Yorkshire energy ?

masonic

Phones4Chris said:

masonic said:

Anyone who is reliant on getting their credit balance back from the YE administrators is in a very perilous position indeed. People owed credit balances will not be treated as priority creditors, and so will be at the back of the queue when it comes to dividing up what little money can be raised through liquidation of the company. I would be surprised if unsecured creditors of YE receive a penny of the money owed to them. Secured creditors will likely take a substantial haircut.

So if Ofgem is to be believed that credit balances are always protected, then the only explanation is SP has become responsible for any credit balances owed by YE.

That is a VERY badly ill-informed and phrased post which could cause a number of people to panic. The YE administrators have to get all the final bills produced before any credit is paid back, by whatever the method. And YES it is guaranteed by OFGEM for personal customers as stated in Chino's post just above.

It is not me who is suggesting "If you left YE before SP took you over, the refund will come direct from the YE administrators". I am pointing out the obvious consequences should that have been true. The person who wrote that was ill informed and could cause people to panic if they believe they are reliant on a company that has gone bust to return their credit.

Phones4Chris

masonic said:

Phones4Chris said:

masonic said:

Anyone who is reliant on getting their credit balance back from the YE administrators is in a very perilous position indeed. People owed credit balances will not be treated as priority creditors, and so will be at the back of the queue when it comes to dividing up what little money can be raised through liquidation of the company. I would be surprised if unsecured creditors of YE receive a penny of the money owed to them. Secured creditors will likely take a substantial haircut.

So if Ofgem is to be believed that credit balances are always protected, then the only explanation is SP has become responsible for any credit balances owed by YE.

That is a VERY badly ill-informed and phrased post which could cause a number of people to panic. The YE administrators have to get all the final bills produced before any credit is paid back, by whatever the method. And YES it is guaranteed by OFGEM for personal customers as stated in Chino's post just above.

It is not me who is suggesting "If you left YE before SP took you over, the refund will come direct from the YE administrators". I am pointing out the obvious consequences should that have been true. The person who wrote was ill informed and could cause people to panic if they believe they are reliant on a company that has gone bust to return their credit.

Try reading YE's homepage which I've just quoted in the other thread. Clarity is lacking
Quote "If you’re owed money because your Yorkshire Energy account was in credit, please don’t worry. We’ll ensure any outstanding credit balance is added to your new Scottish Power account or issued to you by cheque.
Current and former customers who are in debit to Yorkshire Energy should wait to hear from Scottish Power or Yorkshire Energy’s administrators who will talk to them about repayment arrangements.”

The point is it is GUARANTEED which is where your phrasing could have raised doubts.
I will add maybe I could have been clearer as well.

masonic

Phones4Chris said:

masonic said:

Phones4Chris said:

masonic said:

Anyone who is reliant on getting their credit balance back from the YE administrators is in a very perilous position indeed. People owed credit balances will not be treated as priority creditors, and so will be at the back of the queue when it comes to dividing up what little money can be raised through liquidation of the company. I would be surprised if unsecured creditors of YE receive a penny of the money owed to them. Secured creditors will likely take a substantial haircut.

So if Ofgem is to be believed that credit balances are always protected, then the only explanation is SP has become responsible for any credit balances owed by YE.

That is a VERY badly ill-informed and phrased post which could cause a number of people to panic. The YE administrators have to get all the final bills produced before any credit is paid back, by whatever the method. And YES it is guaranteed by OFGEM for personal customers as stated in Chino's post just above.

It is not me who is suggesting "If you left YE before SP took you over, the refund will come direct from the YE administrators". I am pointing out the obvious consequences should that have been true. The person who wrote was ill informed and could cause people to panic if they believe they are reliant on a company that has gone bust to return their credit.

Try reading YE's homepage which I've just quoted in the other thread. Clarity is lacking
Quote "If you’re owed money because your Yorkshire Energy account was in credit, please don’t worry. We’ll ensure any outstanding credit balance is added to your new Scottish Power account or issued to you by cheque.
Current and former customers who are in debit to Yorkshire Energy should wait to hear from Scottish Power or Yorkshire Energy’s administrators who will talk to them about repayment arrangements.”

The point is it is GUARANTEED which is where your phrasing could have raised doubts.

This is the post that could have raised doubts, I just took it to its logical conclusion to demonstrate it could not be true:

Phones4Chris said:

Verdigris said:

A little tip for anyone who had already left YE and is waiting for a credit refund. The only way to get access to SP is through the online chat facility. Other routes require an SP account number, which you don't have..........

If you left YE before SP took you over, the refund will come direct from the YE administrators. If you haven't deleted your YE DD then they can refund you direct to your bank account (because they have your bank details, not because it's a DD.)

