Giving a friend lifts to work, am I wrong for charging him?

DavidF

Lily-Rose wrote: »

Well exactly! It's amazing the amount of people who have this entitled-to attitude, and think the world owes them a living. Well if you're going that way anyway, why can you not take me? And they are aghast and wounded and offended if you say no. And not only do they think you should take them, they don't think they should give you anything either. Bunch of free-loaders!

I will just add that having car shared with fellow electricians I have NEVER come across anybody who either objected or questioned charging each other when for whatever reason we couldn't use our own car. Working on building sites often one of the lads would decide "I'm not taking my new X in here" and they offer just to pay whoever is driving....I suppose we operate a kind of car share with options not to bother driving. I think the guys view each other as "true friends" as between us we have all attended each others weddings,christenings ect ect and have all helped each other out if the opportunity presents itself.
But the post struck a nerve too because my cousin is a painter and decorator who got a friend of his a job back in the trade after a 15 year hiatus. The friend ended up working with my cousin for something like 3 years and didn't pay 1p towards any costs. When my cousin broached the subject he just trotted out "Your going that way anyway" and refused point blank lol. Anyway my cuz put up with it until 1 day when my cuz said he was having a day or two off to do whatever....The bloke said "Don't take anymore than two days off as I can't afford to loose the money"....He wouldn't even contemplate using public transport.....1 bus approx 5 min walk and 30 min on bus...he stayed off work !!! My cousin was less than impressed and told him no more....So the bloke jacked the job in lol....There really is nowt as queer as folk as the old saying goes.

unholyangel

FBaby wrote: »

I think the disagreement in people's view here depends on which way you look at it.
Friend is saving money by using the help of OP, therefore he is using him
OR
OP is making a benefit from what he is receiving from friend, since it doesn't cost him much more to pick him up on his way.

My perspective is that a good friend never makes a profit from his friends. If say friend saves money as a result of the gesture, then good for them. They key part of it being a friendship though is that the gesture is returned, so that one day, it is the other way around.

Thankfully, all my friends are on the same page than me and I am confident that not one of them, in OP's position would have made such a request, just like it would never have crossed my mind to expect anything.

You mean by asking them to inconvenience themselves in order for you to pick up extra shifts & earn more money with the added benefit of staying in your nice cosy house longer & arriving back at your nice cosy house quicker and while you offered to pay them for it, then get offended when they actually take you up on it and expect them to cover the additional expenses incurred for something which in no way benefits them (only inconveniences them) and which only benefits you in numerous different ways?

Years ago before I could drive I was offered a lift (offered....i didnt ask) to and from work. I walked down to a meeting point (10 mins walk) so it was less out of their way, I paid £20 per week and I was more than happy with this as a bus wouldve cost more than £20 a week and required me to leave the house around 2 hours earlier (and get home later), a taxi would have cost £20 a day. Yes she was going that way anyway, but she was still doing me a favour that I had no right to expect from her. Its rather selfish imo to expect a friend to do that and not INSIST on them taking something for their trouble - never mind telling them they should be doing it for free.

The "friend" is an inconsiderate git and obviously was never told not to look a gift horse in the mouth.

springdreams

DavidF wrote: »

I will just add that having car shared with fellow electricians I have NEVER come across anybody who either objected or questioned charging each other when for whatever reason we couldn't use our own car. Working on building sites often one of the lads would decide "I'm not taking my new X in here" and they offer just to pay whoever is driving....I suppose we operate a kind of car share with options not to bother driving. I think the guys view each other as "true friends" as between us we have all attended each others weddings,christenings ect ect and have all helped each other out if the opportunity presents itself.
But the post struck a nerve too because my cousin is a painter and decorator who got a friend of his a job back in the trade after a 15 year hiatus. The friend ended up working with my cousin for something like 3 years and didn't pay 1p towards any costs. When my cousin broached the subject he just trotted out "Your going that way anyway" and refused point blank lol. Anyway my cuz put up with it until 1 day when my cuz said he was having a day or two off to do whatever....The bloke said "Don't take anymore than two days off as I can't afford to loose the money"....He wouldn't even contemplate using public transport.....1 bus approx 5 min walk and 30 min on bus...he stayed off work !!! My cousin was less than impressed and told him no more....So the bloke jacked the job in lol....There really is nowt as queer as folk as the old saying goes.

This is exactly it - the inconvenience factor rather than the money.

The OP would not be able to take a day off, or a holiday, without having to consider how it might affect the friend. He would also not be able to call in sick, start work late, leave work early, meet other friends for drinks after work, etc. as for him to do so would adversely impact on the lift scrounging friend.

