Teenage Son Lying/Stealing Showing No Remorse

valk_scot

stressedoutmum wrote: »

He used to get £5 per week pocket money but that was stopped as he didn't do his chores which were doing the dishes in the evening with his brother and tidying his room - simple things and then we decided to pay him per job so to speak which is what we do now. He has a paper round on a Sunday and gets £5 per week for it and has agreed to pay £2.50 of this towards the £50 he still owes us. His telephone and ipad are locked away so he doesn't have access to them. I have made an appointment with my GP on my own tomorrow to see if they can help an I am trying very hard not to focus on the negative things but there is not a lot of positivity at the moment.

So basically he's got £2.50 a week to spend? Got to say that's not much for a 14 year old in this day and age. What does he use for money when he goes out with pals...lunches at the weekends, even just a drink while he's out?


I used to give my son £10 a week when he was that age. It wasn't dependant on doing chores, I've always expected chores done and they're not linked in with money. If you pay for everyday chores the message is that it doesn't matter if he doesn't do them as long as he doesn't mind losing the money. I don't think that's a great idea, I want the chores done anyway! On top of that my DS earned cash for extras, did car washing and odd jobs round the neighbourhood etc. If he needed more money for something then there was always the opportunity to earn it, he didn't need to be nicking money out my purse to do so.


His phone and table belong to him, he bought them out of Christmas and birthday money. Not my place to take them away.


Food? I don't buy much treat food and the kids are very fair on shares because I insist. If they want more sweets then the shop is down the road, use your own money! Half the time they don't bother, they don't want them so much that they'll pay for them.


I do think your son doesn't seem to have much control over his life and very few choices he can make for himself. He isn't allowed food options and has very little money to spend freely. If he does something you don't like he gets grief from you, whether it's because of a biscuit (minor) or stealing (major.) If he has a problem with school you don't talk to him about what he can do to improve things for himself you go storming into the school and take that control away from him. He steals money from your purse, you drag him off to the police. You say he's not popular but you take the two items which teenagers run their entire social lives through away from him.


Now I'm not condoning the stealing, far from it. But you do seem to have a pattern of telling him it's either my way or no way and coming down on him with some really heavy handed reactions. AS he says, grief at school and grief at home. Where's the support? Where's you listening to him? All I hear is how you talk at him and he doesn't listen.


Stealing and comfort eating are two attention seeking behaviours and he's undoubtably doing them because he's unhappy. If you try to look at and address the reasons behind the actions rather than simply punish the actions then you might get somewhere imho. All this over-reacting and dramatics (the police, !!!!!!, for a few pounds from your purse for sweets!) is just making him more unhappy and isolated from you.


If I were you I'd start by giving him a decent amount of pocket money per week and no questions asked as to how he spends it. Give him his phone back too. Insist he does his chores but you be with him while he's doing them, it's a good time to talk when you're doing chores together. Ask him how HE thinks he can improve things at school. Listen to him if he tells you. Stop nagging and stop overdramatizing, do not drag him to the GP hysterically demanding to be told what's wrong with him.


He sounds a perfectly normal boy to me but rather unhappy atm. You're not improving matters by all this constant harping on about him having to obey you in every detail to earn trust and controlling every penny, every mouthful and every moment. He's 14, in another four years he'll be an adult and you've got to start letting the dynamics change a bit rather than try to control him like a wayward toddler.

peachyprice

stressedoutmum wrote: »

On the day I found it he was being tormented at school I went straight to the school as soon as I found out and they acted on it that day. I have asked him for a list of names as to who is name calling him and I can sort it at school but he won't give me them. I have pleaded with him to talk to me to help him but he won't. He says he gets grief at home and grief at school. .

