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Tmobile price increase
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RandomCurve wrote: »I forwarded my email to them - but will not include them on the posted version as a message comes back saying if they receive more than 6 identical emails they will delete them!
It should be ok, it will only really need one of them to get involved and start asking questions or bring it up in committee to make it interesting for OFCOM.====0 -
All - please send email below to the following distribution list.
[EMAIL="graham.howell@ofcom.org.uk"]graham.howell@ofcom.org.uk[/EMAIL]
[EMAIL="vaizeye@parliament.uk"]vaizeye@parliament.uk[/EMAIL]
[EMAIL="enquiries@oft.gsi.gov.uk"]enquiries@oft.gsi.gov.uk[/EMAIL]
[EMAIL="News.london@ukmetro.co.uk"]News.london@ukmetro.co.uk[/EMAIL]
[EMAIL="home@guardian.co.uk"]home@guardian.co.uk[/EMAIL]
[EMAIL="which@which.co.uk"]which@which.co.uk[/EMAIL]
[EMAIL="editor@thisismoney.co.uk"]editor@thisismoney.co.uk[/EMAIL]
[EMAIL="home.news@thetimes.co.uk"]home.news@thetimes.co.uk[/EMAIL]
[EMAIL="Watchdog@bbc.co.uk"]Watchdog@bbc.co.uk[/EMAIL]
[EMAIL="uknewsplan@bbc.co.uk"]uknewsplan@bbc.co.uk[/EMAIL]
[EMAIL="news@sky.com"]news@sky.com[/EMAIL]
[EMAIL="james.smith@pressassociation.com"]james.smith@pressassociation.com[/EMAIL]
[EMAIL="ean@ft.com"]ean@ft.com[/EMAIL]
[EMAIL="News.desk@express.co.uk"]News.desk@express.co.uk[/EMAIL]
[EMAIL="mirrornews@mgn.co.uk"]mirrornews@mgn.co.uk[/EMAIL]
[EMAIL="news@the-sun.co.uk"]news@the-sun.co.uk[/EMAIL]
[EMAIL="steve.hawkes@the-sun.co.uk"]steve.hawkes@the-sun.co.uk[/EMAIL]
[EMAIL="paul.dacre@dailymail.co.uk"]paul.dacre@dailymail.co.uk[/EMAIL]
[EMAIL="news@moneysavingexpert.com"]news@moneysavingexpert.com[/EMAIL]
[EMAIL="itvplanning@itn.co.uk"]itvplanning@itn.co.uk[/EMAIL]
[EMAIL="executive.office@orange.co.uk"]executive.office@orange.co.uk[/EMAIL]
[EMAIL="olaf.swantee@ee.co.uk"]olaf.swantee@ee.co.uk[/EMAIL]
[EMAIL="eevenrandomcurve@gmail.com"]eevenrandomcurve@gmail.com[/EMAIL]
Re: Information Required From OFCOM
Dear Graham from OFCOM,
I am writing in connection with the comment attributed to your organisation in an article on MSE
http://www.moneysavingexpert.com/news/phones/2013/05/t-mobile-users-attempt-to-escape-price-hike
written by Helen Knapman on May 7th, with regards to the T-Mobile price rise advised to customers’ in April 2013. In that article OFCOM is quoted as follows:
“Telecommunications regulator Ofcom adds that it has examined EE's terms and conditions and says: "We consider the approach they [EE] have taken is reasonable and do not consider that we need to take further action."
Well 2 million T-Mobile customers - would like to know what evidence you based that statement on.
I am NOT asking you to comment on my individual case, nor am I asking you to rule on if the T-Mobile increase is legal – that is something that will be decided in the courts. I am asking two specific things:- On what evidence did you base your statement? And
- Should the courts subsequently decide that the price rise is indeed illegal (or more likely T-Mobile withdraw the price rise) what action will OFCOM take?
Before commenting on this case OFCOM would obviously have availed itself of the facts and is aware that there are TWO different sets of T&Cs in operation, but just to refresh your memory on what has been happening:- On or around the 6th April T-Mobile wrote to customers imposing a price increase of 3.3% based on CURRENT RPI
- At that time the CURRENT RPI was 3.2% (February RPI published on 19th March)
When questioned by customers as to what rate has been applied to their contracts because it was unclear the response received (from customer services AND the Orange (?) Executive office) was as follows:- First Response – it is January RPI 3.3% (published on February 12th)
- Second Response –it is March RPI 3.3% because we “anticipated” the March RPI (Position changed on 16th April - after March RPI is published (coincidence?) and 10 days after the price increase letter was sent)
- Third Response - It is January, but this is because it was unreasonable to use February RPI as that would have given only 13 working days to send the letter - so T-Mobile took 36 days (excluding weekends and Bank holidays to write). For reference in 2012 T-Mobile took an average of 7 days to send letters out, but as the REGULATOR you would have been aware of these facts!
