Am I right to be annoyed, and if so what should I do about it.

JamoLew

Aranyani said:

JamoLew said:

Aranyani said:

JamoLew said:

Aranyani said:

JamoLew said:

From my viewpoint , what could be happening is:
Mum gets used to doing all these tasks and multi-tasking and finds her way of doing things and a routine
Dad tries to helps, messes up a few times and gets moaned at for not doing things quickly enough/well enough - mum takes over
Dad gets fed up with feeling/being made to feel useless
Dad stops helping 

So dad repeatedly over many years fails to do his fair share, but its always mum's fault?

never said it was Mum's fault, usually both are - but Mums do need to remember that Dad hasn't got the routine/skills that are developed during mat leave etc etc and if they aren't given the opportunity to develop them (or the instruction/encouragement) then many will just "give up"
Dads at fault for taking the easy way out
Mums at fault for "losing patience" and taking over
It's not just with kids that this happens -- many many other facets of relationships,life and even work display these "issues"

I wonder how dad manages to get himself dressed, out of the house and hold down a job if he can't get a 4 year old ready to leave the house or put bags and children into a car. 

Quite easily if he's never been "allowed" to figure it out himself without no interference/comments.

We're not talking about stuff that needs to be 'figured out', these are basic tasks any functioning adult can do easily. 

I disagree - some people are just like this no matter what and are shocking at organising themselves, lets alone others.
I am sure you know someone that is always late (I know loads)
I'm out as you are obviously perfect in everything that you do and can't accept that other people aren't as perfect as you.

Aranyani

JamoLew said:

Aranyani said:

JamoLew said:

Aranyani said:

JamoLew said:

Aranyani said:

JamoLew said:

From my viewpoint , what could be happening is:
Mum gets used to doing all these tasks and multi-tasking and finds her way of doing things and a routine
Dad tries to helps, messes up a few times and gets moaned at for not doing things quickly enough/well enough - mum takes over
Dad gets fed up with feeling/being made to feel useless
Dad stops helping 

So dad repeatedly over many years fails to do his fair share, but its always mum's fault?

never said it was Mum's fault, usually both are - but Mums do need to remember that Dad hasn't got the routine/skills that are developed during mat leave etc etc and if they aren't given the opportunity to develop them (or the instruction/encouragement) then many will just "give up"
Dads at fault for taking the easy way out
Mums at fault for "losing patience" and taking over
It's not just with kids that this happens -- many many other facets of relationships,life and even work display these "issues"

I wonder how dad manages to get himself dressed, out of the house and hold down a job if he can't get a 4 year old ready to leave the house or put bags and children into a car. 

Quite easily if he's never been "allowed" to figure it out himself without no interference/comments.

We're not talking about stuff that needs to be 'figured out', these are basic tasks any functioning adult can do easily. 

I disagree - some people are just like this no matter what and are shocking at organising themselves, lets alone others.
I am sure you know someone that is always late (I know loads)
I'm out as you are obviously perfect in everything that you do and can't accept that other people aren't as perfect as you.

I can certainly put clothes on a child and items into a car.  That's all the OP was asking for on this occasion! 

Its a good job both parents aren't that kind of person, or the children would be seriously neglected!  Funny how often it seems to work out that dad is that type but mum isn't...

Rambosmum

Aranyani said:

Rambosmum said:

Aranyani said:

JamoLew said:

Aranyani said:

JamoLew said:

From my viewpoint , what could be happening is:
Mum gets used to doing all these tasks and multi-tasking and finds her way of doing things and a routine
Dad tries to helps, messes up a few times and gets moaned at for not doing things quickly enough/well enough - mum takes over
Dad gets fed up with feeling/being made to feel useless
Dad stops helping 

So dad repeatedly over many years fails to do his fair share, but its always mum's fault?

never said it was Mum's fault, usually both are - but Mums do need to remember that Dad hasn't got the routine/skills that are developed during mat leave etc etc and if they aren't given the opportunity to develop them (or the instruction/encouragement) then many will just "give up"
Dads at fault for taking the easy way out
Mums at fault for "losing patience" and taking over
It's not just with kids that this happens -- many many other facets of relationships,life and even work display these "issues"

I wonder how dad manages to get himself dressed, out of the house and hold down a job if he can't get a 4 year old ready to leave the house or put bags and children into a car. 