Which is great, but that doesn't mean the bullying will stop, they'll just be more covert about it. He probably got even more grief from the bullies for telling

Is there any way you can bring his change of school forward to easter instead of September?

dancingfairy

It sounds like he needs someone to be on 'his side', rather than school or parents which he may feel have an agenda. Is there anyone like the princes trust in your area or a local youth group or connexions? They will be in the best place to know whether this is teenage angst or a sign of an eating disorder or some sort of mild learning difficulties.
Also is there anything he is interested in that you can encourage? What does he want to do in the future? Would he consider volunteering? (although to be honest if he doesn't know what he wants to do and doesn't seem to have many hobbies or friends that doesn't necessarily indicate a problem).
I hope you can both get through this.
df

FBaby

Anytime he's stolen money its always gone on sugary drinks, sweets etc. I stopped buying them for a while as he was gorging on them. He has pudding every evening and I buy sweets 2/3 times a week but just enough to hand out without any spare in the cupboard because he does take them so he is not deprived of treats either. ??

For a while we were finding packets upon packets of empty sweet wrappers in hidden in his drawers - behind the toilet cistern - under the sofa and every time we asked where he got them he said people bought him them which we knew they didn't but couldn't prove. They were not little but full family size bags at one point we counted 17 and have not got a clue where they came from and I dread to think?

I really believe that is normal behaviour for that age. My son is 3 years older, but I also find sweets and wrappers in his bedroom recently. It surprised me because he has never been that keen on sugary food. Unfortunately, I also noticed that he was getting fatter around his stomach and face. What happened is that for the first time this year, he is alone at home with his sister after school and therefore has open access to the cupboard. It's only natural. We had a talk, about watching what we eat etc... At first he was upset and only seemed to encourage him to hide what he was snacking on, but a few weeks later, he said to be that he realised the needed to watch what he was eating for snack and took it upon himself to reduce it. I strongly believe that it is working because he has control of it and doesn't feel he needs to hide things because he knows I won't tell him off, just remind him of the consequences of it.

Interestingly, I was talking about this to a friend of mine who has children the same age as mine. She said that she refused to buy any snacks because her kids raided the cupboards (they really are all the same!), but that she had noticed recently that wrappers appeared in their bedrooms. They have admitted that they use whatever pocket money they get to stop by the corner shop on their way home.

I too as a kid use to have a real sweet tooth and use to hide biscuits under my bed (my parents love to remind me of it!). In the end, I didn't get fat. I started becoming more health conscious in my 20s and wanted to be slim so started to watch carefully what I ate. I still have a sweet tooth now in my 40s, but know that I need to be careful and control how much I ingest. I rather teach this to my kids than make them feel bad for what is really very common at that age.

pleasedelete

Why is a child eating a hot cross bun in his own house stealing.

You may be able to access parenting classes free of charge locally.

My son had £80 a month at age 14- for mobiles, snacks, going out with friends, weekly club etc. seems a lot but he pays for everything himself. That said at 16 he now has £450 in savings.

Vikipollard

Might be worth asking the GP about diabetes. Just wondering if there could be something like that in the background with the OD-ing on sugary cr*p and being aggressive towards you.


Other than that, discuss the ADHD/Aspergers possibilities with the relevant people and see where that takes you.


For what it's worth, I think you were right to take him to the police. I said I would if mine ever gave me reason to, but thankfully they didn't.


Just be sure that any consequences continue to become realities if he misbehaves. There's nothing more pointless than the parents who continually say "if you do that once more.." then never actually mete out the punishment when little Johnny does it several times more.

thorsoak

Now I admit to just having skimmed the thread, after having struggled with the first post, so apologies if this is off course.

My take on this is - you need to be (1) consistent and (2) less tolerant of unacceptable behaviour. You have explained ad-nauseum when his behaviour is unacceptable - now you have to be consistent in your punishments/penalties for bad behaviour. This does mean hard work on your part - you have to take the electronic wizardy and LOCK IT AWAY for however you say the confiscation has to be. I would drive around for days with TVs/music centres in my car when my mob had transgressed!

It's very hard - but you have to ensure that he has no access to other people's possessions/money - and if that means that locks have to be put on doors etc, then so be it.

