school insisting my autistic DS wear shorts

duchy

Bitsy_Beans wrote: »

My son is only in year one so not so far along. However his school are so accommodating its untrue. I consider my son to be so lucky to be in place where due to sensory overload he hates participating in music class (one TA tried it and ended up with him crying with distress) and whilst he stands up and sits down with the rest of the class he's not forced to join in thereby ensuring maximum distress for him and disruption for the rest of the class. The teacher acknowledges his issue and picks her battles accordingly. (this is not something Ive requested, today was the first I've heard of it).
rather depressingly it seems once you enter secondary school all bets are off and you're left to paddle your own canoe

Some primary schools are fantastic. My son was as blessed as yours sounds Bitsy. He was officially diagnosed at six but it didn't come as a surprise and as soon as there was a suggestion he would get a diagnosis the headmaster of my son's school literally leapt into action. Within a week he had arranged an LSA for him (someone my son knew and already had a relationship with at school and responded well to) and the statementing meeting set up. We had to move home in year 6 and I drove him 90 minutes each way for over a year as the provision could not be beaten. Secondary school was a bit of a shock I must admit-especially when the excellent SENCO left and was replaced by a man with no empathy who had no interest in AEN but wanted the job to ensure he kept his responsibility points up (on the pay scale) when his head of year responsibility points were phased out in a cost saving exercise by the school replacing individual heads of year with year groups that covered a widen age range rather than individual years to save money.

duchy

On a brighter note -I was stopped in the street a couple of weeks ago by a happy and confident young man who I supported a few years back. He told me how well he was doing -had started his own business and had his own place with his girlfriend-Made my day and I hope I contributed in a small way to helping him come so far. Some teachers had written him off .

Churchmouse

Bitsy_Beans wrote: »

.
rather depressingly it seems once you enter secondary school all bets are off and you're left to paddle your own canoe

This is what worries me Bitsy My grandson is severely autistic. When he was at his local Church school nursery class they allocated the class teaching assistant as his one to one and he did fairly well. Our local authority aren't brilliant at statementing either, their attitude is schools should just provide the support required. He was accepted ( after quite a battle, he was initially considered too special for the special unit!!!) into the specialist autistic unit attached to a normal primary school. They are brilliant, manage to tread the line between discipline and accommodating his "issues", and are fully encouraging. Pupils in the autistic unit join the main school for assembly, and join what would be "their" class for perhaps half an hour a day. My grandson is thriving in this supportive atmosphere, but of course there are only 8 children in the unit. And I should add that the children in the main school are lovely to the autistic children, having been educated that they may behave differently. Nobody batted an eye when my grandson removed all his clothes in the playground on a cold December day :rotfl: One little girl was just worried he'd catch a cold

I worry what will happen at secondary level, none of the schools in this area have specialist units. If my grandson meets with the attitudes your son has met OP I fear for his future. Refusing to wear shorts would be the least of our worries. I hope you manage to resolve this issue to your son's benefit. I do think one piece of advice from daisiegg is worth following, and that is make a nuisance of yourself. Regrettably it's true, those who make the loudest, most frequent demands/requests, are the ones who get listened to.

mucklebones

daska wrote: »

I have to laugh or I will cry at the memory of the day I finally got the EP's report on DS2. As it listed the problems he was encountering and the ASD markers and the help he needed I found myself 'happy' that he was officially bad enough to qualify for a statement. It's a sad state of affairs when one feels like that.

Wow that was me today when I found out my daughter has been referred to the EP hopefully for statementing, I feel like Im taking on the biggest fight of my life sometimes and my head is a tangle with all the health care proffesionals involved in my daughters care. It is sad when you have to base so many schooling decisions on whether or not they will get a statement. And its sad that you feel that much happiness and relief when they do get a statement. Its a feeling im looking forward to in a months or so time. Its very overwhelming, I think after every EDP meeting to date I have been overcome with so many feelings. Its such an emotional and hard time especially at an age where intervention and good support will make so much difference to a child with SEN.

The school that I have chosen for my daughter have an excellent SENCO and are extremely accomodating. I just am praying to something that she gets a statement which will enable her the best possible start. I know with the right support she will do so well, but without it I just couldnt send her. The next few months holds our lives at a crossroads. The not knowing is driving me crazy. She has a lot of support at her current childminders including a 1-1. She clearly has addition needs but with funding cuts even happening at her playgroup to her 1-1 means they have had to reduce her hours. Its a worry for school ..and after reading this I hadnt even thought of secondary schools.

