Need help with saying no to someone while not falling out

bestpud

onlyroz wrote: »

In my experience, if you join a club and enjoy going to that club then sooner or later they'll rope you into running the bl00dy club.

Stick to your guns. You do your bit and you know it.

As an aside, I know next-to-nothing about church services but I'm a bit baffled about the need for a creche at all. Surely you'd take the children in with you?

Great minds... :rotfl:

skintchick

onlyroz wrote: »

In my experience, if you join a club and enjoy going to that club then sooner or later they'll rope you into running the bl00dy club.

Stick to your guns. You do your bit and you know it.

As an aside, I know next-to-nothing about church services but I'm a bit baffled about the need for a creche at all. Surely you'd take the children in with you?

Only for the first bit when we have worship. After that the children go out to their groups (like Sunday school only we don;t call it that).

If they were kept in they;d run riot while people were trying to listen to the sermon!

The idea of creche is so that parents can enjoy the sermon without having to look after their children.

No-one would want the kids in the whole service - all the old people would complain for a start!

bestpud

Is there a rota for the older group, or does your husband run it alone?

Lara44

Kids are normally included in parts of the service but take a break during the sermon because it's long for younger kids to sit through. They often break away and do age-appropriate activities.

Or there may be specific family services which are designed to be more child-centred. Outside of these kids may go to the creche.

ETA - cross posted with Skintchick

*zippy*

If needed remind them too that you are easier to replace in the creche than leading worship, very few are able to do that.

I feel for you, I would go to your church leader and share how this is making you feel. I do wonder if there is more going on with this couple, it does seem odd that they won't let this drop, it is clearly really bugging them and I would ask myself why as you joining the rota, won't make a big difference to how many times Donna still has to do it. Just be careful with them x

guruchelles

I just can't help thinking that, as a parent, if you want to enjoy anything without your children then you need childcare of some sort. If you put your child in a crèche with a rota, but then refuse to be part of that rota, you are expecting childcare for nothing. You're expecting other people to look after your child while you go off and do the thing you enjoy doing. If everyone did that then, theoretically, nobody would look after the children in the crèche.

Of course, this only works if all parents who use the crèche are on the rota and do their share. If you don't want to be part of the communal childcare solution, then withdraw your child and sit them on your lap while you listen to the sermon.

I don't expect anyone to look after my child (apart from my husband) while I go off to enjoy anything quietly. And if I was part of a communal crèche I'd expect all the parents who benefitted to take their turn supervising the children.

Surely you don't have to supervise the crèche that frequently?

lostinrates

guruchelles wrote: »

I just can't help thinking that, as a parent, if you want to enjoy anything without your children then you need childcare of some sort. If you put your child in a crèche with a rota, but then refuse to be part of that rota, you are expecting childcare for nothing. You're expecting other people to look after your child while you go off and do the thing you enjoy doing. If everyone did that then, theoretically, nobody would look after the children in the crèche.

Of course, this only works if all parents who use the crèche are on the rota and do their share. If you don't want to be part of the communal childcare solution, then withdraw your child and sit them on your lap while you listen to the sermon.

I don't expect anyone to look after my child (apart from my husband) while I go off to enjoy anything quietly. And if I was part of a communal crèche I'd expect all the parents who benefitted to take their turn supervising the children.

Surely you don't have to supervise the crèche that frequently?

I think in this case you can look at the entire church rather than just the crèche as the giving and taking venue. If op and her husband are allready contributing more than they take including a 'less available' talent then that is worth factoring in.

So if people wich to benefit from OP's contribution to the church they might need to help make that possible.

Otoh, it might be felt that the 'power circle' at the top is too small and that by encouraging op to take a more basic role in the church organisation it will be more inclusive.


Fwiw, though now non believing I have spent many times in services where children stayed for the whole thing. It's partly a matter of learning control for children, partly a matter of learning focus for the adults. Its also a lesson in concise, pithy and yet effetive sermon writing for the person giving the sermon. Personally I like having children in myself, sometimes it puts what is being said in total perspective.

bestpud

*zippy* wrote: »

If needed remind them too that you are easier to replace in the creche than leading worship, very few are able to do that.

I feel for you, I would go to your church leader and share how this is making you feel. I do wonder if there is more going on with this couple, it does seem odd that they won't let this drop, it is clearly really bugging them and I would ask myself why as you joining the rota, won't make a big difference to how many times Donna still has to do it. Just be careful with them x

On the face of it, what they are saying is correct - Skintchick has children in the creche and should take her turn.

Most of the other things she does are not during the sermon so she seems to get to listen to it most weeks, albeit without her husband.

However, when you look at the bigger picture, there is no fairness in the way all the roles are allocated and it's wrong to pick on one person when the entire congregation needs an organisational overhaul imo.

It seems everyone wants to hear the sermon though and other roles are considered peripheral to that.

Looking at it from that angle however, the biggest defense Skintchick has is her husband doing more than his share with the older children! This is particularly relevant if their child(ren) aren't in that group.

skintchick

guruchelles wrote: »

I completely understand that you want to keep your other roles, but you can't just expect other people to take responsibility for your child so that you can do 'what you enjoy'. I think it's a great idea having a crèche with a rota, but it only works fairly if everyone who uses it also goes on the rota.

As other people have pointed out, if there are a number of children in the crèche then your fair turn won't come up very often. The person who is doing the rota is trying hard to make it fair. If other parents started saying 'I don't care for childcare; I don't want to do it' then the rota would be very unfair.

And why can't everyone be on the coffee rota? If 80% of the congregation does nothing then isn't it about time there was a meeting called to make sure people are doing their fair share?

But if everyone in the whole church did at least one thing for the church then all the rotas would be oversubscribed!

The idea has always been that people do what is on their heart. Some people are called to childcare, some to worship, some to the PA desk, some to welcoming etc.

It's kind of like Scouts - do you expect every parent to do something for the Scouts, even if it's something they don't enjoy?

skintchick

bestpud wrote: »

Would your refusal make you the only parent who wasn't contributing to the creche?

There may well be other people who would happily help out but someone needs to take the bull by the horns and ask them!

Donna clearly isn't going to and you and your husband must see quite a few people between the various groups you run, so take the initiative and ask! It won't take any time as you surely speak to them anyway?

That seems sensible to me at least and would solve the problem immediately if you received a few volunteers!

No. I know at least one other person who doesn't help out, but she just says yes then doesn't go!

I will happily ask people but only if Donna wants me to - she organises the rota so I don't want to tread on her toes.