Land Registry questions

Land_Registry

davemorton said:

@Land_Registry
Home owned tenants in common, (myself owning the larger share.)
Ex-partner has passed away.
Now need to sell the home, but letters of administration have not come through yet. 
The ex-partners family are very hostile and will not communicate, do not even know if they have applied for letters of administration yet as their solicitor is refusing to reply to my solicitor. 
This is obviously delaying the sale, infact brought it to a complete stop as my solicitor says they can not continue with the sale until the letters of administration are received. 
Is this correct as I am getting conflicting advice. 
I have also been told from another source that the sale could still go again so long as 2 trustees were appointed.
Are you able to advise please?

The legal ownership doesn’t form part of the deceased’s estate so letters of A (or probate) are not required to deal with the property. 

The legal ownership has passed to you to deal with

If as TIC there’s a form A restriction on the register then you can’t sell on your own but you can appoint a Co trustee and together sell 
See PG 21 section 6 for options 
https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/using-transfer-forms-for-less-straightforward-transactions
Once sold you both have a responsibility re the deceased’s beneficial share, namely their part of the purchase monies 

nic_c

@Land_Registry

My wife was the executor of her mother's will which stated that the house go to her grandson. Probate was completed a decade ago and the solicitors involved transferred the deeds to my wife as executor.

We now want to transfer the whole of the deeds to her son (i.e. her mothers grandson as specified in the will) but would rather not involve a solicitor (partly because the previous ones were useless, and partly because no money is changing hands, we just now want the deeds to be in the rightful name).

Would this be a case of using TR1 form, or another? How would you put a value or could you put £0. The land Registry website seems to have contradictory advice.

Land_Registry

nic_c said:

@Land_Registry

My wife was the executor of her mother's will which stated that the house go to her grandson. Probate was completed a decade ago and the solicitors involved transferred the deeds to my wife as executor.

We now want to transfer the whole of the deeds to her son (i.e. her mothers grandson as specified in the will) but would rather not involve a solicitor (partly because the previous ones were useless, and partly because no money is changing hands, we just now want the deeds to be in the rightful name).

Would this be a case of using TR1 form, or another? How would you put a value or could you put £0. The land Registry website seems to have contradictory advice.

If she’s registered as the proprietor then she can transfer it using forms AP1, TR1 and ID1/ID3 as appropriate 
https://www.gov.uk/registering-land-or-property-with-land-registry/transfer-ownership-of-your-property
I suspect the contradictory advice you are finding is under guidance on what to do when a property owner dies and the above. In your case the former has already happened when it was transferred to your wife. As a result the transfer now is not linked to the death in registration terms but a transfer from one person to another. 

Millsandovis

Looking for some guidance, I’m looking to get a Form A restriction removed from my property after both my parents passed away. I am now sole owner after completing form DJP. They held the property as TIC and my mum passed away in 1999 without a will and no money etc so probate was not needed. My dad then passed away in 2021 and we were tenants in common together. He had a will and I was his sole beneficiary and executor so everything passed to me automatically. I am now looking to sell but after doing some research online it appears I need to explain what has happened to their beneficial interest in the property as I don’t have anyone to name as a trustee to overreach & don’t particularly want to do this. After looking at form ST5 & RX3 I am a bit confused about the evidence that is needed to support my claim. Is simply saying I was my mum’s only child & due to intestacy I am the sole beneficiary enough?while also sending in a copy of my dad’s will along with both of their death certificates. Does it have to be worded a particular way to satisfy the requirements? I have no other evidence in regards to my mum due to no probate/will other than being her only child and sole surviving beneficiary + I’m also sole surviving tenant now. Thanks in advance! 

Land_Registry

Millsandovis said:

Looking for some guidance, I’m looking to get a Form A restriction removed from my property after both my parents passed away. I am now sole owner after completing form DJP. They held the property as TIC and my mum passed away in 1999 without a will and no money etc so probate was not needed. My dad then passed away in 2021 and we were tenants in common together. He had a will and I was his sole beneficiary and executor so everything passed to me automatically. I am now looking to sell but after doing some research online it appears I need to explain what has happened to their beneficial interest in the property as I don’t have anyone to name as a trustee to overreach & don’t particularly want to do this. After looking at form ST5 & RX3 I am a bit confused about the evidence that is needed to support my claim. Is simply saying I was my mum’s only child & due to intestacy I am the sole beneficiary enough?while also sending in a copy of my dad’s will along with both of their death certificates. Does it have to be worded a particular way to satisfy the requirements? I have no other evidence in regards to my mum due to no probate/will other than being her only child and sole surviving beneficiary + I’m also sole surviving tenant now. Thanks in advance! 