Seems many parents with a child with SEN has been through an emotional rollercoaster especially where school and statementing is concerned. And all we want is for them to reach potential and be happy with as little distress as possible. Sorry waffled on but the emotions you describe just reminded me of how I was feeling at 11.00 this morning.

duchy

Hmmm I did kick off a bit yesterday didn't I !

The whole issue of AEN (additional educational needs)Is a potential nightmare. Many people have the assumption that schools will and do supply appropriate support and provision. They also assume that all teachers have the time and the inclination to help.

There are some schools with fantastic provision and some teachers who genuinely care and go the extra mile but they are the exception. I've come across both-and it often has more to do with the school's attitude than money. My son's CoE primary claimed to have never had an ASD child before (I suspect they did but not diagnosed) but pulled out all the stops as soon as the problem was identified-finding an appropriate LSA and also sending their SENCO on an ASD course but most importantly they WANTED to do their best and don't hide behind excuses. lthough I appreciated their efforts-I had no idea at the time just how exceptional this was-like the poster here who commented earlier that they believed all kids who need support get it-I too thought that but for many parents it isn't the reality.

You do need to push for support-and in some cases fight for it. I think most parents start off assuming that their school will do everything they can to support an AEN child and that provision is available. Most learn this is not the case and you do need to, at best "push". It's hard-many marriages don't survive the strain a disabled child puts on them so often it's a single parent, working and maybe also caring for their other children as well as giving the extra support to their disabled child who also needs to find the time, energy and inner resources to also fit in the meetings (always in working hours-you need a supportive employer) and be able to advocate for a child and ensure appropriate and adequate provision is offered. Sometimes it's just completely exhausting and demoralizing.

Teachers who are "too busy" to care, LEA beancounters trying to cut costs and idiots who think a child wearing trackkies instead of shorts to avoid them wrecking their whole school day with stress is an important issue. Then there's the "professionals" who simply don't understand autism -I once had a very heated discussion in the staffroom with a very experienced LSA who had no understanding of why her charge in the previous lesson had ended up in tears (this was secondary) because she had insisted he sit closer than he could tolerate to other students because it was easier for her. Fortunately the SENCO walked in halfway through our "discussion" -and told me later she was retimetabling the LSA but really IMO re-education would have being more constructive >shrug>

The solution basically boils down to money-money for adequate one to one support and for more specialist units within high schools. Primary provision is generally better -probably because the schools are small enough to see the children as individuals but our large high schools in the main don't have that luxury!

Bitsy_Beans

Now my SENCO told me yesterday that we wouldn't get a statement for my DS. Now should I be viewing this as a good thing or not?? I assume it's because in his reading he is above average formhis age and in parts ofmhis maths. She made some comment his writing wasn't enough to get him a statement. Hmmm I think I need to speak tomthe SENCO to clarify this as I don't have any idea about on what a statement is based

duchy

Talk to your LEA -there should be a document somewhere detailing their criteria for when a statement is appropriate. (Usually it's fairly flexible but a lot of LEAs don't want to issue them) Honestly though having a statement is a good thing as it's a more formal setting out of a child's needs and schools are generally held more accountable with one. It's also a lot easier to get provision at a new school with a statement in place as they HAVE to follow it until the yearly review and then any reduction has to be justified and can't just be reduced based on the school's finances or the excuse "we don't do things that way".

QuackQuackOops

concerned43 wrote: »

I understand it is for H&S reasons but what is the alternative? my DS would not do gym if he has to wear shorts.

as some of it is his embarressment over hairy legs - should I get him to shave?

No, you have to tell him to wear the shorts and not find a way to accommodate every single thing he gets 'anxious' about.

Even kids who are autistic can still act up the way other kids do.

Lots of girls get anxious about PE at school becasue they have to undress in front of others. They have so many issues about developement and periods and so many girls who are mean and nastly yet every single one of those girls would be told to get on with it.