However, although these are draconian measures, you should choose the battle lines wisely - denying an adolescent boy food is just petty - just lock away the goodies, if he eats his share in one hit, then he will just have to watch everybody else enjoying his.

The lesson he has to learn now is that actions have consequences. You don't have to give him treats for just behaving in an acceptable manner!

pmlindyloo

First of all my sympathies for what you are all going through.

I totally understand how angry/frustrated you are and , if you will forgive me, this might be one of the problems.

I believe that you have to try and separate what is 'normal' behaviour for a teenager and what is not.

Obviously stealing is not normal behaviour. Often there is a reason behind such behaviour and you need to try and understand what it is. I agree with others that this is likely to be linked with some form of 'bullying' by his peers and he is trying to be liked by buying them sweets etc. You say the school has dealt with it and yes, this may be the case on the surface but teachers cannot be there all the time checking and I suspect that you son is still facing some kind of bullying.

Of course his buying sweets for them is not going to help - we adults know this - but for young people their peers are so important to them - 'fitting in' is vital. Your son needs to find a new set of friends (I've a suggestion below.)

It sounds as if your son's self esteem is rock bottom. He sounds as if he enjoys physical things so I wonder whether classes in boxing/judo/karate might give him some self confidence.

At the moment he is getting aggro at school and aggro at home.

Of course he needs to understand that stealing is wrong and of course you need to set boundaries and of course as a teenager he is going to rebel.

What is important is that these boundaries are set correctly. At the moment you feel everything he does is not conforming to your boundaries. You need to look carefully at the boundaries that you are setting and allow him some freedom of choice. At the moment it seems it is very rigid and I think that is because you are so afraid that he is going to take the wrong path.

May I make a few suggestions?

Give him some pocket money not linked to doing the normal chores( like keeping bedroom tidy/setting table etc) but just plain pocket money. Out of this he can start paying back what he owes but the rest he can spend. You won't like what he spends it on but no matter. This recognises the fact that he is growing up and needs to have some control and learn through making mistakes. He could earn extra money through cleaning the car etc (not his normal chores)

Let him join a club and make friends outside of school. Invite the friends round.

Try to praise him whenever you get the opportunity and try not to belittle him in front of his brother (ie any telling off should be done in private)

I am not advocating allowing him to do what he likes but I am suggesting that you do not go overboard because of his stealing. Most of the rest is normal teenage behaviour. Don't ignore it but do try to keep a sense of humour. If I had a pound for every time my teenage daughter and I came to 'blows' I would be a rich woman. She is now a delightful young woman and I am extremely proud. She also says 'do you remember when you said..........? well you were right!' It is a long hard slog but we all get there.

I know you feel that you have failed because he has stolen but I do think that his need to 'fit in' and be liked has been so overpowering that everything that you have taught him has gone out of the window. To him it was what was the lesser of the two evils - taking money from your family or buying friendship? If you can understand this then I think it will become much easier for you to understand what has happened. Never underestimate the power of peer pressure.

Take care, be forgiving of yourselves and your son and I hope things get easier soon.

securityguy

Here's a child who's clearly socially isolated by his parents (storming into school, talking to his friends), who has no control over his own life, no money (five quid a week pocket money for a teenager?), and whose social isolation is exacerbated by his parents' use of removal of what is for most children their main social conduit as a punishment. His parents behave absurdly over food ("no, you can't have a biscuit? Seriously?). So far, so silly.

But in the midst of all this we have an incident involving, from context, a serious issue of sexual misbehaviour to which he responded by making a photograph of his (from context) genitalia and sending it electronically, which takes you into a world of potential illegality and safeguarding concerns most of us have nightmares about, but his mother is more worried about hot cross buns and biscuits.

The whole lot of them need help.

j.e.j.

FBaby wrote: »

My son is 3 years older, but I also find sweets and wrappers in his bedroom recently. It surprised me because he has never been that keen on sugary food.

Give it time and it won't be sweet wrappers you'll be finding in his bedroom, it'll be condom wrappers :rotfl:

But that'll be a whole nother thread..