DavidF

In a nutshell I think my thoughts are basic common decency really. This something for free because you have a car just never ever extends to any other part of life where costs are involved. What if my "friend" is 25 stone and im hauling him 50 miles per day...even en-route without detour are people really saying that this friend is not adding to my costs ? It's not even just fuel lol.

FBaby

Arrangements like this need to be mutually beneficial.

Really? So if it isn't beneficial for you, you don't help a friend? If they ask you for help with packing to move somewhere, unless they pay you in one way or the other, you say no?

You mean by asking them to inconvenience themselves in order for you to pick up extra shifts & earn more money with the added benefit of staying in your nice cosy house longer & arriving back at your nice cosy house quicker and while you offered to pay them for it, then get offended when they actually take you up on it and expect them to cover the additional expenses incurred for something which in no way benefits them (only inconveniences them) and which only benefits you in numerous different ways?

Well a bit over the top, but what you've missed is that OP is not asking for additional expenses, but to be paid for the non costly inconvenience and that is the part that his friend is challenging.

Indeed, I think friendship is indeed exactly that, someone you are prepared to be inconvenienced for because you care for them and you know that they will also be prepared to be inconvenienced for you in return.

There's a number of people here I don't think I would want as friends if every time they are asked for a favour from someone closed (ie. a friend of many years), they only agree if they have something to gain from it.

FBaby

The OP would not be able to take a day off, or a holiday, without having to consider how it might affect the friend. He would also not be able to call in sick, start work late, leave work early, meet other friends for drinks after work, etc. as for him to do so would adversely impact on the lift scrounging friend.

I would expect the message to have been that if OP is too ill to go to work, his friend would have to make his own way to work.

Pollycat

FBaby wrote: »

Really? So if it isn't beneficial for you, you don't help a friend? If they ask you for help with packing to move somewhere, unless they pay you in one way or the other, you say no?

Not an appropriate analogy at all.

FBaby wrote: »

Well a bit over the top, but what you've missed is that OP is not asking for additional expenses, but to be paid for the non costly inconvenience and that is the part that his friend is challenging.

Indeed, I think friendship is indeed exactly that, someone you are prepared to be inconvenienced for because you care for them and you know that they will also be prepared to be inconvenienced for you in return.

It appears that the OP's friend doesn't share the same concern for his friend.

It's he who has gone scuttling to other friends to back him up.

I can't see any inconvenience that the OP's friend is prepared to put up with.

FBaby wrote: »

There's a number of people here I don't think I would want as friends if every time they are asked for a favour from someone closed (ie. a friend of many years), they only agree if they have something to gain from it.

I certainly wouldn't want the OP's friend as one of mine.

Friendship is a 2 way street.
A fact that the OP's friend appears not to have grasped.

FBaby

Not an appropriate analogy at all.

It is exactly the same in principle. You help someone because you want to make their lives better, not because you expect something from it.

I can't see any inconvenience that the OP's friend is prepared to put up with.

Not on this occasion, but maybe one day, OP will be the one needing a lift and maybe he won't be able to pay anything because he won't be paid until the end of the month, so won't be able to give anything, and he would be thankful to have a friend prepared to take him and tell him not worry about payment since it is costing him nothing.

Friendship is a 2 way street

Exactly! But it doesn't have to be a 2 way streets in the present time. Good friends are there when you need them, end of. I don't count how much I help my friends vs how much they help me, but over the years, I find that those friends who remain so are those who are prepared to give without expecting something back just because they gave in the first place. It has happened that a friend has given me much more than I was able to give them in return during a period of a year or so, but then circumstances change, and it became me who gave them help without getting anything in return.

Serendipitious

FBaby wrote: »

Really? So if it isn't beneficial for you, you don't help a friend? If they ask you for help with packing to move somewhere, unless they pay you in one way or the other, you say no?

The main question was about transport to a workplace involving two people on the same shift. To me that should be a case of pure economics concerning the practical arrangements.

Making it predominantly about friendship is too emotive, as it just clouds the issue.

But even so, the question was raised in the context of a situation where the OP has already done plenty for his 'friend.'

Of course I agree that friends help each other, and the natural give-and-take that goes on between people is all part of that friendship. But in this case, one person is doing (and has been doing) all the giving.

As many have already said, the costs and other factors involved in car ownership and driving are almost invisible to those who don't drive. And it's a big commitment taking someone to work and back on a daily basis, even if you are going there yourself.

[Deleted User]

Haven't read all the posts, so may have been said before .....
If you didn't give him a lift, how would he get there and how much would it cost him? You're providing a door-door service so he should be more than happy if it's less than it would otherwise cost him.

Looking at a recent post - there's a big difference between helping a friend out and providing a regular service. If it's raining, I'll lend you my umbrella but if you ask me every time it rains I'll tell you to buy your own ...