Family cut themselves out of my son's life

jellyhead

Lannie, I see your point but some forum members know first hand about such toxic relationships with a parent or partner, and are recognising Wiggy's mum's 'tricks'.

Perhaps in the future, once Wiggy has successfully managed to 'escape' the relationship she could compromise and start to have a relationship with her mother on her terms, but if I were her I think it would always have to be with the two as a pair, so she would know how her mother was treating Wiglet and whether she was behaving abnormally.

Like you I've only ever had loving relationships with family and inlaws. If I had been reading this thread even a year ago I'd probably be thinking of Wiggy's mum's side, knowing how my own mum or MIL would be feeling.

But this year I've taken in two teenagers from a similar sort of home, and one of them still feels sick at the thought of contact with that parent.

It's not relevant to Wiggy's situation, but I'm just saying that until I saw with my own eyes the way that some parents speak to their children (while presenting a normal, even charming exterior to the outside world) I couldn't have imagined how horrible it could be, and the effect that a controlling, belittling parent could have on a child's self esteem.

I think that Wiggy needs a break from her mother, and needs to feel that she is safe from contact and will not have to speak to her mother unless she wants to. She needs to know that she CAN escape.

duchy

LannieDuck wrote: »

How's she supposed to compromise if wiggy won't talk to her?

We're expecting her to guess that wiggy actually wants her to take an interest in wiggy as well as wiglet. That's obvious to us because we've got wiggy's input, but if she thinks wiggy's p1ssed, maybe she's trying to maintain a relationship with her grandson without annoying wiggy further? (Obviously we know that's only making things worse.) I'm sure lots of people will poo-pooh that and say she knows exactly what she's doing. Perhaps. But at present her options are:

* Respect wiggy's wishes... and lose contact with her grandson.
* Try and continue to see grandson whilst involving wiggy as little as possible in an attempt to annoy wiggy as little as possible.
* Guess the answer and start taking an interest in wiggy as well as grandson. (Incidentally, if a text came through asking how wiggy is and what she could do to help resolve the situation... would we still think that was harassment?)

I'm not sure she really has any good options there Yes, she bought it on herself, but we're expecting her to act rationally when we've already established she's pretty irrational.

I'm not intending to take her side in this, despite appearances to the contrary (!) (I think she's behaved terribly, and if she was my MIL we'd have had a blazing row long ago). But getting her arrested is rather a leap.

Incidentally, she claims that that conversation about going abroad happened differently. But we've had that discussion up thread already.

I think I'm going to bow out of this for now. Whilst I'd love to continue the conversation, I don't think it'll be helpful for wiggy.

I think we're all very protective of our children and if one of your child's grandparents had forcibly snatched your baby ...and then after it had all calmed down then made demands to take your child away on holiday-insisting it had to be abroad when you tried to suggest a compromise ...and making it clear you weren't welcome. Would you (even without the keep trying to contact you when you'd asked them not to) really feel they were within their rights or would you feel they were trying to undermine you as a parent and weren't the best people to be around your child ? Quite honestly grandparents who won't/can't respect parents aren't a good influence in a child's life if the parents are doing a good job already.

KxMx

I too was slightly surprised that the police visit outcome is going to be an arrest.
But, as others have said, they know the full situation, history, have seen the evidence etc etc and have made the call as to the way forward. Police don't always get it right but in this case i'd go with their judgement.

my-user-name

Maybe wiggys mother might want to hear from her own daughter why she dosent want her in her life or her sons life,I guess its the not knowing which she finds frustrating right now.


Why couldn't wiggy of sat down with a pen and paper and said something to the words"this is is one and only time I will be in contact with you and this is the reason why"then it would be up to wiggy to tell her mother exactly why she dosent want her in hers or wiglets life anymore.


Of course wiggy has told us what she thinks about her mother....but she hasn't actually told her mother has she?
For all her mothers faults she needs to know what she has done in the past which is unforgivable...but wiggy needs to tell her why it is unforgivable.Her mother may be oblivious to how wiggys thinking and once she does then maybe she can accept it and move on.
At the end of the letter she could say that she dosent want any contact and if she does try to contact her then she will take her to court for harassment.
All of this could have been avoided if wiggy and her mother could of had a mediation meeting with the relevant authority's,no harm could of happened to wiggy and maybe her mother,once she heard wiggys reasons,then maybe she would of let go and got on with her own life knowing that once wiglets turned 16 she can go and give her side of this sad and sorry story.