If you let everything be an issue your son will make everything an issue, especially when he wants his own way. Autisum is not an excuse for everything.

daska

Bitsy_Beans wrote: »

Now my SENCO told me yesterday that we wouldn't get a statement for my DS. Now should I be viewing this as a good thing or not?? I assume it's because in his reading he is above average formhis age and in parts ofmhis maths. She made some comment his writing wasn't enough to get him a statement. Hmmm I think I need to speak tomthe SENCO to clarify this as I don't have any idea about on what a statement is based

Statementing isn't just based on academic ability/achievement (or at least it isn't supposed to be). It's for children who need support to access part of the curriculum.

Have you tried speaking with your local Parent Partnership? Or IPSEA? You'll find them more knowledgeable than the average SENCO.

Unfortunately, whilst I have known some brilliant SENCOs, not all of them are particularly good at or committed to their role. It seems to be that some take on the role for the benefits (more pay, less cover responsibilities etc) rather than because they feel committed to doing it well. DS2's SENCO is appalling, she's 'lovely' but she communicates via telepathy, doesn't know what the statementing process is, doesn't know what the parent's or children's legal rights are, ignores professional/specialist advice etc etc etc. Her latest ****-up is that DS2's statement is 'only' 25 hours instead of 30 - because she made no mention of any needs outside the classroom when she filled in the paperwork (class teacher's face = :mad:) so the paperwork will have to be re-done and sent in, with evidence, and DS2's file go back to panel.

And as I see it, one of the primary problems is that the majority of SEN funding is devolved to schools and the school has to pay the first 10 hours/week of any support. Therefore, unless a child needs substantial 1:1 support there can be little incentive for schools to push for statementing because it constrains what they can do with their budgets. But at the same time only a statement can be used to force a school to provide specific support. So is it any wonder some schools avoid statementing like the plague?

daisiegg

Duchy - how DARE you suggest that I don't 'care' about my students and that I am not a good teacher? I am an outstanding teacher and my discipline is fine and I get excellent results.

I think there are many pupils and parents who would disagree with you that I don't 'care'. Perhaps the mother of the girl who, in Y7, I only saw once a fortnight at drama club (something I give up my own time to do outside of school, btw) and could just tell that she wasn't quite settling in properly and something wasn't right - I arranged for her to see the SENCO - the next day her mum was in for a meeting weeping in front of me saying that none of her teachers had noticed that things weren't right and she had been at her wits' end not knowing why her daughter wasn't settling in, but me, who had seen the girl for 1 hour once a fortnight had noticed and CARED enough to pursue it and now she has a diagnosis of dyspraxia and is on School Action Plus.

Or the girl in my form whose face just 'doesn't fit' in my school and who can't get herself organised and is in constant trouble, with detentions most lunchtimes and after school - who I make come to me every day for 5 mins after school so we can go through her homework and what is due when and figure out what she needs to do that night (not that she does it...but I'm doing my best...I can't go home with her and make her do it!)...I have spent many patient hours listening to her and why the world is so against her and I have met with teachers she particularly struggles with and tried to give them an insight into her life and I keep a pencil case for her in my top drawer as she never remembers hers, so at least she can collect it from me at the start of the day and then that's one less thing she could get in trouble about...because I CARE.

Or the girl in my Year 10 English class who has just joined the school and speaks barely a word of English, despite having been in the country for 8 years - clearly her previous schools were diabolical - but who doesn't qualify for any help because she has been in the country for so long and there only would have been money for help for her in her first two years - who I have had to fight tooth and nail to help, and get help for, and spent weeks nagging everyone possible and keeping photocopies of her work and thrusting them in people's faces and hanging around the SEN office and dragging the poor girl to spelling club and homework club and engineering friendships for her with other nice girls and coaching her at lunchtimes for her speaking and listening assessment to try and get her confidence up...because I CARE.

Or the little girl in my new Y7 class who is so severely dyslexic that I am marking her written work at a Level 2, but she doesn't have a statement and therefore there is no help for her except going to spelling club and touch typing club. I have been phoning the SENCO practically every day about her hoping that pester power works, I have bought books (out of my own money btw) on dyslexia to figure out how I can help her and printed worksheets etc off the internet to go through with her at lunchtimes...because I CARE.

