Compensation for delayed flights Discussion Area

ellenpal

JPears wrote: »

Ellenpal -
I would also be inclined to write back to the CAA, pointing out this section of regulation 261/2004:
"(21) Member States should lay down rules on sanctions applicable to infringements of the provisions of this Regulation and ensure that these sanctions are applied. The sanctions should be effective, proportionate and dissuasive."
And enquire exactly how they being effective in enforcing the regualtion when it is blatantly ignored by the airlines in many many cases?

JPears, good suggestion. I will write to them now. Also wondering what additional demands I should make for this extreme delay. Not that they will do anything additional, but might be worth asking?


Update: On JPears suggestion I did ask this of CAA. Here was their response:
The CAA is the designated National Enforcement Body for EC 261/2004. Our enforcement powers come from Part 8 of the Enterprise Act 2002 and allow us to take action in the collective interest of consumers. The powers allow us to require businesses to provide information where we have reasonable grounds to suspect there has been a breach of the Regulation and also allow us to seek legal undertakings that the business will comply with the law in future. If we are unable to obtain an undertaking, or if an undertaking is breached, we can seek an Enforcement Order from the Court. Breach of an Enforcement Order can result in contempt of Court proceedings and the court could then impose a fine.

However, the CAA is unable to take enforcement action in all cases and we prioritise our work to achieve the greatest benefits for consumers. Unfortunately our enforcement powers do not cover obtaining redress for individual consumers, they are allow us to take action to ensure businesses change their practices and comply with the law for the benefit of consumers generally. We have published an enforcement policy setting out the criteria we use to prioritise our work:

http://www.caa.co.uk/application.aspx?catid=33&pagetype=65&appid=11&mode=detail&id=5473 .

Please also click on the below link which explains the CAA approach to consumer enforcement action in relation to passenger rights legislation:

http://www.caa.co.uk/Our-work/About-us/Enforcement-and-prosecutions/

It is, of course, still open to you to issue a claim in the Court and as such, it is entirely up to you to decide whether you wish to pursue this further.

Please be advised that the legal limit to issue claims at Court is 6 years in England and Wales and 5 years in Scotland from the date of the incident. If your claim is nearing the legal limit, you may wish to consider legal action. If you are considering legal action, it will be important for you to bear in mind that Court action has to be started within the relevant time limit. The Court will not hear claims that have been lodged outside of this period.

JPears

MarkP80 wrote: »

Hi, thanks for replying.

Yes, the original journey was all KLM, a single ticket covering the two flights. Teesside to Schiphol to Lagos.

KLM unilaterally decided I wouldn't make the connection and removed me from the passenger list for the second flight. I actually got to the gate with plenty of time to spare, people were still boarding after I was turned away. This was the bit that I was referring to under the airline mistakenly assuming I wouldn't make a connection.

So the flight they had moved me to, without asking, (Royal Air Maroc) was scheduled to arrive at Lagos at 3am the next day, instead of the 19.35 the same day that I should have arrived (7+ hour delay).

On top of that, the RAM flight they moved me to (2nd leg) was delayed as well, actually arriving at Lagos at approx 06.30am instead of 3am.

Thanks,
MarkP

Then you are almost certainly due 600euro compensation due to the delay. It is highly unlikely the late arrival of your aircraft could be classed as an EC as this is a "knock on".
You should be due the difference between your business class flight cost that you paid for and the cost of the air Maroc flight.
Read through this:
http://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/TXT/HTML/?uri=CELEX:32004R0261&from=EN

MarkP80

JPears wrote: »

Then you are almost certainly due 600euro compensation due to the delay. It is highly unlikely the late arrival of your aircraft could be classed as an EC as this is a "knock on".
You should be due the difference between your business class flight cost that you paid for and the cost of the air Maroc flight.
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Thanks for that feedback. I'm not quite sure what you mean by "unlikely the late arrival could be classed as an EC" - what's an EC?
I've read the link, thank you. I think I'm due the compensation from KLM on 2 grounds - late arrival at final destination due to missed connection, and due to denial of boarding.

But, KLM are also claiming the refund due to the downgrading is nothing to do with them, but should be claimed via Air Maroc. Is this correct do you think? I don't personally agree, but not sure where this stands under the law. The only part I can see is Article 3 point 5, where it says "Where an operating air carrier which has no contract with the passenger performs obligations under this Regulation, it shall be regarded as doing so on behalf of the person having a contract with that passenger". Would I be correct to interpret this as Air Maroc having no contract with me, and they are performiing on behalf of KLM, where KLM are the person having the contract with me (the passenger)?
And how do I know what the Air Maroc flight cost? I don't know what KLM paid for the business class ticket (which is what was booked for me) and I don't know what a corresponding Air Maroc ticket would be?
Sorry to keep asking the questions on this one, your help is most appreciated.

Cheers,
MarkP

Justice13075

I won't step on JPears toes but EC stands for Extraordinary Circumstances like weather at your airport which grounds the planes. Or Air Traffic Control strikes which are outside of the airlines control. Virtually all other reasons like technical issues with the plane crew illness crew out of hours are all claimable

JPears

MarkP
Thank you for looking at the reg 261/2004 - makes it a lot clearer doesn't it
I would agree with your interpretation regarding responsibility for the downgrade with RAM.
KLM are entirely responsible for both the compensation and calculating what you due in terms of refund for the business class downgrade since they re-booked on this flight with your agreement.

BeardySB

Hi, FlyBe have offered me 250 Euros as compensation for a 4 hour delayed flight (result!). However, I missed my connecting flight and had to buy a new flight to a different city, pay for a hotel overnight and then transport to my original destination ... they are refusing to pay any of these expenses. Is there anything I can do here to get them to pay it?
Thanks!

Tyzap

Hi BeardySB,

Was your connection to another Flybe aircraft all on one through ticket?

BeardySB

No, they didn't fly to my final destination - my second flight was with RyanAir booked separately.

Tyzap

BeardySB wrote: »

No, they didn't fly to my final destination - my second flight was with RyanAir booked separately.

I don't believe that they have any further liability.

Unfortunately it's the risk you take if you don't book connecting flights with the same company, or allow enough connection time when things then go wrong.

I think it would be very difficult to take this further, sorry.

Vauban

BeardySB wrote: »

No, they didn't fly to my final destination - my second flight was with RyanAir booked separately.

That's the risk you take with booking your own connections, unfortunately. You will have to rely on your travel insurance's "missed connection" provision- assuming you've got it.