If we vote for Brexit what happens

Moby

Gina Miller spanks the Govmt:-

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/jan/24/supreme-court-brexit-judgment-constitution-gina-miller

The Conservatives have always regarded themselves as the party of law and order, so it is ironic that it should have been their leader who made the decision to appeal the high court ruling. I make no pretence at being well-versed in politics – it is all too often about personalities and emotion – but I do know a thing or two about our constitution, as I once trained to be a lawyer. Even a first-year law student learns that an overriding principle is that parliament is sovereign. This is what we should be eternally grateful to the judges – in the face of enormous pressure from the most of the press – for upholding.

If we are going to do this stupid thing....let's at least be open about it and debate it.......not try and slip it through under some ancient prerogative power!

Conrad

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Future-Babble-Expert-Predictions-Believe/dp/0753522365


Futurebabble by Dan Gardener;


In 2008, as the price of oil surged above $140 a barrel, experts said it would soon hit $200; a few months later it plunged to $30. In 1967, they said the USSR would be the world's fastest-growing economy by 2000, the USSR no longer existed.


In 1908, it was pronounced that there would be no more wars in Europe; we all know how that turned out.


Face it, experts are about as accurate as dart-throwing monkeys. And yet every day we ask them to predict the future - everything from the weather to the likelihood of a terrorist attack.


Future Babble is the first book to examine this phenomenon, showing why our brains yearn for certainty about the future, why we are attracted to those who predict the future confidently, and why it's so easy for us to ignore the trail of outrageously wrong forecasts.

In this fast-paced, example-packed, sometimes darkly funny book, Dan Gardner shows how seminal research by professor Philip Tetlock proved that the more famous a pundit is, the more likely they are to be right about as often as a stopped watch.


Gardner also draws on current research in cognitive psychology, political science, and behavioural economics to discover something quite reassuring: The future is always uncertain, but the end is not always near.

CLAPTON

Moby wrote: »

Gina Miller spanks the Govmt:-

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/jan/24/supreme-court-brexit-judgment-constitution-gina-miller


If we are going to do this stupid thing....let's at least be open about it and debate it.......not try and slip it through under some ancient prerogative power!

it strange that whilst every first year law student and Moby indeed, knows the law, there seem to be three supreme court judges that don't.

A_Medium_Size_Jock

Moby wrote: »

Gina Miller spanks the Govmt:-

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/jan/24/supreme-court-brexit-judgment-constitution-gina-miller


If we are going to do this stupid thing....let's at least be open about it and debate it.......not try and slip it through under some ancient prerogative power!

*yawn*

Are there not threads from earlier days about this?
Have we not known what the outcome would be for a while now?
Did May in "the speech" not already say there would be a vote?

Yes I know the official judgement was only handed down today but let's be honest, it is neither a surprise nor is it anything new.



Moving on, I see that a few EU officials are getting jittery and telling the UK that we cannot start trade negotiations until after Brexit.
Yup, EU bureaucracy is well and truly beginning to realise that they do not hold all the cards - and this before we even invoke Article 50!
What will they do if we negotiate before we leave?
We can negotiate all we like ...... though we surely could just not finalise/sign agreements until after?
Depending upon how fair these EU bureaucrats are during Brexit negotiations.
Would they kick us out?


https://www.bloomberg.com/politics/articles/2017-01-23/u-k-set-to-defy-eu-and-open-trade-talks-with-other-countries

A_Medium_Size_Jock

An interesting report in Swedish online magazine Politism from the Swedish political scientist Göran von Sydow of the Swedish Institute for European Policy Studies (SIEPS).
He says:

"The EU's future development in the next few years will naturally affect the public opinion. If the EU becomes equal to the Eurozone, than it is not certain that Sweden feels equally at home,"

"In the early 1990s, the political analysis dominated by the notion that the market has become global and that democracy therefore was expected to follow suit. In the aftermath of the EU's failure to manage its crises and strengthen democracy in its member countries, this analysis begins to crumble. Soon, 28 years after the fall of the Berlin Wall, the EU as we know it, is fading away. Although a pure 'Swexit' may not necessarily occur, but it is highly unlikely that there is no alternative to the EU membership," Göran von Sydow concluded, adding that nothing lasts forever.

