Getting elderly dad to look after house

Gleek

Thank you I tried to make it as honest as possible without being too emotional about it. I failed a little on the latter, but I was hoping to get it across just how everything happens (or rather doesn't happen) if refusal is given.

Reams

[quote=[Deleted User];discussion/5041745]Following on from other threads about him re: washing machine.

Re-cap, he lives on his own in a nice flat, hes almost 80. BUT, even though hes got a stack of money he wont spend a penny on the house.

Hes got no washing machine, he used to rely on others to do his washing for him. Despite many offers to get him one he refuses. So he washes clothes by hand in the sink and to be honest, they're not clean.

This was a brand new flat when he moved in 20 years ago. Same carpet (now threadbare) because he think they last forever (they were cheapest ones you can get now).

Furniture has seen better days - mixture of some stuff I've talked him into but mostly stuff hes had for free off people. His bedroom furniture is literally pre-war and falling to bits.

To be his honest, the entire house is grubby. He wont use a vaccum cleaner so instead struggles with a manual push one. He wont get help or a cleaner either.

His bathroom is borderline unfit for human habitation. The toilet is like the one off trainspotting if not worse. He just never cleans it or thinks it needs cleaning.

Recently he had a leak from his shower. Water dripped into kitchen, down walls. Housing Association came around did something and stopped drip but they still want to take part of ceiling down now to investigate. (Its all damp and of course wallpaper is peeling off now.).

Now he says he doesnt want the hassle because its stopped dripping now. Pointed out it looks awful - his answer so what its only me that lives here.

I spent hours on the phone trying to sort this out and now he says he cant cope with the stress of having the work done. I did it all and got it sorted!

Its more like I imagine, can;t be bothered and doesnt want to risk having to even spend a penny of his money.

I've tried and tried to get him to spend money to make life easier for himself. I've just about given up - there's only so much I can do. Any attempt to point out that x needs replacing or y is dirty and all I get is the answer - I'm 80 years old I don't need the grief and whats the point anyway its only me that lives here.

To be honest, its so bad that wife wont drink cup of tea there and is careful where she sits. We've got to tell the kids not to use the toilet too - its that bad.

On a personal level, mentioned the shower. It started leaking so he just stopped using it. For a week. Only because I phoned these people and got is sorted -in his head it seems acceptable to not have a shower for an extended period. Can guarantee if this shower had broken and cost £100 to fix his attutude would be oh well I just wont have a shower ever.

Before he had a walk-in shower fitted he couldn't get in the bath very easily. I dread to think how long he went before washing.

His clothes as well are dirty. Remember, he hand washes things. I've given up trying to get him a washing machine even if I pay. He refuses point blank to have one.
Other day he put on a while coat/jacket. Somehow had blue paint on the arm (and it was grubby anyway) and said was it ok to wear. I said no theres paint on it - his answer oh well no-one will notice (umm yes they will).

Im getting to the point where Im about to give up. Im happy to do all the arranging and paying for these things but he just refuses. He is so stubborn and wont change.

On a side note. The money thing. Hes gone away for a few days (shock that hes spent some money!). This morning though - hes struggled to walk the mile to bus pick up point because he wont spend £5 on a taxi. He walks with a stick and this will wear him out for the day. Defies belief sometimes.....

Any suggestions? I must admit Im at the point of thinking sod him if he wants to live like a pig in a slum then let him. I've tried to help and be honest with him but hes just not interested.[/QUOTE]
I had this with my late father, although he was generous to a fault, he wouldn't spend money on himself. Washing sheets in the bath rather than the washer and so on like your dad.
I lived feet away from him and was in his house ever single day.
The problem looking back was his intense need for privacy.


When he was admitted to A&E, the Indian Doctor looked appalled that I had no idea of certain things about him but in 50 something years I had never seen my dad in less than a singlet vest while getting changed. I'd never seen my mother other than fully dressed either. I'm only just thinking that now. Sounds so Victorian.


I bought him new shirts and socks, all put in a drawer and never worn to wear frayed collars.
Took him to a hotel to see his relatives.


The other guests were staring, but it was the privacy again. If dad chose old frayed shirts it was up to him.


I had the horrible cups not fit for drinking plus a massive spider web between sofa and stairs harbouring a spider the size of a saucer.
Not allowed to disturb it, Welsh thing.


I look into my soul for anything that might say I neglected my dad and there is nothing!