- Its non-negotiated T&Cs;
- Which RPI it chooses to use;
- The date of the letter;
- The wording of the letter;
- And the date the price rise is effective.
- What explanations did T-Mobile give OFCOM for this behaviour,
- I assume you asked!
- And how did you satisfy yourselves that the answer was genuine
- surely you would not take it at face value –as you are the REGULATOR
A: When it is a T-Mobile contract REVIEWED by OFCOM.
One final thing on reasonable behaviour- If customers have a contract that states T-Mobile have to:
- use an RPI rate PUBLISHED in the month BEFORE the month in which the letter is sent
- Why do OFCOM believe that if T-Mobile:
- use a rate PUBLISHED AFTER the letter was received
- Is this really REASONABLE behaviour? (OFCOM are applying English law, not French or Germany Law?)
What will OFCOMs response be?
If T-Mobile rescinds the price rise, or the courts rule it illegal what action will OFCOM take?- Say “all’s well” because the increase has been withdrawn?
- I.e. DO NOTHING – where is the deterrent for companies not to behave like this if the REGULATOR responds so weakly? So this can’t be right!
- Fine T-Mobile thereby swelling OFCOMS income?
- So the customer who fought for justice gets NOTHING whilst the REGULATOR who did NOTHING gets rewarded – that can’t be right! Or
- Require T-Mobile to:
- Honour all the cancellation requests they have had back dated to the date requested plus £20 per communication for damages, and
- Write to all customers who received the price increase letter explaining that between early April (when letters were sent) and May 9th (when price rise came into effect) customers DID have the right to cancel without penalty, and as T-Mobile never made that clear they are now giving those customers who want to cancel a FURTHER 30 DAYS to terminate their contract without penalty – which will be BACK DATED to 21st April (mid way between when the letter was sent and when the right to cancel passed)?
- Now that would be FAIR and is a DETERRENT and the actions of a REGULATOR!
Regards
For further information on this email and the FULL STORY of just how badly T-Mobile has been treating its customers please contact [EMAIL="eevenrandomcurve@gmail.com"]eevenrandomcurve@gmail.com[/EMAIL] who has emailed you separately including a contact number.0 -
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If anyone else has received a charge for the issue of a PAC, before using it, then dispute the charge immediately. T-Mobile's T&Cs state:4.4.5. If You don’t pay a bill by the date set out on it You will have broken an important condition which is a fundamental part of this Agreement between You and Us and this will entitle Us to suspend Your SIM Card from the Network and/or terminate this Agreement immediately and charge You a Cancellation Charge except where:
4.4.5.1. You have a genuine dispute with Us; and
4.4.5.2. Before the date by which Your bill must be paid, You have written (see point 9.6) to Us setting out the details of Your dispute, including the amount of Your claim against Us and the amount You
intend to withhold as disputed. If the amount You intend to withhold is less than the total amount You owe Us then You must pay the difference by the date set out on the bill. If You don’t, then We can terminate this Agreement immediately.
Just make sure you dispute the termination charge but agree to pay the remainder of the bill.9.6. Unless otherwise stated in this Agreement, any notices from You
to Us must be sent to: Customer Relations, T-Mobile, Hatfield
Business Park, Hatfield, Hertfordshire, AL10 9BW.0 -
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Hey Guys,
I have not read all of the 41+ pages but I was interested to read that other people are baulking at T-Mobiles price increases. This has never happened to me when in contract before & I think its a disgrace!
For those that are interested, here is the letter I sent them cancelling my contract (sent to customer administration in Duxford):
Dear Sirs,
I hereby terminate my pay monthly mobile telephone contract with T-Mobile. I have also given notice by telephone –in accordance with #7.2.2 of your November 2010 pay monthly telephone terms version 58A.
The reason for this termination is your notification (a letter received 6th April 2013) of an increase in the contract price from £36.00 to £37.18 per month. This increase is excessive and it is clearly to my Material Detriment. Any attempt to impose this price change on me without allowing a penalty–free right to cancel, is unfair and unenforceable as a matter of law.
Clause 9.6 of the General Conditions of OFCOM states:
9.6 The Communications Provider shall:
(a) give its Subscribers adequate notice not shorter than one month of any modifications likely to be of material detriment to that Subscriber;
(b) allow its Subscribers to withdraw from their contract without penalty upon such notice; and
(c) at the same time as giving the notice in condition 9.6 (a) above, shall inform the Subscriber of its ability to terminate the contract without penalty if the proposed modification is not acceptable to the Subscriber.
Further to the above, your price increase of 3.3% is higher than the Retail Price Index percentage dated 19th March 2013 covering the month of February as documented on the Office for National Statistics website as 3.2%. As such you have increased my monthly price plan by a rate higher than the published RPI increase for the 12 months before the month in which you sent your written notice (April).