https://sputniknews.com/politics/201701241049942970-sweden-eu-swexit/

Translated from Swedish here:
https://translate.google.com/translate?sl=auto&tl=en&js=y&prev=_t&hl=en&ie=UTF-8&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.politism.se%2F50nyanseravpengar%2Fefter-brexit-hur-sannolik-ar-en-svexit%2F&edit-text=&act=url

Conrad

A_Medium_Size_Jock wrote: »

What will they do if we negotiate before we leave?
We can negotiate all we like ...... though we surely could just not finalise/sign agreements until after?
Depending upon how fair these EU bureaucrats are during Brexit negotiations.
Would they kick us out?


https://www.bloomberg.com/politics/articles/2017-01-23/u-k-set-to-defy-eu-and-open-trade-talks-with-other-countries

I've been waiting for this. Lets just negotiate with others and ready trade deals, as you say what the heck would the EU do, lol.


Remember they did next to nothing when France rounded up Roma enmass and deported them without any due process. They are doing nothing as member states erect 'illegal' border fences / walls. They are powerless to stop the Polish and Hungarian Govts suppressing the press etc




BTW the Germans need all the friends they can as the US turns it's back on the EU and seeks bi-lateral relations.
Cant see the Germans also shunning Britain, the key local military and intelligence power

Moby

A_Medium_Size_Jock wrote: »

*yawn*

Are there not threads from earlier days about this?
Have we not known what the outcome would be for a while now?
Did May in "the speech" not already say there would be a vote?

Yes I know the official judgement was only handed down today but let's be honest, it is neither a surprise nor is it anything new.



Moving on, I see that a few EU officials are getting jittery and telling the UK that we cannot start trade negotiations until after Brexit.
Yup, EU bureaucracy is well and truly beginning to realise that they do not hold all the cards - and this before we even invoke Article 50!
What will they do if we negotiate before we leave?
We can negotiate all we like ...... though we surely could just not finalise/sign agreements until after?
Depending upon how fair these EU bureaucrats are during Brexit negotiations.
Would they kick us out?


https://www.bloomberg.com/politics/articles/2017-01-23/u-k-set-to-defy-eu-and-open-trade-talks-with-other-countries

....I didn't know the outcome until this morning and I choose to post about it...yawn! and we'll see what amendments are thrown into the mix now won't we!

mayonnaise

The only noteworthy part of today's ruling is that devolved parliaments don't need to be consulted.
Should do wonders for Scottish Independence. :T

A_Medium_Size_Jock

Conrad wrote: »

I've been waiting for this. Lets just negotiate with others and ready trade deals, as you say what the heck would the EU do, lol.


Remember they did next to nothing when France rounded up Roma enmass and deported them without any due process. They are doing nothing as member states erect 'illegal' border fences / walls. They are powerless to stop the Polish and Hungarian Govts suppressing the press etc




BTW the Germans need all the friends they can as the US turns it's back on the EU and seeks bi-lateral relations.
Cant see the Germans also shunning Britain, the key local military and intelligence power

Then of course if the EU even attempt to fine the UK for talks of trade agreement we could fine them in turn for treating us unfairly according to the EU's own rules.

As I said before, Brexit will prove interesting.

Moby

Farron says Lib Dems will vote against article 50 unless government agrees referendum on final Brexit deal

Here is Tim Farron, the Liberal Democrat leader, responding to the supreme court judgment.
I welcome today’s judgment. But this court case was never about legal arguments, it was about giving the people a voice, a say, in what happens next.
This Tory Brexit government are keen to laud the democratic process when it suits them, but will not give the people a voice over the final deal. They seem happy to start with democracy and end in a stitch up.

The Liberal Democrats are clear, we demand a vote of the people on the final deal and without that we will not vote for article 50!

He's right .....we deserve a referendum on the deal. I for one don't trust Mayhem an inch to negotiate a good deal. She is weak. I saw her on Marr on Sunday. She is no Thatcher..........and could very easily be taken to the cleaners by the EU.
Do we just accept that whatever Mayhem gets we go with...whatever it looks like? Why should we, what sort of deal is that!