Giving a friend lifts to work, am I wrong for charging him?

FBaby

I think you missed one element, this was only for a total of 4 weeks, not 4 months, so I don't think your cost analysis of the extra W&T for that mileage and weeks is realistic.

But again, the issue is that OP and his friend didn't agree on the true cost of the above. His friend did agree on a minimal amount that he felt was the extra cost, then OP asked for what he felt was significantly more, hence feeling he was using it to put extra £££ in his pocket.

All OP needed to do if indeed, what he was asking him was what he had worked out to be the extra costs was to show him the breakdown of these.

As it is, I expect the 4 weeks are over, the friend has gone back to using whatever mean he did before, and they are likely not talking anymore if they didn't talk it though. Maybe for the best, maybe a friend who could have been there for OP in the future lost over £5.

Pollycat

FBaby wrote: »

As it is, I expect the 4 weeks are over, the friend has gone back to using whatever mean he did before, and they are likely not talking anymore if they didn't talk it though. Maybe for the best, maybe a friend who could have been there for OP in the future lost over £5.

And maybe the 'friend' lost the OP's friendship over £5.
Not to mention the amount of money spent by the OP on the Amsterdam trip.

It's not exactly the same scenario but this signature from one poster comes to mind:

if you lend someone £20 and never see that person again, it was probably worth it

If someone falls out with you over £5 when you're doing him a favour, it's probably worth it.

FBaby

Indeed, it might very well be that OP will be glad that the friendship is over, as I already said, it might be for the best. Only OP knows what his friend has done for him or not in the past.

Still don't agree on the tat for tat when it comes to friendship though. I am very fortunate to have many friends who I know I could rely on in need and vice versa. Some of them, I have without a doubt given more than I have received back so far, but that was because of the circumstances, ie. I am better off financially than they are, so I don't mind paying more towards joint things than they do, or because I had more time than they do etc... I also can think of at least one friend who all in all has given more than she has received from me so far because of the circumstances but it doesn't lessen our friendship.

This applies in the working environment too. I had a colleague who just wasn't very good at her job and often made mistakes. She knew it, but was overwhelmed. I helped her a lot and even on two occasions took the hit for her mistakes because the only alternative was to come clean and that would most likely have ended in her dismissal. I moved jobs a few months later, but regretted it, so was so grateful when I got an email from her, saying that a job was coming up where she now worked having moved on too and that she thought it would be perfect for me (a promotion). It is very unlikely that I would have come across the advert (as not advertised where I normally looked) so her thinking of me and bothering to inform was extremely helpful as I got the job.

I strongly believe that if you are nice to people, even if it cost you, it will come back to you one day one way or the other unless that person is a user and manipulator by nature (ie. takes scrupulously from everyone), in which case, you just end the friendship, which I have done on one occasion and had no regrets.

Pollycat

FBaby wrote: »

Indeed, it might very well be that OP will be glad that the friendship is over, as I already said, it might be for the best. Only OP knows what his friend has done for him or not in the past.

I strongly believe that if you are nice to people, even if it cost you, it will come back to you one day one way or the other unless that person is a user and manipulator by nature (ie. takes scrupulously from everyone), in which case, you just end the friendship, which I have done on one occasion and had no regrets.

Indeed, only the OP - and his friend - know who has done what for whom in the past.

So, we only have what the OP has told us.
So I'm not interested in speculating how good a friend that person has been, only what the OP says.

And the friend asked for the lift.
And offered to pay.
Then disputed the amount asked for.
Then after agreeing on an amount, tried to reduce that by arguing.
Then agreed to pay but told his friend - that would be the guy giving him the lift - that he was ripping him off.
And saying that if he was a real friend, he wouldn't charge him at all.
And allegedly (as we don't know know if the 'friend' actually did this) canvassed his friends for their opinion on the dispute.

Oh yes, this guy has really been nice to his friend (the OP). :cool:
A real keeper (not). :cool:

FBaby

And the friend asked for the lift.
And offered to pay.
Then disputed the amount asked for.
Then after agreeing on an amount, tried to reduce that by arguing.
Then agreed to pay but told his friend - that would be the guy giving him the lift - that he was ripping him off.
And saying that if he was a real friend, he wouldn't charge him at all.
And allegedly (as we don't know know if the 'friend' actually did this) canvassed his friends for their opinion on the dispute.

That's how I see it too, although there was also the step where during the argument after the £25 was agreed, OP said he wanted £30.