Brallaqueen

Take comfort in the fact you have tried your best and then, for your sake, Just Leave it.

He doesn't want your help now, he hasn't wanted your help in the past and I really doubt this will change in the future. Some people do not want to be helped and you are just dashing yourself against a rock here.

[Deleted User]

irishjohn wrote: »

I think your last paragraph sums up all the advice you are likely to get here - if the desire to change and keep everything in order does not exist then you are on a hiding to nothing.

is there only you or are there other family members alive and able to get involved

Brother - completely useless. Actually living there at moment. Kicked out by his girlfriend - dont ask.

[Deleted User]

Thanks for all the support. Looks like its a fairly common situation.

Yes, when he was younger they were very poor. No inside toilet etc. Thats always his excuse - when he was younger they had no money so he doesn't like wasting money now.

My argument is that hes got so much saved that spending a little to make his life easier is not a waste. But he doesn't see that. Its like monopoly money - going into a savings account for the sake of it. To be honest, I always thought he liked to see how much he had but realised recently he doesnt really know how much hes got so its not that. It just makes him happy to think hes not wasting money and upsets him if hes got to spend any.

His grip on money is unreal too. Numerous stories of how clueless is he is. If I ever go anywhere with him or take him out I get accused of being wasteful with money and hes constantly criticising what I spend money on. For instance, one day I pointed out how much car loan, insurance, petrol cost. His answer - you must be mad I wouldnt bother! Really annoyed me that one - yeh right so how do I get to work, visit you. Idiotic comment from him.

Asked me about my new job the other day (I do contract work) and he always asks me how much I get - I never tell him. Made the mistake of saying yes its decent money. His answer - £100 a week? Yes Dad. His answer -ohh good money that is £100 a week. Are you serious?

But as others have said, I cant do anything without his permission. He would go nuts.

At the moment, I try to sort things out and try to take him into things. I've tried being honest and brutal with him but he just wont listen and gets upset.

Annoying thing is the things I have managed to talk him into in the past hes been very happy with. I get something sorted then he tells me how great it is.

Getting his shower sorted was endless arguments. He couldnt get in the bath and wasnt washing so I arranged a grant with social services. He dug his feet in - didnt want the hassle becuase he could 'manage' (i.e. not bother washing). Then they said he had to pay a few £100 and I thought that was it but then they came back and said ok its free.

In the end, I think he had it because he was getting a bargain i.e.free more than anyting else. Now he tells me how good is shower is and how glad he is he decided to have it... AAAARRRRGGGHHH!

margaretclare

nearlyrich wrote: »

It is quite stressful for older people to have work done and so I can understand why he doesn't want the hassle. He is of a generation who didn't have bathrooms as standard ( unless you are upper class) and having a shower/bath daily was impossible so in his head it's no worse than that. Clutter and mess take over he may not know how to clean the house and in his head it not worth paying for a washing machine just for him. It is pretty stressful for family when you have a situation like this but ultimately it's his mess and he is entitled to live as he wants even if it drives you away.

I don't agree. Paul's Dad is of the same generation as me and DH.

I grew up in a tiny cottage, in the kind of poverty that isn't seen now because there were simply no benefits, none at all. But I still remember my grandmother's mantra 'Soap and water are cheap' and 'We may be poor but there's no need to look poor'.

All the years I went to school, even grammar school, we heated water in a pan on the fire and had an all-over wash in the kitchen. Piped water had only been installed in the late 30s but mostly, it was nicer to use heated rain-water. It really is nicer than tap-water, feels softer.

Electricity was put into that cottage in 1958 when I was a student nurse. It had been put into the others 20 years earlier but my granny was too ill to be bothered with it, in fact she died when I was 3. The first thing my mum wanted to get once she had electricity? Not a TV, as the neighbours urged her to get. A second-hand washing machine with power wringers. She thought all her Christmases had come at once. And then, the landlord was forced to upgrade the cottages and she got a bath! Bliss for her.

Now, DH and I use our shower daily. A few years ago when his oft-replaced knee flared up again, he was in hospital and I had the shower upgraded to one with a lower step-in. I got no help or useful advice from OT/rehab when he was in hospital. Their idea was that a daily strip-wash was all that was necessary. Back to my childhood! No thank you, no way.

