Compensation for delayed flights Discussion Area

Germush

Hi,

After many yards of emails between us many of which were difficult to understand, Easyjet is defending my small claims action in Feb 2013 saying that I am entitled to compensation for delay over 3.5 hours under EU regulation 261/2004 but not an additional claim for out of pocket expenses under article 19 Montreal convention. Initially they offered out of pocket expenses in full providing I made no further claim. That was before the October Court clarification re regulation 261/2004. Which? supports my claim for both citing the Nelson case. In defence, easyjet cite the Mr and Mrs Michael v BA case as well as the notion that EU regulation 261/2004 MAY not allow compensation in addition to expenses.
The outcome is far from certain.

gregouf

Just to update on my situation. Was delayed by BA on a flight to Dubai in October, send a claim just after the update on the EU case and have received today a cheque of 483.71£ (600€). A very nice christmas present from BA

thalia22

111KAB wrote: »

I intitially sought comment from the CAA regarding a delayed Monarch flight from Spain to UK as I require the info for a court claim. They took an age to initially respond so a reminder was sent interim. They said I had to complain to the Spanish regulator .....
http://www.seguridadaerea.es/aesa/lang_castellano/
I was in the process of doing this when another person at CAA replied to say the CAA would comment on my delay! It seems they don't know themselves but start off with the CAA ~ at least your reply will be in English however even if they side with you they have no legal jurisdiction on the airline and at best their comment may only assist you in a court claim.

Hi their,

I do not know if this helps but this was the steps taken by me prior to knowing about this website. I sent my original claims form in to Iberia Spain, back in January 2011, at the same time I issued a letter with full details of incident to the CAA. The main contact at the CAA is Frances Walther, (consumers affair manager), or Monica Bonello (consumers affairs complaints unit). After a considerable period of time, the CAA made contact with the Spanish Regulator, the AESA. The AESA issued all correspondence in English to me. The AESA fully investigated my case, and upheld fully all my initial complaint. See final letter from AESA below:-

But to this date Iberia have refused my claim, and have changed their story three times, now extraodinary circumstances. Court papers issued, Defence submitted,Trial alocation questionare issued, just awaitng a court hearing date.
Incidently the solicitors for Iberia have submitted unavailable dates from 20/12/2012 to 27/3/2013, a total period of 97 days of which they are only available 14 days of that 97 days. I think that must be stalling tatics.

See # 2016. page 101, #2187 page 110, #3285 page 165, #3345 page 168, #3917 page 196.

Copy Verbatim

MINISTERIO DE FOMENTO

A.E.S.A. Registro Presencial

SALIDA

N° de Registro:


45120/RG 45121


Fecha. 21-10-201113:59:11

AESA

AGENCIA ESTATAL DE SEGURIDAD AEREA



DIRECCION DE SEGURIDAD DE LA AVVIACION CIVIL Y PROTECCION AL USUARIO



DIVISlON DE CALIDAD Y PROTECCION AL USUARIO



REINO UNIDO

N/REF:
0FICIO FECHA: 19/10/11
ASUMTQ: Answer to the passenger

Dear Sir/Madam,

We refer to your complaint with regards to the incidents happened with the flight IB 6824 Guarulhos (Guarulhos International Airport) - Madrid (Barajas) on 12/12/2010 with IBERIA UNEAS AEREAS DE ESPANA S.A. QPERADQRA. With the aim of having your complaint, on 14/9/2011 we requested the arline to provide us with a report with reference to the facts exposed in your letter,

On 29/9/2011 we received the report requested wherein the airline states that the delay of the flight was caused due to an unexpected flight safety shortcoming. Moreover, because of this delay you lost your connection flight IB 3162 Madrid - London with Iberia too.
In case of long delay of a flight, the operating air carrier shall offer to the passenger.

