Am I right to be annoyed, and if so what should I do about it.

littlegreenparrot

I understand your frustration, it must be driving you up the wall. 
The whole 'But you should have asked...told me...' thing is nonsense, it abdicates all responsibility and makes you do the emotional labour. 
Which leaves you with this problem, you either do everything yourself because its easier and it perpetuates itself, or it impacts other people. 

Have you explained to him exactly how it makes you feel? That even though he might not intend to, it makes you feel like he is an extra responsibility, or that he doesn't want to help, or do things with you and the children, or however you want to put it?
My DH sometimes struggles with understanding the impact his behaviour can have on me, because it genuinely doesn't occur to him. He's getting better at it (20 years down the line..) but I also need to spell things out or he absolutely doesn't get it. 

I would also persist with the lists. I'm fascinated to know the explanation as to why he came back without half the stuff on the shopping list. Use that as an example, this clearly didn't work, but we need to find something that will work. What strategy do you suggest? He needs to be involved with the solution or unfortunately nothing will stick. 

I feel for you, it must be hard. 

Rambosmum

Pollycat said:

Aranyani said:

Yes you can!

Of course the OP can.

But won't.

She is enabling his behaviour.

I don't think there is a solution until that changes.

But who loses out? Something like laundry, I can not do his and he loses out. If we go out and I don't ensure the kids stuff is with us, who loses out? The kids. If I leave without him because he isn't ready on time, who loses out? Me.

He does go out with the kids by himself and he often forgets stuff and does manage, often by having to borrow or buy stuff.  but more often than not, we go out as a family. 

How can I stop enabling him without it being me or the kids who lose out? I already don't do his laundry, don't do his shopping, don't send his family cards/ presents, don't organise him for work or times he has the kids alone or if he goes out without us. The only things I do are where it would be me, the kids or a mutual third party who would lose out. 

Rambosmum

Spendless said:

Rambosmum said:

Pollycat said:

Rambosmum said:

Pollycat said:

He's not stepping up because he knows you're there to do it.

So what's the solution?
I don't actually think you are right, I think he's just genuinely inept (his mothers son), but if you are, how do you solve it?

My solution would be to tell him what he's not doing.

Tell him what you expect of him.

Even if you are right (I'm not disputing you aren't - you know him, I don't) do you think that people can't change?

If you are just writing it off as ineptitude, no wonder you're not getting anywhere.

Not quite a similar situation but my ex husband had a habit of taking off his white work shirts with the buttons still fastened but inside out.

After asking him to unbutton them and put them the right way round, I started washing them as he'd left them and ironing them inside out, hanging them like that in his wardrobe.

When he got to the first shirt like that, he was pretty angry.

I pointed out that it was his problem.

He either did as I'd asked or he wash and iron them himself.

He decided it was easier to take off his shirts properly.

As I said in my OP, I have spoken to him about it. I do so every time we go out (prior to), divvying up tasks and setting the expectation. And still...

Unlike laundry I cannot just not do it. I cannot leave to see his parents without him in the car, I cannot go on a day out with stuff the kids need. It isn't him who suffers, it is other people. I already don't do his laundry. but me not doing his laundry only impacts him.

Maybe ask yourself if he forgets to do something what is the worst that can happen? If it's an inconvenience let him find out the hard way. Whilst ever you step in, he doesn't need to think 'what if'. You are the safety net. You are also unlikely to be able to change someone, unless they want to change. You can however change your own reaction.

Yes, I think that is the issue - I don't really care if he inconveniences himself, it's when he inconveniences me and the kids. But I guess it's either inconvenience me at the beginning of the day by me doing it all, or during the day when we discover what ever it is he hasn't done (or miss our train/ plane/ event).

JIL

Does your husband have a very responsible job? 
I ask as he reminds me of a family member, fantastic at his job but could not manage the day to day efforts of childcare and domestics. He was so bad, he had sellotape and pins on his jacket pockets as they had holes in them, when he went to buy new ones, once he got to the til his debit card had expired. He even wore pink shirts as it was easier than white ones.
Its actually a fact that president Obama had to make so many decisions that he insisted his dinner was just made without any choice.
I would be finding an appropriate moment to have a chat to him as to why he isnt pulling his weight. Perhaps he doesn't realise how it affects you?  

Pollycat

Rambosmum said:

But who loses out? Something like laundry, I can not do his and he loses out. If we go out and I don't ensure the kids stuff is with us, who loses out? The kids. If I leave without him because he isn't ready on time, who loses out? Me.

He does go out with the kids by himself and he often forgets stuff and does manage, often by having to borrow or buy stuff.  but more often than not, we go out as a family. 

How can I stop enabling him without it being me or the kids who lose out? I already don't do his laundry, don't do his shopping, don't send his family cards/ presents, don't organise him for work or times he has the kids alone or if he goes out without us. The only things I do are where it would be me, the kids or a mutual third party who would lose out. 

Then maybe learn to put up with it.

You don't seem receptive to other suggestions.

Rambosmum

JIL said:

Does your husband have a very responsible job? 
I ask as he reminds me of a family member, fantastic at his job but could not manage the day to day efforts of childcare and domestics. He was so bad, he had sellotape and pins on his jacket pockets as they had holes in them, when he went to buy new ones, once he got to the til his debit card had expired. He even wore pink shirts as it was easier than white ones.
Its actually a fact that president Obama had to make so many decisions that he insisted his dinner was just made without any choice.
I would be finding an appropriate moment to have a chat to him as to why he isnt pulling his weight. Perhaps he doesn't realise how it affects you?  

