiya. I did mention the ID3 in the para above the one you quoted.

Yes, the NCAP rating for the new Zoe is appalling. The original 2013 model got 5 stars, but the 2021 update got zero. I understand they did remove a side head airbag (I think from the driver), but goes to show how much the safety standards have risen in a decade.

Of note, as I don't think we've mentioned this, EV's seem to do well, if not better for safety. Having the ability to crumple most of the front, because there isn't a large metal engine helps. There was an insurance report a year or two ago and its results were fascinating, even when they compared ICE derived BEVs to the original ICE vehicle, the BEV came out better for injuries.

Again, BEV's ain't cheap, and higher safety costs more, but it's worth considering the extra safety benefits when comparing like for like BEV's to ICEV's.

Herzlos

"Why are there no cheap EVs?"
"Those cheap EVs are too cheap!"

What safety kit is on the 20 year old Focus everyone is usually so keen to compare with? Would it get any stars?

dipsomaniac

What planet are you people on?  'more affordable at £41k'???? The average salary is £31k ish

grumiofoundation

dipsomaniac said:

What planet are you people on?  '£41k more affordable'????

A planet where they know what more means? 

grumiofoundation

Ibrahim5 said:

Patience is a virtue.

Shame no one has it and is willing to wait for a charger if it’s in use then isn’t it? 

dipsomaniac

Curious to know what safety kit is on a new ev compared to a 20 yr old focus

[Deleted User]

Martyn1981 said:

Of note, as I don't think we've mentioned this, EV's seem to do well, if not better for safety. Having the ability to crumple most of the front, because there isn't a large metal engine helps. There was an insurance report a year or two ago and its results were fascinating, even when they compared ICE derived BEVs to the original ICE vehicle, the BEV came out better for injuries.

So most EV's are 4 or 5 stars rating wise, that's not an issue, but I just wanted to highlight that a number of cars that have been repeatedly mentioned as a price related counterpoint to objections to EV's in this thread have a poor safety rating and buyers should be aware of that.

Crumple zones aren't such a big factor in NCAP rating as they used to be. It was a big deal when NCAP first launched, then it moved to other devices that limit injuries such as seats, seat belts, interior design and airbag technologies.

NCAP massively influenced car manufacturers when it was first introduced, ABS and airbags became standard rather than optional, then ESC, EBA became standard and so on.

Now it is about avoiding an accident in the first place which is exactly where we should be at - much better to prevent a crash in the first place and we are getting closer to that with self driving technologies.

Those cheap EV's I mentioned are missing many driving assist technologies because they have been built to a price to make EV's look affordable.

My 8 year old ICE has most of the new NCAP safety assistance devices fitted as an optional extra so they really should be standard now - some people cite these as new fangled things recently introduced to NCAP that have squashed the rating of otherwise safe cars.