Ran out of punishments

foolofbeans

pigpen wrote: »

seriously?? NOT unreasonable.. that IMO is utterly unreasonable.. does she have an 'end date' for this or is it until you deem the entire world a suitable place??
The thing with punishments is they need to fit the offence and 2 weeks is unreasonable.. unless she burned your house down, poisoned the cat or ate the postman! knock off half a day if you do this'
I cannot believe you or anyone would think 2 weeks punishment is reasonable for anything.

There have been no punishments until the college exclusion. I'm a bit shocked that anyone would say two weeks grounding is too much. My niece was suspended and we had to go to a disciplinary hearing and hear all the misdemeanours and they agreed she could return but would be on a final warning. Two days later she misbehaved to the extent that the college excluded her. And you are saying that her behaviour doesn't warrant being grounded for two weeks? I'm pretty sure if I had posted saying my niece was excluded from college but I won't punish her that I would be flamed.
Granted she didn't burn the house down but she did smoke, swear and behave in such a manner that a college (who has a duty of inclusion to pupils) thought it severe enough to exclude her. If punishing her is wrong then perhaps I need to go back to the college and tell them they are being unreasonable?

Mirno

Let her decide her own punishment, and introduce some game theory into things!
For this to work you need to:
a) Think of a mild punishment that fits the crime (in your opinion).
b) Think of a harsh punishment that fits the crime.
c) Write both down, put in an envelope and seal it.
d) Explain that she must come up with a punishment that you deem worse than option a, otherwise she will get option b. Otherwise her own punishment will be used (even if it's worse than option b).

You may want to calibrate your mild punishments with a neutral third party.

pigpen

foolofbeans wrote: »

There have been no punishments until the college exclusion. I'm a bit shocked that anyone would say two weeks grounding is too much. My niece was suspended and we had to go to a disciplinary hearing and hear all the misdemeanours and they agreed she could return but would be on a final warning. Two days later she misbehaved to the extent that the college excluded her. And you are saying that her behaviour doesn't warrant being grounded for two weeks? I'm pretty sure if I had posted saying my niece was excluded from college but I won't punish her that I would be flamed.
Granted she didn't burn the house down but she did smoke, swear and behave in such a manner that a college (who has a duty of inclusion to pupils) thought it severe enough to exclude her. If punishing her is wrong then perhaps I need to go back to the college and tell them they are being unreasonable?

Yes.. I am.. my son was excluded from high school (a PSP had gone missing, been sold and there was no evidence as to who was involved so several boys were excluded for the offence) and was not grounded at all!! He was punished.. (I sold his concert ticket.. he was never excluded again) It is excessive and not effective, clearly.. she doesn't care. She took the tobacco because you won't let her go buy her own.

Colleges, inc 6th form colleges, provide smoking areas.. they accept pupils smoke
College STAFF swear, granted not all of them.. not AT students but I have heard them swear with my very own sensitive ears.. words for poo mainly but other 'ruder' ones too 'b' word and 'f' word mainly..
I think fighting is the only thing they get excluded for at many of the post 16 colleges here. Drug taking/possession is instant dismissal from a course understandably.

Lunar_Eclipse

foolofbeans wrote: »

we can't seem to get through one day without an incident that requires punishment.

I'm trying to make light but I just want to cry, I'm so mentally exhausted from the constant drama.

I give up!!!

I don't know the background or ages of your niece & daughter. Neither have I experienced either of my two teenage daughters stealing or smoking. I love teenagers but would say they have very short fuses. And often make 'stupid' atypical choices ...

BUT a few thoughts:

1) Most incidents don't "require punishment." Family lives are not like working in the military. A calm discussion or comment typically yields better results in my experience.

2) You cannot control your niece or daughter yet are fully in charge of how you react. Stop reacting to all the drama. It brings more. This is not the same as doing nothing but lead with your head and not emotional reactions.

Pick which battles have consequences beyond (winding you up) today: which are going to affect their lives in 5-10 years time and focus on those. Stealing is never a good idea, but if I was dealing with a teenager who already smoked and had bigger issues (college), I might be tempted to ignore the loss of tobacco, move it and say nothing. Or mention you think someone's taking it and if it is them, you don't want to know but please not to do it again. Calm, no drama, no punishment. They know you know, you won't tolerate it and that's usually the end of it. You can't fight numerous things a day, if that's what you're facing (which as I said, I don't know!)