He thankfully has a very flexible job, he often starts later than he has planned in his head - he doesn't have set hours. He is currently working from home but pre-covid, often missed his train. . 

But he is perfectly capable of doing the things that matter to him, and that he feels a sense of responsibility for, right? 

So the difference has to be that this doesn't matter that much to him, and he doesn't see it as his job. 

It very much depends. He is more often than not, late. Regardless of what it is. It isn't that he won't do it (unless he sees it as something that doesn't need to be done by anyone), it's more he won't do it in the required time. this applies to almost everything, buying and sending gifts and cards for his family, going out with his friends etc. The only way he will be on time, is if leaving on time gets him out of doing something he doesn't want to do. 

Aranyani

So he's disrespectful to everybody, not just you?  I'm not sure if that makes it better or worse!

Rambosmum

JamoLew said:

Aranyani said:

JamoLew said:

Aranyani said:

JamoLew said:

Aranyani said:

JamoLew said:

From my viewpoint , what could be happening is:
Mum gets used to doing all these tasks and multi-tasking and finds her way of doing things and a routine
Dad tries to helps, messes up a few times and gets moaned at for not doing things quickly enough/well enough - mum takes over
Dad gets fed up with feeling/being made to feel useless
Dad stops helping 

So dad repeatedly over many years fails to do his fair share, but its always mum's fault?

never said it was Mum's fault, usually both are - but Mums do need to remember that Dad hasn't got the routine/skills that are developed during mat leave etc etc and if they aren't given the opportunity to develop them (or the instruction/encouragement) then many will just "give up"
Dads at fault for taking the easy way out
Mums at fault for "losing patience" and taking over
It's not just with kids that this happens -- many many other facets of relationships,life and even work display these "issues"

I wonder how dad manages to get himself dressed, out of the house and hold down a job if he can't get a 4 year old ready to leave the house or put bags and children into a car. 

Quite easily if he's never been "allowed" to figure it out himself without no interference/comments.

We're not talking about stuff that needs to be 'figured out', these are basic tasks any functioning adult can do easily. 

I disagree - some people are just like this no matter what and are shocking at organising themselves, lets alone others.
I am sure you know someone that is always late (I know loads)
I'm out as you are obviously perfect in everything that you do and can't accept that other people aren't as perfect as you.

Yes, he is bad at organising himself and is always late. But he has had multiple opportunities to figure it out and the problem has got worse, not better.  

Spendless

Rambosmum said:

Spendless said:

Google 'The mental load'
Are any of the jobs given absolutely needed for the journey to go ahead? If not see about them being done in the days prior to going out or the days following.
As your children get older they will become able to do more tasks themselves which in turn will free you up. Eg a teenagers idea of going out is to have a charged up phone though they might have needed to spend several hours choosing their outfit and doing hair/make-up beforehand! 

We've had lots of conversations about mental load over the years. His answer is "just don't do it" which worked pre kids. But now, if I don't do the food shop, the laundry, pay the bills, it isn't just us that suffers. So I do the stuff urgent to me and the kids, but don't remind him about his stuff (leading to an increasingly large parking ticket for him, no clean underwear etc). When it comes to going out for the day, task are just pertinent to the day out, not the rest of the household stuff. 

An example, which has lead to this thread, was yesterday. On Saturday we discussed our plans for Sunday, which were a day out with his parents, organised by him but the detail planned by me (due to time constraints rather than anything else).  We agreed on a packed lunch as food at the location was poor, he headed to the shops and bought stuff for him and I, no consideration as to what the kids would eat (as in insufficient amount of food for 4). Second trip to the shop, came back incomplete. Sunday AM, his lie in day (we take it in turns each weekend day). We agreed on Saturday night a time for him to get up to allow him to get himself and a child ready and then care for the kids whilst I pack the car. He agreed to a slightly earlier get up so he didn't need to make the pack lunch on Saturday night. Sunday, he got up 15 minutes late (no biggy) then took the entire hour to get himself ready (shower and dressed). Arrived downstairs saying "I'll make the pack lunch now", this was 10 minutes after we should have set off. 

