If we vote for Brexit what happens

Generali

Conrad wrote: »

I can just imagine the great thinkers from history resorting to putting people on ignore. You do as you see fit, but you said my contribution was 'boring', so if you want to throw stones about you're certainly going to get some back.


I wont be putting you on ignore, life is too short




Andrew Neil gave the Swiss numbers during the debate. Perhaps he made a mistake, but none the less the argument the EU has done a lowly $ sum of global deals in proportion to those done by independents, is valid

The numbers are clearly bunkum, the briefest look at them tells us that. We can't gain any insight from them at all.

mwpt

Conrad wrote: »

The precise argument given by those august (sp) establishment members arguing we must join the Euro.


Talent pools in places such as Singapore, London, NewYork, based on decades of organic synergy. There is no way Germans will stop wanting British F1 or Games, and no way British customers will stop wanting French cheeses.


Even if we only got WTO trade rules (we will 100% do better though), the trade tarrif diffidence is miniscule, all will be well.


People trade. Expertise congregates. Honestly you have nothing to fear, trade knows no barriers, I ordered a bike from China recently, might as well have been ordered from Halfords, I felt no difference.


What is your opinion of the fact financial institutions did not go to Frankfurt and Paris, promised by the Euro protagonists?

Why are the Germans trying to buy our stock exchange, why are Nissan and Seimens investing if Briexit is such a risk, > Follow the money

'UBS is building a major new office in the City, a move which has been seen as a sign of its intent to keep substantial operations in the UK regardless of whether or not British voters choose to stay in the EU'

And all of this happened while are in the EU, a trade union which you guys are telling us is terrible for us and we must escape.

mwpt

CLAPTON wrote: »

I have no way of knowing whether your industry will contract.
Whilst it is perfectly reasonable for you to be only concerned with your own self interest, I am more concerned with the best interest of the majority of the people of the UK.

Yes, I believe you actually think this, but I think you're wrong. You are willing to sacrifice industries, jobs in return for lower growth, tax revenue and further cuts, so that we can say we're free of the EU.

The endless population increases are to the detriment of the people of the UK with poorer living conditions worsening by the day.

This is going to happen anyway Clapton. The UK was a rich country in a closed world. We are now an open world and competing cheaper countries are taking our business. Rich Western countries are experiencing inequality rises due to this. Labour and production is imported either directly or indirectly through offshoring. Inequality is lowering in undeveloped nations (well, a lot of them) but this is causing the labour class in Western countries to be worse off. Cross border businesses and automation mean the top are getting richer. This is not an EU problem and I wish you guys would stop trying to win the EU argument on issues which are not EU problems.

I've no idea what you mean about the rentier system

My apologies, I actually thought I was replying to Conrad, the rentier.

CLAPTON

mwpt wrote: »

Yes, I believe you actually think this, but I think you're wrong. You are willing to sacrifice industries, jobs in return for lower growth, tax revenue and further cuts, so that we can say we're free of the EU.

I believe you actually think this but you are wrong. You are willing to sacrifice industries, jobs in return for lower welfare so you can retain you white christian shield of the EU.

This is going to happen anyway Clapton. The UK was a rich country in a closed world. We are now an open world and competing cheaper countries are taking our business. Rich Western countries are experiencing inequality rises due to this. Labour and production is imported either directly or indirectly through offshoring. Inequality is lowering in undeveloped nations (well, a lot of them) but this is causing the labour class in Western countries to be worse off. Cross border businesses and automation mean the top are getting richer. This is not an EU problem and I wish you guys would stop trying to win the EU argument on issues which are not EU problems.

many things are going to happen but that doesn't mean that we should deliberately make them worse that they need to be.

No-one, other the 'stay' camp, claim that all the problems of the world are the result of the EU: some problems are that could be solved by major EU reform (no chance at the moment) or by the UK leaving.

Anyway do you think we should joint the euro and gain all the advantages that OECD, CBI, IMF etc predicted?


I will readily accept an apology for your offensive and untrue claims about my attitude to living with foreigners, if you wish to make one.

and I would welcome you explanation of how you think all people are equal but don't wish to share your space with them.

antrobus

Conrad wrote: »

• The EU has done free trade deals amounting to $7 trillion dollars of global GDP, little Switzerland has done deals worth $40 trillion worth of global GDP

Don't be silly.

The GDP of "little Switzerland" is about $700 bn (nominal). The total value of its trade looks to be about $570 bn. There is no way that it has "done deals worth $40 trillion worth of global GDP". That's about twice the value of total global trade for one thing.

http://wits.worldbank.org/CountrySnapshot/en/CHE/textview

mwpt

CLAPTON wrote: »

and I would welcome you explanation of how you think all people are equal but don't wish to share your space with them.

And I would welcome a cessation of your annoying straw man arguments. I've already answered you on why I don't think completely open borders would work right now. You can go dig up that answer and read it again if you like.

Now, would you answer my questions in another thread about what the pecking order is between natives and non natives of the varying degrees?

CLAPTON

mwpt wrote: »

And I would welcome a cessation of your annoying straw man arguments. I've already answered you on why I don't think completely open borders would work right now. You can go dig up that answer and read it again if you like.

Now, would you answer my questions in another thread about what the pecking order is between natives and non natives of the varying degrees?

I find your refusal to apologise and withdraw your untruthful and offensive remarks about your perception of my attitude to foreigners somewhat cowardly and does you no credit.

I note your constant references to your idealistic vision of the equality of all the people of the world but in practice are only concerned with your own self interest. Many would call that hypocritical.

I note also your total refusal to support the views of the OECD, IMF, CBI on some matters but claim them as 'authoritative' when referencing your god the EU.

I'm not sure what question I have missed but I have many times said I would stop most immigration as I believe it is not in the best interest of the people of the UK (basically YOUR OWN position that it isn't practical NOW). If that isn't the question then please ask again.

Rinoa

IMF table showing change in constant price GDP




EU as a whole is down at 5.2%, no doubt helped by the UK's contribution. But the Eurozone is a meagre 2.9%, that's 5 years growth.

Can any remainers explain why so many countries are outperforming the EU?

Conrad

110 bosses say City will 'thrive' outside EU


Ex-HSBC boss Michael Geoghegan, former Channel 4 chairman Luke Johnson and the stockbroker Peter Hargreaves are among those backing a Leave vote on 23 June.



http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-eu-referendum-36173263

BobQ

Rinoa wrote: »

IMF table showing change in constant price GDP




EU as a whole is down at 5.2%, no doubt helped by the UK's contribution. But the Eurozone is a meagre 2.9%, that's 5 years growth.

Can any remainers explain why so many countries are outperforming the EU?

Your table looks like the ones in the Brexit economist's report. They use it as "proof" that the problems of the EU economies are due to EU regulation. Its a bit of cheek to ask remainers to explain these statistics when Tim Congdon fails to explain his selective views. His comment that "Too much regulation must be the main explanation" sounds to me like a rather desperate remark. For example, he claims that banking regulation since 2008 has been a factor. Does anyone seriously believe that banking regulation is unnecessary after the austerity we have endured?