1. Right to care
• Meals and refreshments in a reasonable relation to the waftmg time
• Hotel accommodation in soim cases
• Transport between the airport and place of accomadation
• Two telephone calls, telex, fax messages or e-mails

In this case, and as you have exposed in the complaint, Iberia did not offered you any kind of assistance. Accordingly, all the expenses on which you incurred due to the delay of the flight should be reimbursed by the company. You should send the invoices to the air carrier for their reimbursement.

2.Reimbursement within seven days of the full cost of the ticket at the price at which it was bought, for the part or parts of the journey not made, when the delay is at least five hours. Reimbursement of the ticket only in the case that you decide not to fly.
In this case, reimbursement does not proceed because you finally flew in the delayed flight and in the alternative flight IB 3172 offered by Iberia, to your final destination, London.

3. Compensation:

EC Regulation 261/2004 in Article 6 does not expressly provide compensation for cases of delay in departure of flights as it does with the case of flight cancellations.
Nevertheless, we inform you that, pursuant to the Decision of the Fourth Chamber of the Court of Justice of the European Communities of 19 November 2009, the passengers affected by a delay should be compensated under the terms laid down in Article 7 of Regulation No 261 / 2004, when they reach the final destination three or more hours after the originally scheduled arrival time from the carrier.

www.seguridadaerea.es

P/ DE LA CASTELLANA 67
29071 MADRID
TEL+349I 597832I /723I / 5075






However, an operating air carrier shall not be obliged to pay compensafon in accordance with Article 7, if it can prove that the cancellation is caused by extraordinary circumstances which could not have been avoided even if all reasonable measures had been taken.

We would like to draw attention to the ruling of the European Court of Justice (issued on 22 December 2005) regarding the obligation of carriers to pay compensation to passengers in case of cancellations due to technical problems in the aircraft (C-549/07 (Friederike Wallentin-Hermann/ Alitalia). It should be noted that according to the referred ruling, technical problems which come to light during maintenance of aircraft cannot constitute, in themselves, 'extraordinary circumstances' under Article 5(3) of Regulation No 261/2004. Furthermore, a technical problem in an aircraft which leads to the cancellation of a flight is not covered by the concept of 'extraordinary circumstances' within the meaning of that provision, unless that problem stems from events which, by their nature or origin, are not inherent in the normal exercise of the activity of the air carrier concerned and are beyond its actual control.

In the light of the specific conditions in which carriage by air takes place and the degree of technological sophistication of aircraft, air carriers are confronted as a matter of course in the exercise of their activity with various technical problems to which the operation of those aircraft inevitably gives rise.

Taking into consideration all of the aforesaid, AESA considers that the reason for the delay invoked by the company, would not constitute extraordinary circumstances pursuant to Regulation (EC) No. 261/2004. Accordingly, the air carrier should pay you compensation for the amount of 600 Euros per passenger, considering that the distance between Guarulhos and London, final destination, is more than 3500 kilometers.

Please be informed that if the final resolution made by the air carrier does not fully satisfy you, you are entitled to seek legal redress from courts. Further on this matter, we inform you that the Air Safety State Agency has no jurisdiction over a private contract of carriage, and cannot therefore take action in relation to neither claims nor proceedings before the competent courts against any air carriers due to a breach of a contract, because there is no judicial connection between the air carrier and the aeronautical authority.

Notwithstanding the above, we herein inform you that Regulation (EC) No 261/2004 of the European Parliament and of the Council of 11 February 2004 shall apply without prejudice to a passenger's rights to further compensation. The compensation granted under this Regulation may be deducted from such compensation. In this case we inform you that the Convention for the Unification of Certain Rules for International Carriage by Air (Montreal Convention of 28th of May 1999) establish that any action for damages contemplated in Article 45 must be brought, at the option of the plaintiff, in the territory of one of the States Parties, either before a court in which an action may be brought against the contracting carrier, as provided in Article 33, or before the court having jurisdiction at the place where the actual carrier has its domicile or its principal place of business.