Whatever we grew up with, we have grown used to better conditions. The boys who did National Service, even if they hadn't a bath at home they'd have been used to showers in the army. If required we could go back to more spartan conditions, but we wouldn't choose to. And most people who live alone now have a washing-machine.

The idea of it being a 'woman's job' is, I agree, something that dies hard with many men. Not only older men, either! Paul has already had this situation of a bag of washing to be given to his brother's girl-friend to do.

I can't suggest anything helpful so I don't really know why I've written all this. As Dad appears to have all his marbles it's the way he is, and I can't think of anything Paul can do.

Errata

Re the money: it's not unusual for elderly people to become a bit paranoid about spending money
Re the dirt: can he see it? when did he have his eyes tested?

pollypenny

I must have been very lucky with my father, then.

He was always immaculate and would never go out in anything other than a clean white shirt: this was after being a miner and working in coal, having a hatred of being unclean.

It's a Welsh thing. :cool:

My mother had started having a cleaner before she died, so the cleaner continued and she also did my father's washing.

Paul, I feel sorry for you, and your father. I can only suggest that you pitch in and do some cleaning. He might like the fresh smell, at least.

Mojisola

margaretclare wrote: »

I don't agree. Paul's Dad is of the same generation as me and DH.

I grew up in a tiny cottage, in the kind of poverty that isn't seen now because there were simply no benefits, none at all. But I still remember my grandmother's mantra 'Soap and water are cheap' and 'We may be poor but there's no need to look poor'.

This was my family's experience, too.

Money was always very short and nothing was wasted but the house was always clean and everyone was "tidy" - their clothes might be old but they'd be clean and mended if necessary. Collars and cuffs on shirts were turned to give them some extra wear and keep them "respectable".

It's not so much a generational thing that some old people let things go - it's to do with their personality and very difficult for the people around them who want to help them but aren't allowed to.

Gleek

I get it totally. With my grandfather he also hated spending money and it was just going into savings/other bank accounts for nothing. The only thing he'd happily spend money on was alcohol. He liked to be seen having a huge wallet full of notes but he wouldn't spend them on anything useful - oh no!

It took a HUGE fight to get him to let us buy food!! He was used to purchasing bread buns, milk and a bottle of alcohol pretty much daily and he'd live on that (and again, despite us being dragged out in the middle of the night to pick him up/clear up after him/be screamed at - he said no to further help that we desperately needed so nothing happened).


Getting upset and shouting at him/pointing out that he's making silly mistakes doesn't help. If only it makes it WORSE and makes him defensive and makes it even harder for you.

It's easier to 'manipulate with love' and pick your battles. Don't fight the small stuff, let it slide and just 'oh yeah?'. Don't let it bother you and go for the bigger stuff.

You may also need to speak to him and be honest and open. Tell him that you're frightened that he's keeping it all as an inheritance but you would rather have him than anything else. That you're scared that something will happen to him and he'll get his feet caught and trip over the threadbare bits (again, been there. he had huge cut off bits of carpet that didn't fit the room that had been down longer than I've been alive (heading towards 30) so when he had to use a walker, he'd catch it/his feet on the edges of the carpet. There were threadbare bits where his chair was/where he walked daily through the rubbish piles on the floor/at the side of his bed in the front room) but he refused to have them taken up or replaced. ) that he'll not be able to call for help... when you get an inning there's all sorts that open up. You have to keep gently chipping - but in a way where he won't realise/catch on to you.

Get someone who is a good talker and quite firm (ie - will distract him when he wonders what you're doing/moves to go and have a look) to distract him and sit with him to keep him company to watch tv or a dvd or chat to him or something. Maybe with the kids over too so they add to the distraction. Then yourself or someone else try and clean bits and pieces in the kitchen or the bathroom, wipes sides, wash up, put things that are too far gone in the bin. If nothing else you know it's a little cleaner than it was and the food prep will be a little more hygenic and hopefully it'll make him more receptive to you doing both.

Perhaps when he's in the kitchen with you, let him see you washing up and pottering around and say you're cleaning up when he asks what you're doing and explain gently why. Or maybe do little and often each time you're there, target a different bit.

You do have to be SLOW and patient though. Getting angry and shouting or insulting him gets his back up and you won't get anywhere, it'll get him further set in his ways and against you.

Take care and look after yourself too. We're both poorly as a result of looking after him (my mum is disabled herself now and walks with a walker and I had a small heart attack from the stress and now have a heart condition)