Parenting: who comes first?

FBaby

it takes a braver person to take on the challenge and see it through. the bad times and the good. and you know what? That's being a parent. and those that regret it? perhaps they were just crap parents and blaming the child.

I think you are confusing things. What I think Mrs P is saying is that the experience of parenting hasn't been what she expected, and through the stress of the unexpected, she sometimes look back and wonder what life would be like without any of it.

That doesn't mean that she was a bad parent at all and didn't take the challenge. As a matter of fact, I am reading it the exact opposite, she is taking the challenge head on and that's what brings on the frustrations.

There seem to be some mums here who see themselves as heroes here for having sacrifice all their needs for their kids. I personally think that this can actually be very damaging to the children is giving them a false sense of their own importance. If you spent 18 years seeing their needs go first before anyone's else, they will be faced with a difficult time when they realise that it doesn't extent to the rest of the world.

As everything, it comes down to a good balance, ie. if a parent makes a decision to put their needs first, it is not always a bad thing, as long as they ensure that the impact on the child is dealt with love and attention and maybe further sacrifices to minimise it.

VfM4meplse

Jagraf wrote: »

Do you not think you can be so hurt being a parent that you regret it? How about if you love your child so much but they abandon you? What about if they are constantly suffering through illness? What about if you have been through an acrimonious divorce and sometimes you don't even know where your child is? Do you think you only regret it if you don't love them?

Yes these are all incredibly difficult circumstances, but the parent will also have known the joy of loving their child. Otherwise we would go through life taking no risks, and choosing to live a mediocre existence through a fear of what might happen.

You're on a slippery slope once you lose sight of the positive, and there are positives to be found in every situation.

mumps

I think alot of people aren't very honest and it isn't seen as acceptable for mothers to say it wasn't all joy, easier for dads somehow. I have 4, I love them and have had lots of fun and proud moments. None of them have ever been in trouble with the police, they all did well academically but sometimes I think how much easier life would have been if I had only had one or two. I wouldn't have wanted to miss out on being a mother but did I need to do it four times?

In my case with two close together then a 16 year gap and then two more close together the whole thing did go on a bit. I was pregnant at 17 and still had one at uni when I reached the old SRP age of 60. I was never top of the list of priorities for my whole adult life. I now do lots of unpaid, and I sometimes feel unappreciated, childcare with grandchildren.

The thing is which one or two or three would I wish to be without and that would be impossible.

On balance it has been good and worthwhile but not always easy. I advise my kids to stick to one or two kids, with all the worries in the modern world I think it is probably enough.

Jagraf

VfM4meplse wrote: »

Yes these are all incredibly difficult circumstances, but the parent will also have known the joy of loving their child. Otherwise we would go through life taking no risks, and choosing to live a mediocre existence through a fear of what might happen.

You're on a slippery slope once you lose sight of the positive, and there are positives to be found in every situation.

Some people can love their child as a person but absolutely hate being a parent. Maybe it's the joy of knowing that child rather than ever being its parent.

I do feel the definition of parent can mean so many different things to so many people.

pigpen

mumps wrote: »

The thing is which one or two or three would I wish to be without and that would be impossible.

My nanna said a few times to me (until I had a massive tantrum about it) "you shouldn't have had all these 'kids'" ... "Which should I get rid of???! Who do you wish we didn't have? Who do you think is not worthy of life or love?" ... pee'd me right off!

SingleSue

I gave up pretty much all my plans when I became a parent. Not straight away of course, I did get it back on track at one point but then their disabilities became too much to juggle with a career (and the lack of childcare available for their needs), which meant that I had to completely give up on it.

Do I regret having children? Not at all, although it was a different life to the one I had thought I would have and at times, a living hell, it has been enriching all the same.

Do I resent having children? There have been times, not many but a few where I have seen friends still enjoying a social life when their children were quite young. At these times though, I reminded myself how far the boys have come, how different to the predictions for them, tell myself off and realise it has been worth it.