This price increase then must be accompanied by a right to penalty free termination to avoid being deemed unfair in the Unfair Terms in Consumer Contracts Regulations 1999 (UTCCR), Schedule 2 (1) (l) …allowing a seller of goods or supplier of services to increase their price without in both cases giving the consumer the corresponding right to cancel the contract if the final price is too high in relation to the price agreed when the contract was concluded;..”
The Office of Fair Trading has published guidance on the UTCCRs. On the issue of price variation clauses, OFT’s guidance states that:
“12.1 ...A clause allowing the supplier to increase the price – varying the most important of all of the consumer’s contractual obligations – has clear potential for unfairness.
12.2 Any purely discretionary right to set or vary a price after the consumer has become bound to pay is obviously objectionable........It also applies to rights to increase payments under continuing contracts where consumers are “captive” – that is, they have no penalty-free right to cancel.
12.3 A price variation clause is not necessarily fair just because it is not discretionary.......Suppliers are much better able to anticipate and control charges in their own costs than consumers can possibly be. In any case, such a clause is particularly open to abuse, because consumers can have no reasonable certainty that the increases imposed on them actually match net cost increases.” This guidance clearly calls into question the fairness of the contract under the UTCCRs.
You will be aware of Ofcom’s Guidance; "Any kind of variation clause may in principle be fair if consumers are free to escape its effects by ending the contract. To be genuinely free to cancel, they must not be left worse off for having entered the contract, whether by experiencing financial loss (for example, forfeiture of a prepayment) or serious inconvenience, or any other adverse consequences.”
You will also be aware of the recent consultation by Ofcom entitled "Price rises in fixed term contracts" published 3rd January 2013 which makes it clear that Ofcom consider it necessary to act in relation to the controversial and legally questionable practice by phone operators of imposing mid-term price increases. The outcome of this review is expected in June 2013.
I now exercise my legal right to cancel the contract due to your price increase, which is not acceptable to me and of Material Detriment.
I reject as unfair your attempt to artificially limit the right to cancel to some scenarios and not others in clause 7.2.3.3 in the face of the clear legislation and regulatory guidance and General Condition 9. At any rate, you increased the price by a higher percentage than permitted under this clause. Any attempt to claim a penalty and in particular a cancellation charge will be resisted. Your terms are also unfair and therefore non-binding and unenforceable. Any claim for them will be disputed and you will need a Court Order to obtain payment of them. I will defend any legal proceedings for such sums under the Unfair Terms in Consumer Contracts Regulations 1999.
I will cancel my direct debit immediately. Please let me know the exact outstanding balance for the last 30 days and I will send a cheque in full and final satisfaction of the remaining charges owed to you under the contract. I spoke to your account staff but they were unable to calculate this for me.
In my view this will then end our contract in line with the law. If you dispute the above interpretation of our contract and / or consumer law please contact me and hopefully we can reach an agreement amicably avoiding the need to proceed through the courts.
Please note: No summary enforcement is allowed where there is a genuine dispute meaning you cannot collect disputed sums as debts.
Please also note: You sold me a discounted phone on the basis that I entered into this contract with you, I have now terminated the contract in accordance with its terms and the law. Blocking the IMEI number of the phone you sold me will clearly be illegal and malicious. I will take you to court to have any block removed and seek recompense and damages for any time the phone is unusable.
Yours Sincerely,
XXX0 -
Barnicle_Fiend wrote: »Hey Guys,
I have not read all of the 41+ pages but I was interested to read that other people are baulking at T-Mobiles price increases. This has never happened to me when in contract before & I think its a disgrace!
For those that are interested, here is the letter I sent them cancelling my contract (sent to customer administration in Duxford):
Dear Sirs,
I hereby terminate my pay monthly mobile telephone contract with T-Mobile. I have also given notice by telephone –in accordance with #7.2.2 of your November 2010 pay monthly telephone terms version 58A.
The reason for this termination is your notification (a letter received 6th April 2013) of an increase in the contract price from £36.00 to £37.18 per month. This increase is excessive and it is clearly to my Material Detriment. Any attempt to impose this price change on me without allowing a penalty–free right to cancel, is unfair and unenforceable as a matter of law.
Clause 9.6 of the General Conditions of OFCOM states:
9.6 The Communications Provider shall:
(a) give its Subscribers adequate notice not shorter than one month of any modifications likely to be of material detriment to that Subscriber;
(b) allow its Subscribers to withdraw from their contract without penalty upon such notice; and
(c) at the same time as giving the notice in condition 9.6 (a) above, shall inform the Subscriber of its ability to terminate the contract without penalty if the proposed modification is not acceptable to the Subscriber.
