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If we vote for Brexit what happens
Comments
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setmefree2 wrote: »Remoaners Last Stand.
When?
House of Lords - 20th February 2017.(2 day debate)
It would appear that the HoL is going to put up a fight and try to keep us in the single market and the customs union according to Lord/Peter Hain (Newsnight Wednesday)
Much Ado About Nothing?
should give us a nice run in to two by-elections.0 -
Oh well we need another referendum then.
Maybe one every twelve months so we can continue to check the will of the people.
That would be pointless. The decision has been made.
However, it would be interesting if in two years time the EU27 had set in train some reforms that made the EU more palatable and said "this is the best deal we are able to offer, but if you want to change your mind and remain a member we would be quite happy for you to revoke A50, we will even wait for you to hold another referendum" What would be do then.Few people are capable of expressing with equanimity opinions which differ from the prejudices of their social environment. Most people are incapable of forming such opinions.0 -
No !!!! Sherlock.That would be pointless. The decision has been made.However, it would be interesting if in two years time the EU27 had set in train some reforms that made the EU more palatable and said "this is the best deal we are able to offer, but if you want to change your mind and remain a member we would be quite happy for you to revoke A50, we will even wait for you to hold another referendum" What would be do then.
So the question is if the EU reformed to be what we wanted them to be, would we want to then stay in it?
Wouldn't that come under the 'have-your-cake-and-eat-it' definition?
I thought such a position was impossible?0 -
setmefree2 wrote: »Remoaners Last Stand.
When?
House of Lords - 20th February 2017.(2 day debate)
It would appear that the HoL is going to put up a fight and try to keep us in the single market and the customs union according to Lord/Peter Hain (Newsnight Wednesday)
Much Ado About Nothing?
This "remoaner" term is becoming quite pathetic.
On QT last night Clair Perry defended/apologised for her use of the term Brexit jihadis. I too thought that the remark was in bad taste.
But the point I think she was trying to make was that there are a group of people who one could describe as conviction believers in Brexit. They see no benefit in maintaining any relationship with the EU, often seem to hate the EU, and will not countenance any views that do not accord with this view. They refuse to recognise that you can leave the EU and maintain any relationship with it.
They are entitled to this view but their attitude towards those who do not share this conviction belief is equally offensive. The childish response that "you started it" is also quite shameful.Few people are capable of expressing with equanimity opinions which differ from the prejudices of their social environment. Most people are incapable of forming such opinions.0 -
setmefree2 wrote: »HoL
There are 252 Conservative peers and they are heavily outnumbered by 203 Labour peers, 102 Liberal Democrats and 178 cross-benchers. The vast majority of these are almost certainly committed Remainers who would have voted against Britain leaving the EU.
That means they will almost certainly vote for Britain to stay in the EU, even if it's by a roundabout way that will make it impossible for the Government to negotiate properly with the EU, or by insisting that there is another referendum, because 'they didn't know what they were voting for' (delightful prospect to put the population through again). I thought these 'lords' had kept a bit quiet of late.
It's disgraceful that a party that only has nine MPs has 102 members in the 'lords'. Let's see what the population will have to say about these 'lords' (AKA snouts in troughs) going against the people and Parliament. :eek:0 -
On QT last night Clair Perry defended/apologised for her use of the term Brexit jihadis. I too thought that the remark was in bad taste.
But the point I think she was trying to make was that there are a group of people who one could describe as conviction believers in Brexit. They see no benefit in maintaining any relationship with the EU, often seem to hate the EU, and will not countenance any views that do not accord with this view. They refuse to recognise that you can leave the EU and maintain any relationship with it.
They are entitled to this view but their attitude towards those who do not share this conviction belief is equally offensive. The childish response that "you started it" is also quite shameful.
There is no one I know who voted Leave who sees 'no benefit in maintaining any relationship with the EU'. On the contrary, the viewpoint was that we should work together for the best outcome for the UK as well as the EU. I also don't know anyone with a 'childish response that "you started it"'. However, the EU bureaucrats themselves, with their hostile rhetoric towards Britain and their lack of respect for democracy, have made people who were perhaps fairly indifferent to the EU now actively dislike it and reinforced their view that we must leave such a 'club' (without disliking the Europeans themselves).0 -
No !!!! Sherlock.
So the question is if the EU reformed to be what we wanted them to be, would we want to then stay in it?
Wouldn't that come under the 'have-your-cake-and-eat-it' definition?
I thought such a position was impossible?
I realise it is unlikely, I was just speculating. Say the EU were to abolish Freedom of Movement? I only ask the question because some people think the EU is about to collapse or undergo fundamental change.Few people are capable of expressing with equanimity opinions which differ from the prejudices of their social environment. Most people are incapable of forming such opinions.0 -
What makes me laugh is the brexiteers banging on about 'remoaners'.....I'm sure Farage and Cash and Redwood etc would have accepted the result as the democratic will of the people if it had gone the other way.;) Also an ongoing attritional battle can still force concessions from the hard cliff edge brexit and make it a tad less disasterous....if the Lords can do something useful power to their elbow!..... so the protesting continues! Why wouldn't it....it's my country too.....I just happen to believe our best interests are best served being as close as possible to our neighbours and not surrendering our tarrif free access to a huge market on our doorstep.:mad:0
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Epithets such as you describe were merely coined to counter similar derogatory terms used to describe your average leave voter.
We should indeed all grow up, but you started it!
There is no one I know who voted Leave who sees 'no benefit in maintaining any relationship with the EU'. On the contrary, the viewpoint was that we should work together for the best outcome for the UK as well as the EU. I also don't know anyone with a 'childish response that "you started it"'. However, the EU bureaucrats themselves, with their hostile rhetoric towards Britain and their lack of respect for democracy, have made people who were perhaps fairly indifferent to the EU now actively dislike it and reinforced their view that we must leave such a 'club' (without disliking the Europeans themselves).
I agree that the EU does not help itself. A lot is due to cultural factors in multi-national organisations. I have some experience of the latter and you often have to accept that the price of participation is that they do not always do things as the UK would wish.
Text in boldEpithets such as you describe were merely coined to counter similar derogatory terms used to describe your average leave voter.
We should indeed all grow up, but you started it!Few people are capable of expressing with equanimity opinions which differ from the prejudices of their social environment. Most people are incapable of forming such opinions.0 -
That would be pointless. The decision has been made.
However, it would be interesting if in two years time the EU27 had set in train some reforms that made the EU more palatable and said "this is the best deal we are able to offer, but if you want to change your mind and remain a member we would be quite happy for you to revoke A50, we will even wait for you to hold another referendum" What would be do then.
We'd tell them to do one because we wouldn't be stupid enough to believe it.0
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