The difference is that I see that the friend asking opinion from his friends - just like OP has done by coming here, but expect the friends are more likely to know the specifics of the issues and background than us - subsequently to his offer started to believe that OP was asking him for more money than it was actually costing him.

OP hasn't come back, so hopefully this issue has been resolved for him, either by making amend one way or the other, or deciding that the friendship wasn't worth continuing. Nothing more we can assume either way.

Pollycat

FBaby wrote: »

That's how I see it too, although there was also the step where during the argument after the £25 was agreed, OP said he wanted £30.

But after the OP agreed to the £25 (and no less!) offered by the friend, the friend tried to get it down to £20.
It was then that the OP said he wanted £30 but agreed to £25.

Jlawson118 wrote: »

He was asking me how much I wanted, so I suggested maybe £10 per week but he thought it was a little much and within a few weeks, he said he'd give me no less than £25. As a friend I was fine with that. But then he argued and tried to get it down to £20. I wanted at least £30 but I could go to £25. We argued and he agreed but claimed I was ripping him off.

You're right, I did miss that step out - it just reflects even more badly on the 'friend'.

FBaby wrote: »

T
The difference is that I see that the friend asking opinion from his friends - just like OP has done by coming here, but expect the friends are more likely to know the specifics of the issues and background than us - subsequently to his offer started to believe that OP was asking him for more money than it was actually costing him.

It could be that - or it could be the friend wishing to put pressure on the OP to reduce the amount he had to pay for this door-to-door lift that he had actually asked for (as opposed to being offered).

FBaby wrote: »

OP hasn't come back, so hopefully this issue has been resolved for him, either by making amend one way or the other, or deciding that the friendship wasn't worth continuing. Nothing more we can assume either way.

We do actually know from the OP's other threads that he's having trouble with his car.

Maybe the friend has stepped up and is offering the OP some financial help to compensate for the dosh spent on him in Amsterdam......

mirko

If I didn't drive and had to pay (say) £50 to get to a job for four weeks.
Yet a mate of mine said he'd pick me up on the way to the job every single day and therefore it'd be quicker for me to get to work, I'd happily pay up to £50 for the privilege.

It'd be a win/win situation for both me and him, even if he did make a 'profit'. Mutually beneficial arrangement. Good for him, good for me, everyone's a winner.

I'd hate to put anyone out (even a friend) for four weeks.

sheramber

Your insurance would be invalid if you make a profit from any payment made for a lift unless you have insurance for fee paying passengers.

Mojisola

sheramber wrote: »

Your insurance would be invalid if you make a profit from any payment made for a lift unless you have insurance for fee paying passengers.

But it's usually fine if you get a contribution towards the fuel and other car costs.

unholyangel

FBaby wrote: »

I think you missed one element, this was only for a total of 4 weeks, not 4 months, so I don't think your cost analysis of the extra W&T for that mileage and weeks is realistic.

But again, the issue is that OP and his friend didn't agree on the true cost of the above. His friend did agree on a minimal amount that he felt was the extra cost, then OP asked for what he felt was significantly more, hence feeling he was using it to put extra £££ in his pocket.

All OP needed to do if indeed, what he was asking him was what he had worked out to be the extra costs was to show him the breakdown of these.

As it is, I expect the 4 weeks are over, the friend has gone back to using whatever mean he did before, and they are likely not talking anymore if they didn't talk it though. Maybe for the best, maybe a friend who could have been there for OP in the future lost over £5.

The fact you think that costing is unrealistic and also questioned £20-30 weekly running cost (when you can pay that for insurance alone) just leads me to believe you're either not a driver or that someone else pays it for you.

Tell me, how much extra would you say it costs to do 160 miles on urban streets with light traffic compared to motorway (ignoring the difference of additional body weight)?

As for the bit in bold, thats not what the OP told us happened. They agreed £25 - granted OP said he wanted at least £30 but also said he accepted the £25 due to it being a friend - implying (to me anyway) that he decided not to push for £30 because he was quite happy to let £5 go for the sake of friendship - but it seems the friend wasn't willing to do the same and decided to risk the relationship to save himself another £5 by saying he would only give £20.

As I said, the friend knew OP was looking at a figure of £10 per week as reasonable, if he wasn't willing to pay close to that, he should have found alternative means of transportation rather than continuing to accept lifts knowing he had no intention of paying anything close to what OP was asking.