I've finally emerged out the other side of the roundabout of being a parent of disabled children. Life actually feels pretty good right now, I have a quiet social life (better than the no social life I had for the last 20 odd years), with occasional evenings out to gigs and even better, I have amazing boys who are respectful, intelligent and absolutely lovely people.

indiepanda

emsywoo123 wrote: »

The replies to my post have been insightful.

Anyone who regrets becoming a parent has my complete pity, how utterly depressing.

I think what is really depressing is seeing the damage a parent who didn't want children can do to their children. Parents had a choice about becoming one, even if things didn't turn out the way they planned, children had no say in the matter.

My recent ex has major commitment issues (hence being the ex) and thinks women are out to tie men down and take away their freedom, and I know from the little he has said about his dad that this attitude came from him.

His dad told him having children was the worst thing he ever did - this from a man who had 5 children - three with his first wife and then after he divorced he had two a whole generation younger with his second. Why he was so weak as to do it again when he didn't enjoy it the first time is beyond me. Not as if they had a horrible lifestyle through lack of money either - he was a sports journalist and sounds like he was very successful, very nice large house in Richmond, money for holidays etc. I gather from a friend of my ex's he also used to complain that if he didn't have kids he could have had a Ferrari. (my sympathy is not high). Whether genes means my ex would have ended up like him anyway I don't know, but I suspect nuture (or lack of) has a lot to do with it.

I always knew I didn't want children - my mum blamed her depression on having had kids - which I knew was a lie as we were pretty easy kids, and turned out she'd first been depressed ten years before she had me (the eldest) - even she's admitted in more recent years it wasn't true. Just the idea I might grow up into someone who would say something so foul to my own children made it not worth the risk.

In any case, for all the fact that most people who have families will tell you it's the best thing they ever did, most studies into happiness tell a different story and that having children doesn't make you happier. So I don't worry I've missed out too much, and at least I am not facing the guilt of being a bad parent.

As to the question of where children's needs should come - I would generally say ahead of the parents, but I think a lot of families are placing children's wants above parents needs, and that's wrong too. Burnt out parents aren't good for children, any more than spoilt kids cope well in the real world. As a parent, you need to do what is necessary to leave you physically and mentally well so that you can be there for your children. Being a martyr to their hobbies and interests as seems to be the case in some families and then collapsing in a heap due to overwork yourself isn't in anyone's interests. It is not selfish or indulgent to look after yourself too.

I have complete admiration for those who are good parents, some of my friends are amazing parents. But I do wish those of us who didn't want to join them weren't made out to be odd in some way (especially us women - seems to be a bit less so for men). We get told we're selfish, but surely what is more selfish is going ahead and resenting the kids and letting them know it.

heuchera

Jojo_the_Tightfisted wrote: »

Well, leaving the violence aside (the reason I became a single parent was because I took a beating rather than him thrashing a two year old with his belt for the first time.), I spent the next few years stuck in dead end jobs that would give me enough time - barely - to get to the extortionately priced childcare to pick them up. And, of course, being seen as the archetypal Single Mum, so not getting jobs on that basis.

I love both my girls, but I certainly didn't intend to become a single parent when I had them. I wanted to earn a good wage, buy a house, a holiday once a year, a driving licence, that kind of thing. None of those things happened. I also harboured a desire to play some music occasionally. He smashed my guitar into a million pieces and, to make sure I didn't get any more ideas above my station, he smashed my stereo by throwing it at me, so there wasn't any music at home at all.

