Spending your life with someone you're not in love with...

Laconic

I think that the traditional reasons to get married were underpinned by three p's: property, propriety and progeny. It wasn't until 1882 that married women could even legally own property in the UK, and it's still the case in much of the world. Practically, between the greater earning power of men and the ever-crumbling ladder of upwards social mobility, marriage is *still* a way to get some measure of material benefit. Propriety: while not as strong as before, there's still a respect accorded to being married that's very real. The pressure to not be the odd one out can be intense. And finally progeny: need I say more? Romantic love doesn't get a look-in: affection, clear expectations and mutual respect can go a long way.

Not that I can talk: I'm also one of those permanently single people. And I'm in my early 40s. I've supported myself since I left home for uni at 21, have never wanted children and I've always been thought odd, so the pressure to marry has never bothered me (and few bother me about it now). I guess I'll have to be love-struck in order to marry. We'll see.

Laconic

pigpen wrote: »

I'd get about 3 haha.. I'd love to see the list.. it could be a fb quiz!!! lol

Me too! I want to see the list too!

lobbyludd

fierystormcloud wrote: »

And you do know do you not, that women did get qualifications and developed careers in the 1980s?! :rotfl::rotfl::rotfl:

It was the 1980s, not the dark ages!

quite!

whilst the thread is very interesting, I have had a few tea-swallowed-the-wrong-way moments by the way some are referring to the 1980's and 90's! As a child born in 1971, I knew 1 person who got married before they were 25, and very few before they were in their 30's - we really didn't all marry the first person to show an interest in us or consider ourselves on the shelf by 20... nor was it the norm for those ahead of us in school or with older brothers and sisters. Appreciate that this is different in different places.

Person_one

lobbyludd wrote: »

quite!

whilst the thread is very interesting, I have had a few tea-swallowed-the-wrong-way moments by the way some are referring to the 1980's and 90's! As a child born in 1971, I knew 1 person who got married before they were 25, and very few before they were in their 30's - we really didn't all marry the first person to show an interest in us or consider ourselves on the shelf by 20... nor was it the norm for those ahead of us in school or with older brothers and sisters. Appreciate that this is different in different places.

It was definitely more common for people to be married and starting families younger in the 80s and early 90s.

Purely anecdotally, my parents had all their children by 26 and 24 in the eighties, and most of my friends' parents were no more than about 5 years older unless they were on second marriages!

The statistics bear it out too, the average age of marriage is creeping up. It was 23 in 1981, 25 in 1991, and 30 in 2011.

Laconic

lobbyludd wrote: »

quite!

whilst the thread is very interesting, I have had a few tea-swallowed-the-wrong-way moments by the way some are referring to the 1980's and 90's! As a child born in 1971, I knew 1 person who got married before they were 25, and very few before they were in their 30's - we really didn't all marry the first person to show an interest in us or consider ourselves on the shelf by 20... nor was it the norm for those ahead of us in school or with older brothers and sisters. Appreciate that this is different in different places.

Heh. It does indeed depend. My parents didn't get married until my mom was in her late 20s and my dad in his early 30s in the 70's. I went to two different secondary schools in the same city. In the first one, where the student population was from a very mixed background, quite a few of the sixth formers were engaged to be married as soon as they graduated. In the second one, which was mostly posh, no one got married until well into their 20s. There is much variation indeed.

The other thing though is the changing careers thing. It's been a head-scratcher that. Sure there are barriers to making changes to your life, but I think it's important to make sure that the ones you perceive are actually real.

I'm in the throes of doing just that and I have it *easy* compared to an aunt of mine I so admire. She left school with just GCSEs that barely scraped a pass, got married and had kids right away. She mostly stayed at home, doing people's hair for some pocket money and cleaning wards at the hospital. When the youngest kid finally started school full time (she was 40 then), she went on an Access Course and eventually qualified to be a nurse. The one thing I wish she'd taken a picture of was of the look on the ward sister's face when she showed up at her old hospital NOT in her cleaner's uniform. Worth it.

At the present moment, she's the main breadwinner in the family since her husband had a stroke. Thankfully, he's recovering nicely.

FBaby

pollypenny wrote: »

Oh, heck. I wonder how many points out of 100 I'd rate.

Seems like a box-ticking exercise.

Of course it's a tick box exercise. We all do it just without pen and paper. Some women fall in love with nice wealthy men others with fun exciting men. Some will look forever for their perfect man others will settle for less.

I'd hope for you that you'd score high for the person you're sharing your life with.