Some people are shocking at time management. This can be either sex. I've a female friend who is constantly late and she's aware but doesn't understand it herself why it is so.
Out of interest what would the likely scenario be if you'd swapped the jobs above because 'buying sufficient and suitable food' can be more 'woolly' to some people than pack items 1-6 that are in the hallway into the car.
Some years ago my DH and my Nan used to go grocery shopping for a self catering holiday. Every year they'd fetch half of it back unopened. One year I did the grocery shopping for it instead and meal planned and bought accordingly. My husband didn't stop marvelling at 'how well we'd got through the food' for that year's hol. 

Rambosmum

Spendless said:

Rambosmum said:

Spendless said:

Google 'The mental load'
Are any of the jobs given absolutely needed for the journey to go ahead? If not see about them being done in the days prior to going out or the days following.
As your children get older they will become able to do more tasks themselves which in turn will free you up. Eg a teenagers idea of going out is to have a charged up phone though they might have needed to spend several hours choosing their outfit and doing hair/make-up beforehand! 

We've had lots of conversations about mental load over the years. His answer is "just don't do it" which worked pre kids. But now, if I don't do the food shop, the laundry, pay the bills, it isn't just us that suffers. So I do the stuff urgent to me and the kids, but don't remind him about his stuff (leading to an increasingly large parking ticket for him, no clean underwear etc). When it comes to going out for the day, task are just pertinent to the day out, not the rest of the household stuff. 

An example, which has lead to this thread, was yesterday. On Saturday we discussed our plans for Sunday, which were a day out with his parents, organised by him but the detail planned by me (due to time constraints rather than anything else).  We agreed on a packed lunch as food at the location was poor, he headed to the shops and bought stuff for him and I, no consideration as to what the kids would eat (as in insufficient amount of food for 4). Second trip to the shop, came back incomplete. Sunday AM, his lie in day (we take it in turns each weekend day). We agreed on Saturday night a time for him to get up to allow him to get himself and a child ready and then care for the kids whilst I pack the car. He agreed to a slightly earlier get up so he didn't need to make the pack lunch on Saturday night. Sunday, he got up 15 minutes late (no biggy) then took the entire hour to get himself ready (shower and dressed). Arrived downstairs saying "I'll make the pack lunch now", this was 10 minutes after we should have set off. 

Some people are shocking at time management. This can be either sex. I've a female friend who is constantly late and she's aware but doesn't understand it herself why it is so.
Out of interest what would the likely scenario be if you'd swapped the jobs above because 'buying sufficient and suitable food' can be more 'woolly' to some people than pack items 1-6 that are in the hallway into the car.
Some years ago my DH and my Nan used to go grocery shopping for a self catering holiday. Every year they'd fetch half of it back unopened. One year I did the grocery shopping for it instead and meal planned and bought accordingly. My husband didn't stop marvelling at 'how well we'd got through the food' for that year's hol. 

I see what you are saying, but I sent him with a shopping list, which came back incomplete and with inappropriate quantities for the number of people (plus why should I have to plan the lunch, why can't he think for himself?).

He could pack items 1-6 in to the car (he'd leave insufficient time to do it, but he'd do it), but I would have to get items 1-6 from their present location to the hallway, he wouldn't thin "we need items 1-6, I will find them and pack them in to the car". If I said "pack the car" I'd get the response "with what". If I put "things we need for today", lunch would remain in the fridge and the kids wouldn't have coats or water bottles. The pram would get put in, as would the nappy bag and he would ^probably^ check it had nappies and wipes in it (but no snacks or change of clothes).

Pollycat

He's not stepping up because he knows you're there to do it.

Rambosmum

Pollycat said:

He's not stepping up because he knows you're there to do it.

So what's the solution?
I don't actually think you are right, I think he's just genuinely inept (his mothers son), but if you are, how do you solve it?

Aranyani

Rambosmum said:

Pollycat said:

He's not stepping up because he knows you're there to do it.

So what's the solution?
I don't actually think you are right, I think he's just genuinely inept (his mothers son), but if you are, how do you solve it?

If you think he us just naturally hopeless, aren't you desperately worried about the safety and wellbeing of your children if you were to become ill  or have an accident?