Daughter causing me grief.

Majestic1919

I have to agree with Meritaten - except I will go a bit further.

Your daughter is getting very confusing messages from you because you tell her she has to do something (like contribute), she kicks off and you are back to square one after a year.

Over many years, I have known three mothers who have felt needed by being a doormat.

I used to look after a girl at my daughter's school as a favour to her mother. At first it was only for about half an hour (unpaid) until either of her two older sisters or father could collect her. Then it became extended until 6 to 6.30 when the mother had finished work and done shopping. The mother would complain that they would all be sitting there when she got in and she would have to start cooking. This was having an affect on our lives and I began to realise that the mother was never going to do anything about it. She enjoyed telling people about her hard life even after I stopped being a doormat for the doormat!

That was many years ago, but I know of two now who have moaned for years about the failings of their (sons in both of these cases).
They will ring me and want to rant and moan - saying they have given them an ultimatum and that they mean it 'this time'.
One is a lazy 30 year old good for nothing living off his mother and girlfriend.
The other is in his early 20's, who the mother treats as though he is her husband. She wants him to stay with her forever, although often tells him to get his own place when they have a row. She even goes out to meet him when he is on his way home, if he goes out at night.

Both of these sons have issues and can manipulate the mothers, but the mothers, no matter how much they complain bitterly after a row, will continue with the same behaviour as soon as they have 'made up'.

I have told both of them that I don't want to hear the same story any more as things will never change.

I then am given the cold shoulder until they need my ear again. I will listen to them, but not about their sons who they are enabling to behave in the way they do.
I do believe that the mothers feel 'needed' and they are manipulating the situation too.
From the outside, it is very unhealthy.

rose28454

meritaten wrote: »

Rose - read this again - then think hard. WHY are you so scared of her 'kicking off'? WHY does her opinion of you matter so much? WHY on earth do you tread on eggshells around her all the time? who is in charge here? easy one to answer - SHE IS!
sending an email to someone who has upset you is NOT a terrible thing to do! if you are just telling someone they have upset you and how, its perfectly fine! again - you are putting too much credence on how SHE reacts!
Rose - Your life is not your own - she owns you. she rules you - you may have a 'little rebellion' now and again..........but she soon brings you back to heel. and her life becomes the way she wants it again.
She has no respect for you - she doesn't see you as a kind loving mother...................she sees you as a slave to her wants. she doesn't even give you 'wages'! yet you let her live in your house, you do her washing, deliver it to her room (which she cant even keep nicely), keep her secrets, take her abuse, love and try to help her....................and she despises you in my opinion. that is how I and I think others on here read her. and that is from YOUR posts and you try so hard to make us think she is 'depressed etc'.
I have a son who suffers severe depression and have an OH who does to. they do not treat me like your DD treats you. because they have 'respect' for me.
I am sorry Rose - I know these words will cut you - but, can you honestly say they are not true?

I have to say this Rose - I don't think your daughter is depressed, I think her mental problem goes way beyond that. I think she sounds like a real sociopath or at least a narcissist. who is not getting all their own way!

I know all you have written is true and I am sat here in tears getting ready for work. I was just looking for a slip of paper and found a load of papers from her therapy last year. They all seem to say that we ( her parents and family) just needed to care for her and respect her and let her make her own decisions. I nearly laughed out loud. What a joke. We have given her all the support and money she needs and she throws it back in our faces. No chance to speak to her last night and she is out tonight at his so I am going to speak to her on Thursday about paying keep and all the other things in the very short term and moving out asap ( Xmas at the latest) with him or wherever else she wants to go. She knows I am on the warpath and is treading very carefully.

Caroline_a

rose28454 wrote: »

I know all you have written is true and I am sat here in tears getting ready for work. I was just looking for a slip of paper and found a load of papers from her therapy last year. They all seem to say that we ( her parents and family) just needed to care for her and respect her and let her make her own decisions. I nearly laughed out loud. What a joke. We have given her all the support and money she needs and she throws it back in our faces. No chance to speak to her last night and she is out tonight at his so I am going to speak to her on Thursday about paying keep and all the other things in the very short term and moving out asap ( Xmas at the latest) with him or wherever else she wants to go. She knows I am on the warpath and is treading very carefully.

I think you can do this without paying for her! And respect is a two-way thing!! What I am seeing from this is that she is bullying you - and the only way you deal with a bully is to stand up to them. Yes, it will be hard, and she won't like it, but I have felt that 'walking on eggshells' feeling from an ex, the feeling is the same be it from a partner or from a child, but I also remember the wonderful feeling of relief when I was out of the situation. Be strong, she should not be treating you like this, and you must move away from the 'enabler' position.

Learn to say no!

Gingernutty

rose28454 wrote: »

I know all you have written is true and I am sat here in tears getting ready for work. I was just looking for a slip of paper and found a load of papers from her therapy last year. They all seem to say that we ( her parents and family) just needed to care for her and respect her and let her make her own decisions. I nearly laughed out loud. What a joke. We have given her all the support and money she needs and she throws it back in our faces. No chance to speak to her last night and she is out tonight at his so I am going to speak to her on Thursday about paying keep and all the other things in the very short term and moving out asap ( Xmas at the latest) with him or wherever else she wants to go. She knows I am on the warpath and is treading very carefully.

:eek: Really? Her boyfriend has a place to live hasn't he? Wasn't she living there at the start of this thread?

She could move out over this coming weekend....couldn't she?

Am I missing something important?

Christmas is far too late....

duchy

Why can't you just tell her it isn't working out and she is moving out of your home as it was only meant to be temporary anyway .
You could even say it in front of her boyfriend .

Majestic1919

Rose - if you stop to think about what you have written in reply to meritaten, you will see that you are still giving her control.

As Duchy has said, confront her in front of her boyfriend.

She is getting an easy time and you are kicking the can down the road 'until Christmas'.

She even sees her manipulation as a game, as you mentioned that she knows you are on the warpath and she does just enough to keep you onside. At the same time that you have control, you do nothing about it.
It is a game and unless you accept that you are making excuses for not dealing with it, the game will go on long after this Christmas.

meritaten

Rose hunny, I AM sorry to have made you cry. I knew that what I said would hurt, but felt I had to say it.
you are still enabling her you know? you are still being too 'nice'. you are letting her make the rules again. She is the one who is deciding when to see you - she suspects she is going to get 'the lecture' from you, so uses boyfriend as a human shield because she knows full well you wont say anything in front of him. Then she stays over at his tonight - she may deign to come home tomorrow - by which time she will have her strategy for dealing with you all worked out - I can guarantee that on Friday you will be back on here.................devastated!
The difference between you and your daughter is that SHE doesn't care if she hurts you! as long as she gets what she wants - she doesn't give a Flying Fox about YOU.
I know you must think that your precious little girl is still in there somewhere if only you could find how to reach her. Accept that that child is long gone, and that you are dealing with a cold manipulative adult who, if she was a stranger, you wouldn't give the time of day - and you may well find the strength to really deal with her.
Sorry Rose, but my late MIL was a real narcissist and mistress of manipulation, but your daughter puts her in the shade. I really feel for you - but cant help unless you see her clearly for what she is and deal accordingly.
This doesn't mean you cant love and support her - a bit of tough love is what we have all been calling for all this time. It will actually improve her life if she is made to grow up and become less 'self' and more 'others'.