Form RX3 is required plus form ST5 and the latter has to confirm the facts that have occurred that make you the sole beneficial owner 
See PG 6 section 7 as reading your post suggests you and your late Dad are the joint registered owners plus a form A restriction 
https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/devolution-on-the-death-of-a-registered-proprietor

Millsandovis

Land_Registry said:

Millsandovis said:

Looking for some guidance, I’m looking to get a Form A restriction removed from my property after both my parents passed away. I am now sole owner after completing form DJP. They held the property as TIC and my mum passed away in 1999 without a will and no money etc so probate was not needed. My dad then passed away in 2021 and we were tenants in common together. He had a will and I was his sole beneficiary and executor so everything passed to me automatically. I am now looking to sell but after doing some research online it appears I need to explain what has happened to their beneficial interest in the property as I don’t have anyone to name as a trustee to overreach & don’t particularly want to do this. After looking at form ST5 & RX3 I am a bit confused about the evidence that is needed to support my claim. Is simply saying I was my mum’s only child & due to intestacy I am the sole beneficiary enough?while also sending in a copy of my dad’s will along with both of their death certificates. Does it have to be worded a particular way to satisfy the requirements? I have no other evidence in regards to my mum due to no probate/will other than being her only child and sole surviving beneficiary + I’m also sole surviving tenant now. Thanks in advance! 

Form RX3 is required plus form ST5 and the latter has to confirm the facts that have occurred that make you the sole beneficial owner 
See PG 6 section 7 as reading your post suggests you and your late Dad are the joint registered owners plus a form A restriction 

Thanks for response! At this point I’m the sole owner after my dad was taken off after his death. Sole registered owner with the Form A Restriction in place. There just remains my mum’s beneficial interest from when she died 20 odd years ago. Will the two forms with facts laid out be enough to explain why my parents beneficial interest has now come to an end so the form A restriction is no longer needed as I am the sole owner and no one else holds a beneficial interest in the property? I don’t have any probate as my mother’s estate did not warrant it back then and wouldn’t even know where to begin to start that process now 

Land_Registry

Millsandovis said:

Land_Registry said:

Millsandovis said:

Looking for some guidance, I’m looking to get a Form A restriction removed from my property after both my parents passed away. I am now sole owner after completing form DJP. They held the property as TIC and my mum passed away in 1999 without a will and no money etc so probate was not needed. My dad then passed away in 2021 and we were tenants in common together. He had a will and I was his sole beneficiary and executor so everything passed to me automatically. I am now looking to sell but after doing some research online it appears I need to explain what has happened to their beneficial interest in the property as I don’t have anyone to name as a trustee to overreach & don’t particularly want to do this. After looking at form ST5 & RX3 I am a bit confused about the evidence that is needed to support my claim. Is simply saying I was my mum’s only child & due to intestacy I am the sole beneficiary enough?while also sending in a copy of my dad’s will along with both of their death certificates. Does it have to be worded a particular way to satisfy the requirements? I have no other evidence in regards to my mum due to no probate/will other than being her only child and sole surviving beneficiary + I’m also sole surviving tenant now. Thanks in advance! 

Form RX3 is required plus form ST5 and the latter has to confirm the facts that have occurred that make you the sole beneficial owner 
See PG 6 section 7 as reading your post suggests you and your late Dad are the joint registered owners plus a form A restriction 

Thanks for response! At this point I’m the sole owner after my dad was taken off after his death. Sole registered owner with the Form A Restriction in place. There just remains my mum’s beneficial interest from when she died 20 odd years ago. Will the two forms with facts laid out be enough to explain why my parents beneficial interest has now come to an end so the form A restriction is no longer needed as I am the sole owner and no one else holds a beneficial interest in the property? I don’t have any probate as my mother’s estate did not warrant it back then and wouldn’t even know where to begin to start that process now 

Generally yes - probate/death certificate aren’t needed as register already updated re legal ownership as a result of Dad passing. We don’t deal with wills so very rarely do we ask for them 
The key is the facts re the beneficial interests and how they’ve been dealt with and then passed on to you 
Don't over think things in trying to provide extra and unnecessary facts. The PG explains what’s needed in bullet form but if o things don’t apply in your cases leave them out. Focus on the facts re your specific circumstances and then include them in the ST5

Millsandovis

Thanks so much! You provide a valuable service answering people’s questions on here. This is the final hurdle in terms of dealing with everything so can often feel more stressful than is needed. Thanks again. 

Land_Registry

Millsandovis said:

Thanks so much! You provide a valuable service answering people’s questions on here. This is the final hurdle in terms of dealing with everything so can often feel more stressful than is needed. Thanks again. 

Thank you. Such things can be confusing and stressful as they are routine and often involve far more than expected. 

The intricacies involved in wills/trusts and legal/beneficial ownerships can be tricky to navigate. But it reads as if you have all the information you need so it’s a case of translating that into the key facts as per the PG 6 guidance. 

Millsandovis

Thanks! Just another scenario, if for example it hadn’t been dealt with after the death of the first TIC, would it need explaining what happened to the beneficial interest in the interim of a beneficiary becoming an adult? Say for example the first person died intestate and first beneficiary was an infant child, legal ownership passes to joint TIC but beneficial interest remains there until beneficiary can claim it at 18? Would a trust have to be proven at ST5/RX3 time or does an ‘unofficial trust’ exist by simply waiting? Bit confusing as I know there’s no legal obligation to let you know about deaths and I’ve seen it said LR aren’t bothered about wills etc just registration of correct people after the fact. Are you just relying on wills/intestacy laws being followed?