And Im speaking as a nana who was denied contact many years ago,when your child suddenly dosent want you in their life and wont tell you why,then its heartbreaking and Ive gone through years not knowing why,I can see wiggys mother doing exactly the same.


And yes,many lies was said about me,none that I could prove was lies,her mother hasn't a cat in hells chance of gaining access to wiglet in any court of law so maybe a letter or mediation might help her mother come to terms with it and move on with her life.


And now I,ll probably get flamed.

meritaten

my-user-name wrote: »

Maybe wiggys mother might want to hear from her own daughter why she dosent want her in her life or her sons life,I guess its the not knowing which she finds frustrating right now.


Why couldn't wiggy of sat down with a pen and paper and said something to the words"this is is one and only time I will be in contact with you and this is the reason why"then it would be up to wiggy to tell her mother exactly why she dosent want her in hers or wiglets life anymore.


Of course wiggy has told us what she thinks about her mother....but she hasn't actually told her mother has she?
For all her mothers faults she needs to know what she has done in the past which is unforgivable...but wiggy needs to tell her why it is unforgivable.Her mother may be oblivious to how wiggys thinking and once she does then maybe she can accept it and move on.
At the end of the letter she could say that she dosent want any contact and if she does try to contact her then she will take her to court for harassment.
All of this could have been avoided if wiggy and her mother could of had a mediation meeting with the relevant authority's,no harm could of happened to wiggy and maybe her mother,once she heard wiggys reasons,then maybe she would of let go and got on with her own life knowing that once wiglets turned 16 she can go and give her side of this sad and sorry story.


And Im speaking as a nana who was denied contact many years ago,when your child suddenly dosent want you in their life and wont tell you why,then its heartbreaking and Ive gone through years not knowing why,I can see wiggys mother doing exactly the same.


And yes,many lies was said about me,none that I could prove was lies,her mother hasn't a cat in hells chance of gaining access to wiglet in any court of law so maybe a letter or mediation might help her mother come to terms with it and move on with her life.


And now I,ll probably get flamed.

I certainly wouldn't flame you! You have succinctly put across another point of view and one which from your own experience is very valid.
I am so sorry you have lost contact with your grandchild in this way.
BUT, you sound like a very normal, reasonable woman - unlike Wiggys mother.
Some of us know Wiggy from her previous threads so know what her parent is capable of.
I think further back in the thread someone advised Wiggy to write everything in a letter to her mother - she may have done so - and not told us. or she may have thought that this would enrage her mother and make matters worse.

I am a nan myself and love my grandchildren dearly - but, I also love my kids and couldn't imagine behaving the way wiggy's mother has towards Wiggy herself.

I can see how someone new to the situation may read this thread and think wiggy and us posters are harsh and unreasonable - as you don't know the background to this latest development.

We just have Wiggy and Wiglets well-being at heart - and truly believe that contact with this person is not right for her at the present time.

LannieDuck

my-user-name wrote: »

Maybe wiggys mother might want to hear from her own daughter why she dosent want her in her life or her sons life,I guess its the not knowing which she finds frustrating right now.


Why couldn't wiggy of sat down with a pen and paper and said something to the words"this is is one and only time I will be in contact with you and this is the reason why"then it would be up to wiggy to tell her mother exactly why she dosent want her in hers or wiglets life anymore.


Of course wiggy has told us what she thinks about her mother....but she hasn't actually told her mother has she?
For all her mothers faults she needs to know what she has done in the past which is unforgivable...but wiggy needs to tell her why it is unforgivable.Her mother may be oblivious to how wiggys thinking and once she does then maybe she can accept it and move on.
At the end of the letter she could say that she dosent want any contact and if she does try to contact her then she will take her to court for harassment.
All of this could have been avoided if wiggy and her mother could of had a mediation meeting with the relevant authority's,no harm could of happened to wiggy and maybe her mother,once she heard wiggys reasons,then maybe she would of let go and got on with her own life knowing that once wiglets turned 16 she can go and give her side of this sad and sorry story.