Their childhoods consisted of never sleeping enough, lousy accommodation, always running late even when leaving early (public transport), having to drag them round the supermarket after a fifteen hour day or at the weekend, not being able to function after getting in from work and just passing out on the sofa, never being able to go on trips or pay for them to have nice things, do the activities they wanted to and, I admit it, I was bored when I wasn't asleep. I wanted adult company, the chance to go to a gig and watch some live music, the chance to sit down without somebody whining at me that the other one had done something. The eldest slept with her eyes practically open - I could turn onto my side in my room at 4am and she'd be instantly awake all day. The other one could stay awake until midnight. She'd wake up fine at a normal time and be happy until she found I hadn't put the right pair of socks on the top of the pile of clothes, or I put the jumper between the shirt and the vest, not between the vest and the shirt and she would go ballistic. Or I looked at her a bit funny. Or the wind was blowing in the wrong direction. And the effort to get her down the road to school resulted in her being late, which meant grief from the school. Like I wanted to be made late for work.

Oh, and Daddy acquired saint like status because I wouldn't badmouth Daddy (the GP didn't record my visit after the battering and I certainly didn't tell them he'd tried to thrash the littlest, as Social Services would have descended upon me like a tons of bricks and Nice Mr Middleclass Boy was an expert flirt, salesman and kickboxer/bodybuilder who I genuinely thought would convince them it was all in my mind and would then kill me at his own leisure). So I apparently deliberately kept them short of fun things, a nice home, holidays and happiness because I was bad and wicked and spiteful. Not like Daddy.


Like I said, I love them both. But the life I had was outright miserable, and it's only since they've left home that I've been a regular gigging musician, instrumental tutor and worked in a school. Which I enjoy - I'm good at it. But I could have been doing this twenty years ago. I should have been doing this twenty years ago.



But I'm a bad mother because I didn't see that life as everything I had ever wanted. [shrug]



If you have the right person (and they don't turn overnight into a violent swine, like mine did), you're supported to be ourself and take care of the kids, so it's not a sacrifice or a waste. But if you don't, and you're not a saint, it's misery - if nothing else, because that doesn't mean you didn't want to do your best, you tried your best, but it just wasn't good enough.

Yes, it sounds like your bitterness is more to do with your choice of partner/childrens father and your poor financial situation rather than the kids themselves.


If the girls went on to be live with or be brought up by their dad (you mention you became free of the responsibility, so presumably it went to someone else?), as their mother you would obviously never have allowed that to happen if he were a terrible father who was violent towards them.


All interesting feedback for the OP, and interesting to hear peoples experiences, good or bad.

splishsplash

I chose to have children (along with my ex-husband), so I didn't really look at it as putting my needs above theirs at any stage. My choice, my responsibility to care for the dependent babies I made, so my primary need was to make sure they were looked after.

I was a lone parent to my three children since my youngest turned two years old. In order to look after them in the way I wanted, I needed money, so following my career and dreams and ambitions worked with that, not against it. I got to move up a career path, run a small business, parent my children pretty much full time and earn enough to provide well for them.

I found it extremely difficult at times, but never regretted it. I've always been a hard worker and I've never been a martyr to my children. I would never consider myself to have 'dedicated' my life to them, but all choices in my life were predicated by the one to have children. Without children, of course my life would have been different. I don't know if it would have been better, but certainly different.
I can't help feeling my life has been fuller because I've had children, but that's just because they've taken up so much of my time and my life that I can't imagine what I would have done otherwise to fill my days. (Actually, not strictly true: now that the youngest has moved away to university, I'm finding that I'm remarkably good at doing absolutely nothing for hours on end ).

I've never resented my children, but have been annoyed beyond measure by them at times. I love them fiercely but I'm delighted for them to all scarper on a Sunday evening and have peace and quiet in the house again. I talk to them all every day and I'm happy to be here for them, but have no desire to be caught up in their dramas. I want the very best for them, but would never expect anything from them.

I'm sure some of them will run into trouble, but there's no point in worrying about that, it won't stop it happening. I don't know how I'll react to choices they make that I have a problem with, we'll have to wait and see.
I'm thankful that they seem to be reasonably decent people with their heads on reasonably straight. I'm acutely aware that we're only ever a heartbeat away from change, so I try not to take anything for granted.

Andypandyboy

splishsplash wrote: »

. I'm acutely aware that we're only ever a heartbeat away from change, so I try not to take anything for granted.

A good philosophy.