Is it time for restaurant tips to stop being added to bills ?

Azari

Voyager2002 said:

mrsmartmoney said:

With eating out becoming more and more expensive, is it not time restaurants stop automatically adding tips, ranging from 10 to 15% now. 

For me it can be awkward to not pay the amount, but it put me off eating out with the recent price rises. So we eat out less and restaurants suffer more.

In Japan they don’t tip at all and the service is excellent. In America they want 20% and Service can be awful. 

So I think a bill should just have a suggested service amount and not include it anymore.

what do you think? 

Essentially this is the Ryanair strategy of appearing to be cheap by advertising a price that does not include essential components of the service being provided.

Ryanair: So that's all booked. You'll be travelling on a Boeing 737-800
Customer: OK
Ryanair: You want wings on that?

Grumpy_chap

misimp said:

unless or until someone can explain why the staff in an upmarket expensive eatery are worth more than  those in a reasonably priced family restaurant

I think there are different skill sets required between a venue offering Silver Service and the local Greasy Jo cafe.

Azari

misimp said:

I would also point out that there is absolutely no way  that I would fall for the old '10% is the norm' ...unless or until someone can explain why the staff in an upmarket expensive eatery are worth more than  those in a reasonably priced family restaurant

They are not worth more, but the more expensive the restaurant, the fewer tables a waiter will be expected to service, thus the number of tips they will receive will be fewer, so it's not unreasonable that each tip is larger.

sheramber

My husband was on a business trip to USA.

One of the bosses of the company he was visiting took a few them out for a meal.

 The credit card slip- remember them?- contained the cost of the meal and a blank space underneath for the customer to add the tip.

Boss duly completed the form , paid , and the party left.

As they walked up the street outside a waiter came running after them.

He held out the credit card slip and told boss that he thought he had made a mistake with the tip.

Boss took the slip, looked at it and crossed out the tip altogether, then turned a walked away.

Not only was a tip expected but  it was expected  to be high enough.

IvanOpinion

The US is a very different marketplace to the UK. Many wait staff literally work for tips (although most get a pittance from their employer).

On our first trip to the US, I remember we got awful service in one restaurant. The person who picked up the tab, paid the exact amount of the bill by credit card and threw 1cent onto the table. The waitress was not happy - I thought she had been over-tipped.

IvanOpinion

Following on to the above, last time I was in America I had to get a taxi from the airport to the hotel. When it came to paying the credit card machine had convenient buttons to add a tip (15%, 18%, 20% 25%) - seriously? The drive took about 10-15 minutes, I put my own bag in and out of the boot, the driver didn't speak a word to me, apart from asking where to, and he charged me $47 ............. and he wanted a tip on top of that? Get real!

I don't tip taxis at home, beyond rounding up to the nearest pound, and the local drivers here at least talk to you and help you with your bags..

misimp

Grumpy_chap said:

misimp said:

unless or until someone can explain why the staff in an upmarket expensive eatery are worth more than  those in a reasonably priced family restaurant

I think there are different skill sets required between a venue offering Silver Service and the local Greasy Jo cafe.

So would you not expect the EMPLOYER to reward these skills accordingly?

I would expect a place charging £50 a head to pay their staff rather more than Greasy Jo

misimp

Azari said:

misimp said:

I would also point out that there is absolutely no way  that I would fall for the old '10% is the norm' ...unless or until someone can explain why the staff in an upmarket expensive eatery are worth more than  those in a reasonably priced family restaurant

They are not worth more, but the more expensive the restaurant, the fewer tables a waiter will be expected to service, thus the number of tips they will receive will be fewer, so it's not unreasonable that each tip is larger.

You are assuming that the staff are paid the same in the expensive restaurant as in Greasy Jo's. OK

So you have two waiters servicing a table in an expensive restaurant, the bill is £400 inc drink, tip is £40. The 2 waiters deal with, say 3 table per shift tips come to £120 (on top of their actual wage)

Waitress at Greasy Jo's serves 6 tables with bill of £50, tip is £5 each - £30

I would suggest that Greasy Jo waitress works harder

Don't follow your logic I'm afraid........unless you agree to tip ALL workers on minimum pay (of which there are many who have far worse jobs than waiting table

Gavin83

Grumpy_chap said:

misimp said:

unless or until someone can explain why the staff in an upmarket expensive eatery are worth more than  those in a reasonably priced family restaurant

I think there are different skill sets required between a venue offering Silver Service and the local Greasy Jo cafe.

I’d assume someone working in silver service has a higher basic rate than someone working in a greasy spoon. Is that not the case? I’d honestly be surprised if someone working in a top end restaurant was on minimum wage.

Gavin83

sheramber said:

My husband was on a business trip to USA.

One of the bosses of the company he was visiting took a few them out for a meal.

 The credit card slip- remember them?- contained the cost of the meal and a blank space underneath for the customer to add the tip.

Boss duly completed the form , paid , and the party left.

As they walked up the street outside a waiter came running after them.

He held out the credit card slip and told boss that he thought he had made a mistake with the tip.

Boss took the slip, looked at it and crossed out the tip altogether, then turned a walked away.

Not only was a tip expected but  it was expected  to be high enough.

We went into a very high end restaurant (was in the top 50 in the World) in New York. Food wasn’t the quality I was expecting and the service was appalling. I ended up getting into quite a heated argument there as I wouldn’t leave a tip.

We did read the the service they give rich customers or food critics was totally different to the service they gave to others. It became apparent it was certainly true.