Cancelled Subscription via Paypal - Can I be forced to pay?

cladcat6

Thanks Eversir, keep me posting what's going on with your case and interestingly what they going to reply to your letter. If I receive anything else it will be more like me writing on it: "return to sender".

Danie1le

I have had a new reply from their CEO Paul Careless today. At least I know who I am talking to and he isn't rude like his so called 'Customer Servce'!

He ignored a few of my points and claims that because they offer the option to download the terms and conditions, this makes them clearly available and stated that because I ticked the box, there is nothing they can do and that I should honour my obligation.

I have responded by acknowledging that while it is clear that the terms and conditions are available to download prior to ticking the box, it is NOT clear that these are further terms and conditions which differentiate from those on their homepage.

I also mentioned the new disclaimer that they have added onto the footer of their website which is an acknowledgement in itself that their further terms and conditions are not be clear. Had this disclaimer been there previously, I would not have entered into the trial.

I finished off by saying that following advice from a local solicitor as well as the Citizens Advice Consumer Service that I wholeheartedly dispute their claim that I have a contract with Legal Care. This is the last letter I plan on sending to him.

cladcat6

ok lets see what they reply to that. Keep us posted.

bpnodbige

I receieved my letter from gpb solicitors (i.e. the debt collectors) today demanding £278 which looks identical to the one Eversir informed us about yesterday. Maybe there was a job lot sent out after the bank holiday weekend?

This is even more disappointing as at no point have I actually refused to pay them, as far as I was concerned I am still in the process of debating with them and they hadn't actually informed me they had referred the matter onto a 3rd party.

I have to say that I am genuinely frightened now. It's no longer a case of batting back and to with LegalCare arguing the point. Now the 3rd party is involved I really don't see how I can avoid paying out any money. Eversir - I have to say that your response to the gpb letter was brave, but rather reckless. I honestly don't know where to go from here.

Danie1le - have your received one of the gpb letters yet? Or has your communication with Paul Careless prevented this?

This whole thing just gets more and more rubbish.....

Eversir

The way I see it, the fact they have a solicitor involved makes very little difference to the situation - they have no more power than LegalCare did in the first place. It's not as if they suddenly can burst into your home and demand payment now - they'll still have to take it to court (and win) to secure a judgement, and they can't claim back solicitor's fees on the small claims track (anything under 5k usually). They'll have already spent about £70 with that solicitor's letter, unless they have some sort of contract with them on a cheaper rate.

Generally the "dreaded solicitor's/debt collection agency's letter" is designed to frighten you into paying. If you don't believe you owe them anything, don't pay it. Personally I'd rather risk ~£350 (add on the court fees) and let it go to court, where the odds of them winning the case are slim at best, than simply roll over and shell out £280 here and now. But that scenario isn't for everyone, and of course that's what these goons are relying on. Scare tactics.

Reckless maybe, we'll see. But really I've not technically done anything wrong with that response - I'm just stating my refusal to contract under no uncertain terms. Those statements are standard practice when presented with offers to contract (that includes parking tickets by the way). It might be possible to argue it wasn't technically an offer to contract, but it certainly doesn't harm my defence. Doesn't stop them from taking me to court in either event, but they might just stop and think "Is it really worth taking this any further?".

For the risk of a few extra quid on my part, I'd rather justice was carried out properly. If some idiot came up to me on the street demanding £280 for something I'd never agreed to, I'd tell them where to put it, too.

bpnodbige

bod1467 wrote: »

Careless ... seems quite an apt surname.

Agreed!!

Eversir - thank you for your points. I will give it some thought. But they have succeeded in scaring me. I'm not prepared to go to court (if it gets that far) no matter how angry the whole thing makes me and how wrong I think they are. Based on others experiences reported in this thread it does not seem that they are likely to roll over and give up.

To anyone reading this - Is it likely that this matter with LegalCare is likely to affect my credit rating if I refuse to pay, or even now that it has gone as far as the 3rd party debt collection?

Eversir

bpnodbige wrote: »

Agreed!!

To anyone reading this - Is it likely that this matter with LegalCare is likely to affect my credit rating if I refuse to pay, or even now that it has gone as far as the 3rd party debt collection?

No - you would have to go to court (or rather, they would come to YOUR local court), you'd sit in a small room/office with a judge and the other party (if they even send anyone). You argue your case, they argue theirs, judge makes a decision based on the balance of probabilities. If the judge decides you should pay, you have 30 days to pay or you get a CCJ entered against you. Then it would affect your credit rating.

Worth mentioning: I have been to a small claims court before. It's actually quite laid back - don't imagine it as criminal court room like you see in film/TV.

cladcat6

They can't enter your property. They have to have your permission otherwise you can call the police.
Someone here stated that you simply remove the permission to enter the property by letter. I haven't received a letter from their solicitor just yet. Has anyone consulted one?

Eversir

cladcat6 wrote: »

They can't enter your property. They have to have your permission otherwise you can call the police.
Someone here stated that you simply remove the permission to enter the property by letter. I haven't received a letter from their solicitor just yet. Has anyone consulted one?

The letter in question is to remove their right of implied access to your property, NOT the dwelling itself (which would be breaking and entering - a serious crime).

Implied right of access is best explained by how your postman is allowed to approach your letterbox to deliver mail. It is an implied right for him/her to do so. You can revoke that right in writing to any person or company - even bailiffs - and it would then be unlawful for them to set foot on any part of your property. This works for all but representatives from the Inland Revenue, I believe, and the police IF you have committed a criminal offence (not the same as a civil offence). Those conditions also apply to forced entry to your property.

Some debt collection agencies rely on the person's ignorance of their rights, sadly

sharper13

Hello its been a while i am still in discussion with gpb and have just emailed the below:

"Hi


This is the first set of T&C located at the bottom of homepages and subsequent pages which I read

above attached is the second set I could only get from trying to sign back up.

I cancelled thru paypal within hours of signing up (the only option to pay) which I have done with other company’s.

After this I couldn’t even log into their dashboard so believed account was closed,

Next thing I receive is an email informing my trial period has ended and I owe them the complete amount.
They have agreed paypal had informed them that it was cancelled but decided to inform me a month later.

Thanks

Scott


Im just waiting to hear...............