Self Respect vs Responsibility

POPPYOSCAR

preciousillusions wrote: »

I would strongly suggest everyone reads this article (especially if you are trying to argue against the existence/damage of victim blaming!): http://ontoberlin.blogspot.co.uk/2011/10/tale-of-two-rape-prevention-campaigns.html

I read this.

I really,really, do not think telling people not to spike drinks and that forcing yourself on someone is rape is going to stop anyone, and I think it naive to think it will.

Most of us know right from wrong and if we are old enough to be able to read a poster we should know that these things are not acceptable in our society.

Kiboko

I wouldn't get into an unlicenced cab - but not because i'd be scared of being assulted, because if it's involved in an accident there would be no insurance!

When I had children my way of looking at risks and dangers changed, being a parent does not automatically mean you do the right thing the right way, you want to keep your children safe by any means possible. Theorising about a perfect world is all very well but the fact remains people judge. They judge young girls dressed in skimpy clothing in a certain way, I don't want my daughters to be judged in that way and I therefore encourage them not to dress provocatively. The people judging may well be bigoted, or potential rapists I don't care I don't want my children judged by any of them.

BugglyB

POPPYOSCAR wrote: »

I really,really, do not think telling people not to spike drinks and that forcing yourself on someone is rape is going to stop anyone, and I think it naive to think it will.

I get this, but it would be nice to see that sentiment, somewhere, at some point. Especially in schools. You'd think it doesn't need to be said - don't rape people - or that it doesn't make a difference - but I dont see that much of a concerted effort.

A sort of 'shoplifters will be prosecuted' sort of tactic.

POPPYOSCAR

BugglyB wrote: »

I get this, but it would be nice to see that sentiment, somewhere, at some point. Especially in schools. You'd think it doesn't need to be said - don't rape people - or that it doesn't make a difference - but I dont see that much of a concerted effort.

A sort of 'shoplifters will be prosecuted' sort of tactic.

I quite agree with you and I think school is the way to go - possibly in sex education lessons?


There are signs up saying shoplifters will be prosecuted but it does not stop them does it. Better to teach people not to steal.

aliasojo

Daughter's school does lessons in 'thinking'.

Not sexually related as such but may ave a knock on effect.

The lessons were bourne from an increase in cyber bullying, mainly on Facebook and the class watched videos of how one girl started off bubbly and happy but became withdrawn, upset and depressed over a period of time simply because of what other people said to her and about her.

The kids spoke about how they would feel if it was them and what it was that made some kids be so horrible to others.

It would be nice if it was a first step to people respecting each other more.

Sadly, I believe there will always be kids who are just not nice and they grow into adults who are not nice, regardless of any attempts to change this.

I don't believe it's possible to eliminate all threat from others as I don't believe all others are able to be nice.

POPPYOSCAR

aliasojo wrote: »

Daughter's school does lessons in 'thinking'.

Not sexually related as such but may ave a knock on effect.

The lessons were bourne from an increase in cyber bullying, mainly on Facebook and the class watched videos of how one girl started off bubbly and happy but became withdrawn, upset and depressed over a period of time simply because of what other people said to her and about her.

The kids spoke about how they would feel if it was them and what it was that made some kids be so horrible to others.

It would be nice if it was a first step to people respecting each other more.

Sadly, I believe there will always be kids who are just not nice and they grow into adults who are not nice, regardless of any attempts to change this.

I don't believe it's possible to eliminate all threat from others as I don't believe all others are able to be nice.

Yes I think the same.

There will always be people who for one reason or another will not 'follow the rules' of society, but I suppose we still have to have a damn good try!!

GobbledyGook

I think it would be fantastic to live in a world where my girls could dress however they like and not be judged and that they could experiment sexually, if that's what they want to do, without being judged. I think that people's judgements should be equal towards women and men. I also think that we should be able to walk home in the dark without worrying and that we shouldn't have to worry about assault, or rape, or anything horrible.

However we don't live in a world like that. Some may think it's a disservice to girls to tell them that people will judge them in a certain way if they are sexually active with more than one partner young. I, personally, think that my responsibility is firstly with my 3 children. If my daughters dress provactively and behave in a way that is deemed "slutty" by their peers then they will have to live with that. It'll be all very well me saying that people shouldn't treat them like that, but they'll have to live with it at school or uni.

It's a bit like when I was a child. My parents should never have abused me or my brother. However they did. We knew that playing with toys was likely to make my father snap if they made a noise. So we made a conscious decision not to play with toys when he was around (at 5 or 6 years old - scary to think of it now). He was in the wrong, we knew that even at such a young age, however we knew we'd have to live with it if it did happen so avoided it.

Risks might be small, and it might be risks that we shouldn't have to worry about. However, I just want them to be fully informed about the world - the way it should work and the way that it does work. That way they make their choices and live with in the knowledge that they've done their best to keep themselves safe and well.

I only know one person who has been raped. It happened when we were 18. She is the one person in the world that blames herself. She got drunk, got separated from her friends, walked home with a bloke she met in the club and then invited him in for coffee. She should have been safe, he should have stopped when she said no, but he didn't and she wasn't. The fact that he should have stopped doesn't stop her questioning her decisions, doesn't stop her feeling stupid for separating from her friends and doesn't make her feel any better. It never occurred to her that someone could do that, I never want my kids to be in the position where it didn't occur to them that they could be in danger if I can help it.

Person_one

aliasojo wrote: »

Yet.

That could change with age.

Remember those noisy feminist from the seventies? A lot of them are still around and if they seem quiet its probably just because they're thoroughly depressed that some attitudes have barely changed in 40 years!

lostinrates

Person_one wrote: »

Remember those noisy feminist from the seventies? A lot of them are still around and if they seem quiet its probably just because they're thoroughly depressed that some attitudes have barely changed in 40 years!

One of them was my mil. Very vocal and very public. She died some years ago, But before then she said she had got some of it wrong. She regretted a lot of it and felt while the world had changed for her teenage daughter in many ways for the better in other ways she and her 'comrades' had got it badly wrong.

POPPYOSCAR

Kiboko wrote: »

I wouldn't get into an unlicenced cab - but not because i'd be scared of being assulted, because if it's involved in an accident there would be no insurance!

When I had children my way of looking at risks and dangers changed, being a parent does not automatically mean you do the right thing the right way, you want to keep your children safe by any means possible. Theorising about a perfect world is all very well but the fact remains people judge. They judge young girls dressed in skimpy clothing in a certain way, I don't want my daughters to be judged in that way and I therefore encourage them not to dress provocatively. The people judging may well be bigoted, or potential rapists I don't care I don't want my children judged by any of them.

Yes it did for me as well.

It was when we had our first child that my OH gave up smoking both for the health of our son and that he wanted to be around for him.

I used to worry about us not being around to bring up our children but now they are older I am not so worried about it, so perhaps I will take more personal risks in the future, who knows?