We're not disagreeing that this post is wrong and credit balances will be paid by SP and those payments are backed by Ofgem.

In any case, I have edited in a warning to my post to make it clear it is not discussing an actual situation anyone will face. Though business customers will be in that unfortunate situation, so let's spare a thought for them.

Phones4Chris

masonic said:

Phones4Chris said:

masonic said:

Phones4Chris said:

masonic said:

Anyone who is reliant on getting their credit balance back from the YE administrators is in a very perilous position indeed. People owed credit balances will not be treated as priority creditors, and so will be at the back of the queue when it comes to dividing up what little money can be raised through liquidation of the company. I would be surprised if unsecured creditors of YE receive a penny of the money owed to them. Secured creditors will likely take a substantial haircut.

So if Ofgem is to be believed that credit balances are always protected, then the only explanation is SP has become responsible for any credit balances owed by YE.

That is a VERY badly ill-informed and phrased post which could cause a number of people to panic. The YE administrators have to get all the final bills produced before any credit is paid back, by whatever the method. And YES it is guaranteed by OFGEM for personal customers as stated in Chino's post just above.

It is not me who is suggesting "If you left YE before SP took you over, the refund will come direct from the YE administrators". I am pointing out the obvious consequences should that have been true. The person who wrote was ill informed and could cause people to panic if they believe they are reliant on a company that has gone bust to return their credit.

Try reading YE's homepage which I've just quoted in the other thread. Clarity is lacking
Quote "If you’re owed money because your Yorkshire Energy account was in credit, please don’t worry. We’ll ensure any outstanding credit balance is added to your new Scottish Power account or issued to you by cheque.
Current and former customers who are in debit to Yorkshire Energy should wait to hear from Scottish Power or Yorkshire Energy’s administrators who will talk to them about repayment arrangements.”

The point is it is GUARANTEED which is where your phrasing could have raised doubts.

This is the post that could have raised doubts, I just took it to its logical conclusion to demonstrate it could not be true:

Phones4Chris said:

Verdigris said:

A little tip for anyone who had already left YE and is waiting for a credit refund. The only way to get access to SP is through the online chat facility. Other routes require an SP account number, which you don't have..........

If you left YE before SP took you over, the refund will come direct from the YE administrators. If you haven't deleted your YE DD then they can refund you direct to your bank account (because they have your bank details, not because it's a DD.)

We're not disagreeing that this post is wrong and credit balances will be paid by SP and those payments are backed by Ofgem.

You are petty nit-picking. YE's homepage LACKS CLARITY on this point and your original post on this made NO MENTION of payment being GUARANTEED by OFGEM. The phrasing of your post COULD also imply that the Administrators will be ignoring people in Credit which is NOT the case. They are professional people with professional qualifications and they have to get final bills completed before any credit can be refunded by whatever channel. And anyone who things that out of ~74,000 YE customers, one or two hassling the administrators is going to speed things up, they are mistaken. It's a case of sit and be patient. SP certainly can't do anything until the YE Administrators have done their bit.

masonic

Phones4Chris said:

You are petty nit-picking.

And you're very aggressive, but let's not fall out over our respective personality traits.

Phones4Chris said:

YE's homepage LACKS CLARITY on this point and your original post on this made NO MENTION of payment being GUARANTEED by OFGEM. The phrasing of your post COULD also imply that the Administrators will be ignoring people in Credit which is NOT the case. They are professional people with professional qualifications and they have to get final bills completed before any credit can be refunded by whatever channel. And anyone who things that out of ~74,000 YE customers, one or two hassling the administrators is going to speed things up, they are mistaken. It's a case of sit and be patient. SP certainly can't do anything until the YE Administrators have done their bit.

SP, as SoLR, has a mechanism by which to recover costs, such as the cost of refunding credit balances, from the industry. YE does not. It is very important that customers know who is responsible for repaying them because they will be wasting their time chasing the wrong company, and SoLRs are known to incorrectly inform some customers (perhaps in error) that they need to deal with the other company. I have added a warning to the start of my post, so there should be no confusion that any non-business customer is reliant on getting money back from an insolvent company with very little in the way of assets and no recourse to extra funds.

You are correct that YE must produce the final bills, and forward that information to SP before any credit will be acknowledged by them.

Verdigris

They are professional people with professional qualifications and they have to get final bills completed before any credit can be refunded by whatever channel.

Not so professional as to let creditors know what's going on.

masonic

Verdigris said:

They are professional people with professional qualifications and they have to get final bills completed before any credit can be refunded by whatever channel.

Not so professional as to let creditors know what's going on.