And Im speaking as a nana who was denied contact many years ago,when your child suddenly dosent want you in their life and wont tell you why,then its heartbreaking and Ive gone through years not knowing why,I can see wiggys mother doing exactly the same.


And yes,many lies was said about me,none that I could prove was lies,her mother hasn't a cat in hells chance of gaining access to wiglet in any court of law so maybe a letter or mediation might help her mother come to terms with it and move on with her life.


And now I,ll probably get flamed.

Missprice was asking what i would suggest - this is pretty much exactly it (and I did suggest it someway back in the thread). I think it would be helpful if wiggy's Mum knew very clearly why wiggy's cutting her off and what the circumstances are (if there are any - there may not be) under which she would be allowed contact again. (Duchy - when you stopped contact with your Aunt, you had told her not to open your letters and she ignored you, you didn't just stop talking to her one day and not say why.)

The reason why most people were against it earlier is because any reply to the letter would probably upset wiggy further. That's still true, but as it happens wiggy's mum has continued to contact her via texts anyway. At least a letter would have made it all crystal clear, rather than this unexplained lack of contact.

For those asking whether I'd be happy for my DD's gran to spend time with DD under similar circumstances. Personally no, I would never leave gran alone with DD again (or at least for a good long time). But I might be willing to meet up in neutral places with her - soft play areas or something. Of course it would be conditional on gran's good behaviour. And the privilege of access could be withdrawn at any time. But that's me. I don't think wiggy would have been strong enough to do that at the start of this thread. Now... I think she might. But if she's happy with the direction things are going, then none of that matters anyway.

my-user-name

If wiggys mother has been this horrific(and Ive read wiggys other posts and I believe this to be true) then wiggy must let her mother know what these horrific situations has done to her and why suddenly shes had enough of them and wants nothing more to do with her.


Otherwise wiggy wont have peace in her life and neither will her mother.Yes of course her mother will see a different side to the story or she may end up agreeing with wiggy and with time she will learn to become a better human being.


I cried many rivers of tears at the time,still do but its taken me a lot of years coming to terms with the fact I don't know why my daughter did what she did and I guess I never will.


Who knows I could of been as horrific as wiggys mother and didn't know,the sad part is I still don't know many years later.


(Deep down I was a loving mum to her and I guess that's the only thing that keeps me sane)


Denying contact between nanas and grandchildren is more common than anyone thinks,can we all really be that bad)?

meritaten

yes Lannie - I have seen wiggy grow and change from a scared frightened 'child' to a mature woman over the last few threads. but, she is still scared and right now, to me its Wiggy and Wiglet who matter most. Her mother is a grown up and can 'deal' with things for a time - even if she doesn't understand right now - things can change in the future when WIGGY is strong enough to feel in control and able to cope.
Of course I feel some sympathy towards her - but right now Wiggy and Wiglet are a priority and the police obviously agree.

I can see your point of view too myusername. but it is early days yet.

LannieDuck

meritaten wrote: »

yes Lannie - I have seen wiggy grow and change from a scared frightened 'child' to a mature woman over the last few threads. but, she is still scared and right now, to me its Wiggy and Wiglet who matter most. Her mother is a grown up and can 'deal' with things for a time - even if she doesn't understand right now - things can change in the future when WIGGY is strong enough to feel in control and able to cope.
Of course I feel some sympathy towards her - but right now Wiggy and Wiglet are a priority and the police obviously agree.

I can see your point of view too myusername. but it is early days yet.

Actually, if wiggy's mum will be or has been arrested, I don't think it's early days anymore, I think it may be a point of no return.

meritaten

could be lannie - could be.

But, she has brought it on herself though hasn't she? she hasn't respected Wiggys wish for no contact, she hasn't respected the solicitors letter requesting no contact, she hasn't even respected the police going round to tell her no contact! now does a reasonable person act like that?
I do think the police must know something we don't (and that includes wiggy btw). they don't normally overreact in what is essentially a 'domestic' matter. I strongly suspect that when they interviewed this woman before she behaved badly, or said something, to sound alarm bells.