Sort of. We both have very responsible jobs, in very different sectors though. We are both the same level of responsibility and have similar type roles (assistant managers, him in IT me in the NHS).

Penguin_

Two choices as far as I can see:
You continue to live like this & suck it up.
You tell him how unhappy & frustrated you are & tell him he needs to sort it out.
 

Rambosmum

littlegreenparrot said:

I understand your frustration, it must be driving you up the wall. 
The whole 'But you should have asked...told me...' thing is nonsense, it abdicates all responsibility and makes you do the emotional labour. 
Which leaves you with this problem, you either do everything yourself because its easier and it perpetuates itself, or it impacts other people. 

Have you explained to him exactly how it makes you feel? That even though he might not intend to, it makes you feel like he is an extra responsibility, or that he doesn't want to help, or do things with you and the children, or however you want to put it?
My DH sometimes struggles with understanding the impact his behaviour can have on me, because it genuinely doesn't occur to him. He's getting better at it (20 years down the line..) but I also need to spell things out or he absolutely doesn't get it. 

I would also persist with the lists. I'm fascinated to know the explanation as to why he came back without half the stuff on the shopping list. Use that as an example, this clearly didn't work, but we need to find something that will work. What strategy do you suggest? He needs to be involved with the solution or unfortunately nothing will stick. 

I feel for you, it must be hard. 

Yes, we've spoke about how it makes me feel. He says he'll try harder but then doesn't. I've spoken to him about today at lunch and he thinks I'm just being unfair with him and saying he doesn't pull his weight - but that isn't what I'm saying, I'm saying he leaves the mental load to me, and appears incapable of forward planning, giving yesterday as an example. He says I'm too strict on schedules but cannot then say why it is fair, or reasonable, to keep others waiting or for us to turn up late to things we have booked at a set time beyond "does it really matter". He hates being kept waiting by others, so I asked if he felt his time was therefore more important that others, he insists that isn't the case. 

I've absolutely loved lockdown, it was so stress free for us as we just didn't have to leave the house!  Heaven. No arguing over stuff like this. 

As for why he came back with an incomplete list,  he says he didn't read i properly, so I sent him out again, but he's quite happy with that, it means he gets some peace! 

Pollycat

Rambosmum said:

Yes, we've spoke about how it makes me feel. He says he'll try harder but then doesn't. I've spoken to him about today at lunch and he thinks I'm just being unfair with him and saying he doesn't pull his weight - but that isn't what I'm saying, I'm saying he leaves the mental load to me, and appears incapable of forward planning, giving yesterday as an example. He says I'm too strict on schedules but cannot then say why it is fair, or reasonable, to keep others waiting or for us to turn up late to things we have booked at a set time beyond "does it really matter". He hates being kept waiting by others, so I asked if he felt his time was therefore more important that others, he insists that isn't the case. 

I've absolutely loved lockdown, it was so stress free for us as we just didn't have to leave the house!  Heaven. No arguing over stuff like this. 

As for why he came back with an incomplete list,  he says he didn't read i properly, so I sent him out again, but he's quite happy with that, it means he gets some peace! 

But it is the case.

To keep people waiting is a clear indication that you see your time as more important than theirs.

It is a trait I dislike intensely.

It's disrespectful.

Penguin_

Rambosmum said:

littlegreenparrot said:

I understand your frustration, it must be driving you up the wall. 
The whole 'But you should have asked...told me...' thing is nonsense, it abdicates all responsibility and makes you do the emotional labour. 
Which leaves you with this problem, you either do everything yourself because its easier and it perpetuates itself, or it impacts other people. 

Have you explained to him exactly how it makes you feel? That even though he might not intend to, it makes you feel like he is an extra responsibility, or that he doesn't want to help, or do things with you and the children, or however you want to put it?
My DH sometimes struggles with understanding the impact his behaviour can have on me, because it genuinely doesn't occur to him. He's getting better at it (20 years down the line..) but I also need to spell things out or he absolutely doesn't get it. 

I would also persist with the lists. I'm fascinated to know the explanation as to why he came back without half the stuff on the shopping list. Use that as an example, this clearly didn't work, but we need to find something that will work. What strategy do you suggest? He needs to be involved with the solution or unfortunately nothing will stick. 

I feel for you, it must be hard. 

Yes, we've spoke about how it makes me feel. He says he'll try harder but then doesn't. I've spoken to him about today at lunch and he thinks I'm just being unfair with him and saying he doesn't pull his weight - but that isn't what I'm saying, I'm saying he leaves the mental load to me, and appears incapable of forward planning, giving yesterday as an example. He says I'm too strict on schedules but cannot then say why it is fair, or reasonable, to keep others waiting or for us to turn up late to things we have booked at a set time beyond "does it really matter". He hates being kept waiting by others, so I asked if he felt his time was therefore more important that others, he insists that isn't the case. 

I've absolutely loved lockdown, it was so stress free for us as we just didn't have to leave the house!  Heaven. No arguing over stuff like this. 

As for why he came back with an incomplete list,  he says he didn't read i properly, so I sent him out again, but he's quite happy with that, it means he gets some peace! 

I'd have gone myself to enjoy the peace!!