We inform you that we are sending copy of this letter to the involved company.

Bearing in mind the aforesaid, the Air Safety State Agency considers this complaint fully close.



Chief of Quality Division and Users* Protection
Nelson Castro Gil




We inform you that all personal data provided will be included in a personal data file named " Quejas de /OS pasajeros aereos". for use by the Spanish Civil Aviation j4sifconly to handle the i-omplwnls submitted and later forwarded to the «sp»RsiMe air earners, t'urtrierme>re. we to^im >•«* !fe» m aw? time >tm can exert before the above body fas keeper of the file) your right to acces. rectificate. cancel or opose to those as ruled by the Spanish imv 15 1999 for Personal Data Protection.
DE FOMENTO

CruiseTraveller

I wonder if anyone can help? This is my first post. I have written the standard letter to Thomson Cruises and after the 14 day deadline received a holding letter saying they would be in contact hopefully within 28 days but during this busy period it might be delayed. Do you think I should just hang on and wait? Has anyone else been successful with Thomson? Could you also fill me in as to what exactly is meant by Exceptional Circumstances - is an aeroplane fault an EC? Doesn't sound right to me!
Thanks in anticipation of some enlightenment.

williamro

CruiseTraveller wrote: »

I wonder if anyone can help? This is my first post. I have written the standard letter to Thomson Cruises and after the 14 day deadline received a holding letter saying they would be in contact hopefully within 28 days but during this busy period it might be delayed. Do you think I should just hang on and wait? Has anyone else been successful with Thomson? Could you also fill me in as to what exactly is meant by Exceptional Circumstances - is an aeroplane fault an EC? Doesn't sound right to me!
Thanks in anticipation of some enlightenment.

If you read this thread and http://eur-lex.europa.eu/LexUriServ/LexUriServ.do?uri=OJ:L:2004:046:0001:0007:en:PDF you will find many answers.

AdamD

My Thomas Cook flight was delayed from Newcastle to Bodrum by just over 4 hours in September.

After perhaps 10 replies back and forth, Thomas Cook agreed to pay me £630 (£315 x 2) in compensation.

I was first offered a voucher, to which my reply was along the lines of 'given my previous experience with Thomas Cook, I have absolutely no desire to travel with them in the future'.

Came back from a week away to a letter from Thomas Cook with a cheque for the same amount.

Thank you MSE and other users on the forum for their advice.

Daza

AdamD wrote: »

My Thomas Cook flight was delayed from Newcastle to Bodrum by just over 4 hours in September.

After perhaps 10 replies back and forth, Thomas Cook agreed to pay me £630 (£315 x 2) in compensation.

As Thomas Cook are now paying out --- Can I ask what the reason was given for your delay.

delvey

Anyone waiting for Thomson I have a letter today, with 2 claims forms in them. They are asking for all my details as well as the boarding cards (not sure if I have these but do have the booking reference). Now what do I do, send the form off with an NBA? They have said they will reply within 56 days, but they have already had 2 months to reply. I asked them for a full explanation on the delay as well which has not been provided. I think they are trying to test my patience :-)

AdamD

Daza wrote: »

As Thomas Cook are now paying out --- Can I ask what the reason was given for your delay.

At the time a poor excuse was given. I can't remember exactly, but something along the lines of the flight previous to ours from Skiathos was delayed due to a technical issue which had a knock-on effect on our flight.

AdamD

delvey wrote: »

Anyone waiting for Thomson I have a letter today, with 2 claims forms in them. They are asking for all my details as well as the boarding cards (not sure if I have these but do have the booking reference). Now what do I do, send the form off with an NBA? They have said they will reply within 56 days, but they have already had 2 months to reply. I asked them for a full explanation on the delay as well which has not been provided. I think they are trying to test my patience :-)

Give the Civil Aviation Authority an e-mail. That will prompt Thomson to speed up.