Mercenary

I've never been in love and I got married over 30 years ago simply because I was pregnant after a short time of being a girlfriend, and had the full force of expectation from my extended family that it was 'the best thing to do' . It was nothing to do with love or romance. It was more difficult back then to be single with a child and I was basically railroaded into marriage as I really couldn't see the alternative.

Over the past 30+ years there hasn't been a single day of feeling love towards my husband. For years I tried to get on with him and be a good wife and mother, but he focussed completely on his career and had no idea about how to be a good husband or an interested father to his children....and didn't want to learn either.
Gradually I realised that I didn't actually like him very much as his behaviour included anything he didn't want to hear about leading to childish tantrums and sulking for weeks, while taking it out on the children and pets. Weekends have long been a trial to get through and the rare holidays we've had rapidly changed to separate ones as we can't be in the same place together for long.

I have been able to be a stay at home mother and housewife for all this time, for which i'm very grateful, but his retirement looms in a short time and there's no way I'm staying with him! I'm getting away at last!

As soon as he retires, we've agreed the house will be sold, a financial agreement or divorce will be arranged and I will move back to my home area. Alone. I can't wait :j , yet it's also very frightening to consider all the processes that have to be set in motion.
I'd just like to have a life of my own at last, without the constant heavy cloud of dislike and frustration hovering over me.
I have deep regrets that I have missed out on romantic love, but I have my children to love, and grand-children. Who knows what the future will bring? :cool:

missbiggles1

FBaby wrote: »

Of course it's a tick box exercise. We all do it just without pen and paper. Some women fall in love with nice wealthy men others with fun exciting men. Some will look forever for their perfect man others will settle for less.

I'd hope for you that you'd score high for the person you're sharing your life with.

It certainly takes the "falling" out of falling in love!

Lily-Rose_3

I think maybe up to and including the 1980s, some women may have settled for less, and got married to the first half-decent man as there were less career opportunities for women then, and also some women were afraid of being alone.

Many women back in the late 1970s and early 1980s (when I was a teen/young adult,) married at 17-21, and often married the lad they had been dating since the age of 14 or 15. They literally got 'engaged' at 16, and had a cubic zirconia or sapphire ring! You were nothing unless you were engaged by the age of 18! I was still 'on the shelf' at 20, and my aunts and cousins asked my mother if I was a lesbian! I'm not kidding! :rotfl:

I remember the 1990s as being full of go-getting career women, so by then, I would say that women were spreading their wings a lot more... But yes, 1980s, (moreso the earlier part,) women did get married quite young. As a few people have said though; it was more the working classes, as the middle classes tended to be more likely to go onto higher education and have a career.

I do very much believe that some women (who married over 25-30 years ago,) are with men they are not in love with, and possibly never have been in love with. It's just that it's much easier to stay than it is to leave. Many men are probably in this position too.

That's not to say that everyone is in this position though, and of course many people love their spouses; it's just not a 'Heathcliff and Cathy,' or 'Jack and Rose' kinda love; it's more like faithful old buddies who like to share their lives, and care deeply for one another.

This is just my take on the situation.

missbiggles1

Lily-Rose wrote: »

I think maybe up to and including the 1980s, some women may have settled for less, and got married to the first half-decent man as there were less career opportunities for women then, and also some women were afraid of being alone.

Many women back in the late 1970s and early 1980s (when I was a teen/young adult,) married at 17-21, and often married the lad they had been dating since the age of 14 or 15. They literally got 'engaged' at 16, and had a cubic zirconia or sapphire ring! You were nothing unless you were engaged by the age of 18! I was still 'on the shelf' at 20, and my aunts and cousins asked my mother if I was a lesbian! I'm not kidding! :rotfl:

I remember the 1990s as being full of go-getting career women, so by then, I would say that women were spreading their wings a lot more... But yes, 1980s, (moreso the earlier part,) women did get married quite young. As a few people have said though; it was more the working classes, as the middle classes tended to be more likely to go onto higher education and have a career.

I do very much believe that some women (who married over 25-30 years ago,) are with men they are not in love with, and possibly never have been in love with. It's just that it's much easier to stay than it is to leave. Many men are probably in this position too.

That's not to say that everyone is in this position though, and of course many people love their spouses; it's just not a 'Heathcliff and Cathy,' or 'Jack and Rose' kinda love; it's more like faithful old buddies who like to share their lives, and care deeply for one another.

This is just my take on the situation.

Who are "Jack and Rose"?

I was a teenager in the 60s and got engaged when I was 18 but there were only a couple of us in that situation and only another couple got married before the age of 20. (Virtually nobody was allowed to date at the age of 14!)

I think it may have depended on what type of school you went to - I assume it might have been more common at a secondary modern.