Will Brexit happen?

Fran_Klee

Moby wrote: »

I doubt very much there was a majority to leave the EU without a deal. Even Farage said we'd get a deal during the campaign.

Well we'd have had a far better chance at getting a deal if so many of our duplicitous MP's weren't so determinedly and frequently showing the EU that they would try to overturn the result of the referendum.
Even Farage couldn't have imagined just how deceitful our MP's would be following a leave vote.

prowla

Regarding democracy...

Fran_Klee

Takedap wrote: »

Bringing a loaded gun to a negotiating table can be a very useful technique.
However it's much less effective if the only threat is to shoot yourself in the head just so your opponent gets blood on his shoes.

Tell that to the EU whose member countries are already suffering.
Germany in/out/in recession and EU growth stalling; Italy a complete mess; Poland & Hungary causing problems.
Yup, a no-deal Brexit will help all that no end as all it will do is push the UK away from the EU towards other global partners instead.

Fran_Klee

prowla wrote: »

Regarding democracy...

Amazing really, isn't it?
406 out of 640 MP's have constituencies which voted to leave.
And even higher proportion agreed to implement Article 50.
Yet in three years the deceitful bunch have ignored the will of their constituents completely and even now attempt to deny the democratic referendum held in 2016.

These MP's would do well to consider their future carefully before proceeding any further.

Moby

prowla wrote: »

Regarding democracy...

What’s amazing is that people don't realise how much they're being lied to. Boris is saying he's getting close to a deal. Barnier says the backstop not going to go. I hardly think the EU will betray Ireland........ So where is this deal?

Democracy didn't end in 2016 and an advisory referendum which was highly contentious and fraught with lies is no basis to plan the future of your country. Also a parliamentary based democracy should be allowed to debate the future of this country without fear. I have faith the next generation will change the mood and direction of this debate.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-latest-no-deal-vote-michael-gove-boris-johnson-a9087261.html

Gove is basically saying the Govmt is prepared to ignore the law.:eek:

They open their mouths and they lie.

Spidernick

adindas wrote: »

[FONT=&quot]Just to remind, in the past discussion there are reasonable number of remoaners keep saying that UK could not effort (sic) the no-deal Brexit. But now changing 180 direction criticizing the suspension of the parliament which could be seen that UK is determined to exit EU without the deal if EU does not want to change the current controversial WA. Also, it is senseless argument because if Ireland which will be in much worse situation could take it, let alone UK which is much better prepared than Ireland.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]
[/FONT][FONT=&quot]Keep in mind why it is absolutely the right decision for a no-deal Brexit if EU does not want to change their stance about the WA and Irish back stop .[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]- It would mean the UK will become a vassal state subject to rulings from the ECJ. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]- It would hand over trade policy with no democratic accountability. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]- The UK would become the EU cash cow give some £30bn of taxpayers’ money without getting any agreement over the long-term trading relationship. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]- All of that without UK having any voice or any right to influence the decision. it is by far worst negotiation ever in the history.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]- The current contravesial (sic) WA have been voted down three times by [/FONT][FONT=&quot][FONT=&quot]the parliment [/FONT][/FONT]

So in no deal brexit blame the EU not the UK.

If his effort is successful Boris might be remembered and written in the history as a hero who prevent this country to become a vassal state. TM is enterily (sic) the opposite. There is already evindece (sic) to this as she has been voted as the worst PM.

[FONT=&quot]There might still people who are not awere (sic) of the back ground of those hardliners, who currenlty (sic) some of them preventing a no-deal Brexit. They are the people who voted to trigger article 50 where the chance to reverse Brexit is on their hand [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/article-50-parliament-mps-vote-brexit-theresa-may-eu-negotiations-labour-conservative-how-voted-a7558291.html[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]A few to name :[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Heidi Allen (Conservative - South Cambridgeshire)[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Anna Soubry (Conservative - Broxtowe)[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Mr Chuka Umunna (Labour - Streatham) [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Mr Philip Hammond (Conservative - Runnymede and Weybridge) [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Yvette Cooper (Labour - Normanton, Pontefract and Castleford)[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Jeremy Corbyn (Labour - Islington North) [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Mr Dominic Grieve (Conservative - Beaconsfield) [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Mr George Osborne (Conservative - Tatton) [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Mr David Gauke (Conservative - South West Hertfordshire)[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Keir Starmer (Labour - Holborn and St Pancras) [/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]If you remove of the threat of no-deal what leverage left for UK to negotiate???????[/FONT]

Serious question: Do you seriously believe this tosh, or are you just trying to get a reaction?

Given the multiple grammatical errors (in addition to the factual ones) it reads as you typing this out in a rage without even bothering to check it, so you probably do sincerely believe this. Oh dear!

adindas

Spidernick wrote: »

Serious question: Do you seriously believe this tosh, or are you just trying to get a reaction?

Given the multiple grammatical errors (in addition to the factual ones) it reads as you typing this out in a rage without even bothering to check it, so you probably do sincerely believe this. Oh dear!

[FONT=&quot]Yes. And your Links, Facts, Arguments??????????[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Do you correct people typing, Grammatical errors on the forum?? If yes please do it right now?[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Are you getting upset because you do not have anything to argue, to present against what I have been saying??[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]And I do not need your attention. So please free to ignore it ...[/FONT]

Takedap

Spidernick wrote: »

Serious question: Do you seriously believe this tosh, or are you just trying to get a reaction?

Given the multiple grammatical errors (in addition to the factual ones) it reads as you typing this out in a rage without even bothering to check it, so you probably do sincerely believe this. Oh dear!

Careful Mate. Your name will end up on his list.........

lvader

Spidernick wrote: »

Serious question: Do you seriously believe this tosh, or are you just trying to get a reaction?

Given the multiple grammatical errors (in addition to the factual ones) it reads as you typing this out in a rage without even bothering to check it, so you probably do sincerely believe this. Oh dear!

The gist of what he is saying is pretty much correct. The negotiated deal makes zero sense which is why it has been voted down in parliament. It keeps all the negatives of staying in the EU without any of the positives of true independence. The EU also knows it's a bad deal and conducted negotiations from the basis that that they believed they could convince the UK to either withdraw the withdrawal bill or better still agree to the terms being provided. It is also in their interest to keep allowing extensions even though they said they wouldn't allow it initially.

It wouldn't be so bad if people on the remain side could be a bit more honest and actually push for the cancelling of Brexit as soon as possible.

To me the only viable options now are no deal Brexit or no Brexit and delaying either of these just makes things worse.

Fran_Klee

Spidernick wrote: »

Serious question: Do you seriously believe this tosh, or are you just trying to get a reaction?

Given the multiple grammatical errors (in addition to the factual ones) it reads as you typing this out in a rage without even bothering to check it, so you probably do sincerely believe this. Oh dear!

I'm not going to use the "R" word but honestly, picking on a poster's grammar when it is patently obvious that English is probably not that poster's first language really isn't very nice of you if I am to be polite.
How about you play the ball, not the man so to speak?

That poster makes some very valid points and it's not difficult to determine what these points are, despite the suggestion of you and others; for example the WA does in effect render the UK a vassal state and this has been covered many times both in these forums and in our media.

There is also the very good point that all those MP's who voted to implement Article 50 must indeed be aware of the possibility of a backlash when despite their vote they are doing no more than frustrating Brexit.
This applies even more to those MP's whose constituents voted for Brexit; in fact for many their days as an MP are probably already numbered.

How about you comment on those very valid points rather than upon the style of posting them?