There is a 'rule' about commenting on a minimum of 3 positive things for every criticism you make. I suggest deliberately looking for any positives and vocalising them. If they are very 'lazy' these might be tricky and you'll hate doing it, but it works! Things like: I see your bedroom is tidy, you look clean today, thank you for being patient waiting for dinner, well done putting your laundry away etc etc ANYTHING to help turn the relationship around. It only takes a few days ...

ETA: I'm not a fan of punishments, nor treats personally. Punishments are simply about control and use of power, which is not how we operate. I wouldn't allow my husband to ground me, so we don't do it with our kids. All anyone wants is to be loved, heard and respected. All behaviour has natural consequences that are (usually?) enough. DH and I are clear about what we expect in our house, in terms of behaviour, and since our teenagers know we are reasonable, as opposed to ridiculously extreme, they respect the 'rules'. So if someone started shouting at someone else, for example, another family member would point it out and ask them to stop (because that is not how we communicate), or go and calm down and come back and continue. If someone was chucked out of college, they would be expected to find a job. Looking for a job is a full time job...

euronorris

With regards to the phone usage whilst out - Do you and your OH ever use your phones whilst out also?


I only say this because my sister and her husband was getting really annoyed with their two daughters for doing this during a meal, until I pointed out that they had been doing pretty much the same thing. You need to lead by example in those situations, and if you don't want them to be glued to their phones whilst out then you need to introduce a policy of 'No mobile phones to be used by anyone during family meals out, unless an emergency'. Otherwise, they'll just see you guys using your phones and think 'What hypocrites!' and ignore you.

Lunar_Eclipse

foolofbeans wrote: »

There have been no punishments until the college exclusion. I'm a bit shocked that anyone would say two weeks grounding is too much. My niece was suspended and we had to go to a disciplinary hearing and hear all the misdemeanours and they agreed she could return but would be on a final warning. Two days later she misbehaved to the extent that the college excluded her. And you are saying that her behaviour doesn't warrant being grounded for two weeks? I'm pretty sure if I had posted saying my niece was excluded from college but I won't punish her that I would be flamed.
Granted she didn't burn the house down but she did smoke, swear and behave in such a manner that a college (who has a duty of inclusion to pupils) thought it severe enough to exclude her. If punishing her is wrong then perhaps I need to go back to the college and tell them they are being unreasonable?

The exclusion is the punishment though! College have done that for you.

Express your disappointment and have discussions about the consequences (of less education) and her plan for the future. Punishing her further clouds the issue in my opinion. It keeps her suppressed, lacking in empowerment and focused on negativity. A self destructing cycle. The girl needs an olive branch to inspire change.

You can be angry, but all the time helping her get on a path to something. Lead the way. More punishment puts her focus on the wrong things (you!) instead of dealing with what's going on and how to move forward.

prosaver

in two years she be gone anyway.






try and get her in a quiet place like sitting a car or going for a long walk.
and tell her your trying to help her and treat her like a friend.
.your on her side to make her happy.
tell her you love her. and care for her.
see what happens

foolofbeans

thank you for your insights. I definitely need to change my mindset but it's going to be a challenge!
Yesterday was a good day. The girls asked to go to the shop and I agreed. I had mentioned perhaps it may be nice to offer the cost of the tobacco back to DH and when they came back they gave me the money for it. I gave them it back immediately as I said I just wanted the gesture and them to be genuinely sorry.
So today can start on a much more positive note and we are going to sit down and talk about what is expected and what they should expect from me. It's careers shop tomorrow for niece to see about apprenticeships and I'm going to ask them to choose a physical hobby such as swimming or judo as they could really do with getting out and letting off some steam.
I may join an exercise group to as my body needs it and my mind could probably do with some too!

Pollycat

foolofbeans wrote: »

thank you for your insights. I definitely need to change my mindset but it's going to be a challenge!
Yesterday was a good day. The girls asked to go to the shop and I agreed. I had mentioned perhaps it may be nice to offer the cost of the tobacco back to DH and when they came back they gave me the money for it. I gave them it back immediately as I said I just wanted the gesture and them to be genuinely sorry.
So today can start on a much more positive note and we are going to sit down and talk about what is expected and what they should expect from me. It's careers shop tomorrow for niece to see about apprenticeships and I'm going to ask them to choose a physical hobby such as swimming or judo as they could really do with getting out and letting off some steam.
I may join an exercise group to as my body needs it and my mind could probably do with some too!

Sounds a positive step forward.
Well done. :T

prosaver

Glad things calmed down..
anyways good luck..be happy