The pace of administrations is pretty glacial... 6 weeks to produce an initial report, and then progress reports every 6 months. When they move into liquidation the joint administrators become the joint liquidators and reporting is lengthened to once a year. We should consider ourselves fortunate that we aren't creditors of YE.

Phones4Chris

masonic said:

Phones4Chris said:

You are petty nit-picking.

And you're very aggressive, but let's not fall out over our respective personality traits.

Phones4Chris said:

YE's homepage LACKS CLARITY on this point and your original post on this made NO MENTION of payment being GUARANTEED by OFGEM. The phrasing of your post COULD also imply that the Administrators will be ignoring people in Credit which is NOT the case. They are professional people with professional qualifications and they have to get final bills completed before any credit can be refunded by whatever channel. And anyone who things that out of ~74,000 YE customers, one or two hassling the administrators is going to speed things up, they are mistaken. It's a case of sit and be patient. SP certainly can't do anything until the YE Administrators have done their bit.

SP, as SoLR, has a mechanism by which to recover costs, such as the cost of refunding credit balances, from the industry. YE does not. It is very important that customers know who is responsible for repaying them because they will be wasting their time chasing the wrong company, and SoLRs are known to incorrectly inform some customers (perhaps in error) that they need to deal with the other company. I have added a warning to the start of my post, so there should be no confusion that any non-business customer is reliant on getting money back from an insolvent company with very little in the way of assets and no recourse to extra funds.

You are correct that YE must produce the final bills, and forward that information to SP before any credit will be acknowledged by them.

Based on the information on the YE homepage which LACKS CLARITY, my remarks were not incorrect as your edit states. I have not disagreed that SP will ultimately be responsible as SoLR, but it's still unclear by YE's statement where the cheques COULD come from. Endof.

Verdigris

I agree that the YE statement is ambiguous. It could be the administrators or SP paying out. People who have been force migrated have been contacted, it seems discriminatory not to contact other classes of former customer.

masonic

Phones4Chris said:

masonic said:

Phones4Chris said:

You are petty nit-picking.

And you're very aggressive, but let's not fall out over our respective personality traits.

Phones4Chris said:

YE's homepage LACKS CLARITY on this point and your original post on this made NO MENTION of payment being GUARANTEED by OFGEM. The phrasing of your post COULD also imply that the Administrators will be ignoring people in Credit which is NOT the case. They are professional people with professional qualifications and they have to get final bills completed before any credit can be refunded by whatever channel. And anyone who things that out of ~74,000 YE customers, one or two hassling the administrators is going to speed things up, they are mistaken. It's a case of sit and be patient. SP certainly can't do anything until the YE Administrators have done their bit.

SP, as SoLR, has a mechanism by which to recover costs, such as the cost of refunding credit balances, from the industry. YE does not. It is very important that customers know who is responsible for repaying them because they will be wasting their time chasing the wrong company, and SoLRs are known to incorrectly inform some customers (perhaps in error) that they need to deal with the other company. I have added a warning to the start of my post, so there should be no confusion that any non-business customer is reliant on getting money back from an insolvent company with very little in the way of assets and no recourse to extra funds.

You are correct that YE must produce the final bills, and forward that information to SP before any credit will be acknowledged by them.

Based on the information on the YE homepage which LACKS CLARITY, my remarks were not incorrect as your edit states. I have not disagreed that SP will ultimately be responsible as SoLR, but it's still unclear by YE's statement where the cheques could come from. Endof.

This is why it is good to consult other sources, for example Ofgem: https://www.ofgem.gov.uk/consumers/household-gas-and-electricity-guide/extra-help-energy-services/ofgem-safety-net-if-your-energy-supplier-goes-out-business

"I’m in credit to my old supplier. Will I get this money back?
Your new supplier will pay back the outstanding credit you may have..."

"I’m already in the process of switching supplier and it’s not yet complete. Will my switch go through and is my credit balance protected?

You don’t need to worry. If it’s already in progress, you will continue to be moved to the new supplier you have chosen. You should not need to do anything.

When your switch completes and the account with your old supplier is closed, you may be owed money if your account had built up credit with the old supplier. Once the switch is complete your direct debit with your old supplier should be cancelled. However, if this has not happened you may need to cancel the direct debit with your old supplier. We'll look to appoint a supplier who will pay back money owed to you that's outstanding from a closed account."

It is quite clear from reading the misfortunes of those in the Tonik thread, that some in this situation were incorrectly told by SP that they needed to go to Tonik for their credit. It later transpired that this was wrong and that they wasted their time hassling the administrators. So while I agree with you that the information posted by the YE administrators leaves a lot to be desired, it is better to rely on the information provided by Ofgem, and important that people know who to chase.