Further to the above, your price increase of 3.3% is higher than the Retail Price Index percentage dated 19th March 2013 covering the month of February as documented on the Office for National Statistics website as 3.2%. As such you have increased my monthly price plan by a rate higher than the published RPI increase for the 12 months before the month in which you sent your written notice (April).
This price increase then must be accompanied by a right to penalty free termination to avoid being deemed unfair in the Unfair Terms in Consumer Contracts Regulations 1999 (UTCCR), Schedule 2 (1) (l) …allowing a seller of goods or supplier of services to increase their price without in both cases giving the consumer the corresponding right to cancel the contract if the final price is too high in relation to the price agreed when the contract was concluded;..”
The Office of Fair Trading has published guidance on the UTCCRs. On the issue of price variation clauses, OFT’s guidance states that:
“12.1 ...A clause allowing the supplier to increase the price – varying the most important of all of the consumer’s contractual obligations – has clear potential for unfairness.
12.2 Any purely discretionary right to set or vary a price after the consumer has become bound to pay is obviously objectionable........It also applies to rights to increase payments under continuing contracts where consumers are “captive” – that is, they have no penalty-free right to cancel.
12.3 A price variation clause is not necessarily fair just because it is not discretionary.......Suppliers are much better able to anticipate and control charges in their own costs than consumers can possibly be. In any case, such a clause is particularly open to abuse, because consumers can have no reasonable certainty that the increases imposed on them actually match net cost increases.” This guidance clearly calls into question the fairness of the contract under the UTCCRs.
You will be aware of Ofcom’s Guidance; "Any kind of variation clause may in principle be fair if consumers are free to escape its effects by ending the contract. To be genuinely free to cancel, they must not be left worse off for having entered the contract, whether by experiencing financial loss (for example, forfeiture of a prepayment) or serious inconvenience, or any other adverse consequences.”
You will also be aware of the recent consultation by Ofcom entitled "Price rises in fixed term contracts" published 3rd January 2013 which makes it clear that Ofcom consider it necessary to act in relation to the controversial and legally questionable practice by phone operators of imposing mid-term price increases. The outcome of this review is expected in June 2013.
I now exercise my legal right to cancel the contract due to your price increase, which is not acceptable to me and of Material Detriment.
I reject as unfair your attempt to artificially limit the right to cancel to some scenarios and not others in clause 7.2.3.3 in the face of the clear legislation and regulatory guidance and General Condition 9. At any rate, you increased the price by a higher percentage than permitted under this clause. Any attempt to claim a penalty and in particular a cancellation charge will be resisted. Your terms are also unfair and therefore non-binding and unenforceable. Any claim for them will be disputed and you will need a Court Order to obtain payment of them. I will defend any legal proceedings for such sums under the Unfair Terms in Consumer Contracts Regulations 1999.
I will cancel my direct debit immediately. Please let me know the exact outstanding balance for the last 30 days and I will send a cheque in full and final satisfaction of the remaining charges owed to you under the contract. I spoke to your account staff but they were unable to calculate this for me.
In my view this will then end our contract in line with the law. If you dispute the above interpretation of our contract and / or consumer law please contact me and hopefully we can reach an agreement amicably avoiding the need to proceed through the courts.
Please note: No summary enforcement is allowed where there is a genuine dispute meaning you cannot collect disputed sums as debts.
Please also note: You sold me a discounted phone on the basis that I entered into this contract with you, I have now terminated the contract in accordance with its terms and the law. Blocking the IMEI number of the phone you sold me will clearly be illegal and malicious. I will take you to court to have any block removed and seek recompense and damages for any time the phone is unusable.
Yours Sincerely,
XXX
Did you really send that or are you having a laugh? I cringed when I read it. It's an embarrassment.0 -
By the way, has everyone read the 'Response to Ofcom’s consultation on price rises in fixed term contracts' by the Ombudsman Services:
You can find it at:
ombudsman-services *dot* org/downloads/Consultation_response_Ofcom_fixed.pdf
It makes some interesting points highlighting crazy decisions by the regulator Ofcom that have led to the outrage over mid-term price hikes. Particularly point 3 on page 4. I cannot believe Ofcom thought it would be a good idea for the networks to be responsible for defining what classes as “material detriment”.
No wonder T-mobile are taking the p*ss!!!!!0 -
Looksguywalker wrote: »Did you really send that or are you having a laugh? I cringed when I read it. It's an embarrassment.
Can you qualify your criticism?0 -
Looksguywalker wrote: »Did you really send that or are you having a laugh? I cringed when I read it. It's an embarrassment.
dosnt look that bad to me, tells them exactly the points he is cancelling for and he has taken the opportunity to point out they could face legal action should they go down the IMEI route.
as a first letter goes it will get the ball rolling.0
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