Or the girl who is now in my Y11 class but who I met in Y10, whose parents were worried she may have dyslexia though it has never been brought up before, who the SENCO dismissed because "it would have been diagnosed by now"...who I met with once a week to go through her homework, met with her parents every half term, eventually got the SENCO on board although her parents had to pay for her to be assessed, she has been assessed as being on the dyslexic spectrum and has qualified for extra time in her exams, parents are very pleased as they could never make anyone listen to their concerns before and it looks like she can still get the B she needs to get into sixth form, through lots of hard work from herself, her parents and I.

Or the girl who was in my Y11 class last year who everyone thought was a total waste of time, who by the end of Y11 was so wasted on drugs and alcohol the whole time that she barely came to school and when she did, was catatonic - who the school had basically given up on - I was DETERMINED that she would get her C in English so she would at least have some options - and I bullied her and dragged her through doing all the coursework she had left incomplete throughout the two years (I only inherited her class halfway through Y11) - I phoned her at home on the mornings of exams to wake her up and make sure she came to school - I stood at the entrance to the exam hall with my little 'Harriet pencil case' for her because she barely managed to dress herself let alone remember a pen...because I cared. Despite the fact that she was a very unpleasant girl who called me a c**t once because I was trying to get her to do some work instead of lying on the floor under the desk.

And you bl*ody DARE to say I don't care? I work through EVERY single lunchtime at school (as do lots of other teachers) and most of that is working with particular students who just want to talk or need extra support or go through their homework or whatever. The examples I gave above, are just a few of many - I could have sat here and given you 50 similar stories. I don't want praise or a medal for any of this, I know it is just par the course for a good teacher - but it really, really gets my goat when someone like you who has never met me and has no idea what I'm like makes such wild statements about me, without knowing how much I do for those kids and how much I do care, to the extent that OH has to tell me to switch off when I go quiet during a nice meal out and he asks what's wrong and I say "oh, I'm just thinking about x in Year x and wondering whether she is managing to do that homework" etc...

Yet because I am aware there is a girl in my Y8 class who is on the autistic spectrum, but who is bubbly, enthusiastic, always gets her homework in on time, is doing well, has lots of close friends and is always cheerful - and I haven't found out more about her condition yet - you tell me I don't care about my pupils?

In my school, we have four students with statements (three of them for medical needs, one for autism). As such, we have about five LSAs, not all full time. Three of the statemented girls are leaving this year (in Y11), so we will then have ONE statement in the whole school. The LSAs are worried about their jobs, because there won't be funding for them anymore. It is not POSSIBLE for me to 'ask for LSA support' if there is a student in my class who is struggling. It is not there. Added to which our SENCO is cr*p, has no qualifications and can't even spell and punctuate properly herself.....your magical solution of "go to the SENCO" about all my pupils is not necessarily going to work so well.

You mention you'd 'go and talk to the SENCO' when you have concerns about a child. Well, that's exactly what I do - but the particular girl in my Y8 class I mentioned, I don't have any concerns about her. If I hadn't noticed her name on a list I wouldn't even have known she was on the spectrum; she is doing absolutely brilliantly and, as I said, is bubbly, giggly, working hard, getting good grades, getting her homework in on time, and has lots of friends. The point I was making was that if the OH's son also appears to his teachers like this girl does (not sure if that's the case - was just presenting an 'if' scenario) then they may not be seeking advice on what he needs, simply because to them he looks fine. Whereas if it is someone like the many other examples I have given above, who clearly DOES need help, I don't hesitate in getting it done.

Incidentally, after that post yesterday I logged onto my school's SIMs system and looked up the girl we're talking about - there is nothing on her record explaining the nature of her difficulties etc, it just says she 'has been diagnosed with mild autism' (which is where I noticed it in the first place, as obviously I always read the records on all of the students in all my classes). So I sent a quick email to the SENCO...who has since replied saying "this was a diagnosis when she was very young, since then she has had no problems, parents don't want her to get extra help or be 'singled out', keep an eye on her as you would any child but she is getting along fine, that's why you haven't been told anything about her before". So, my assessment that she was 'getting along fine' was just right.

I am still fuming about your post to me (it made me cry to read it, it felt so unjust) but I hope I have put forward my side of the story.

OP - sorry to hijack your thread - and hope a point has come through this, which may not apply to your son at all - which is just that, if he looks to outward appearances like he is doing fine then he may not be at the top of teachers' radars, and it's never a bad thing to be a pushy parent. That was all.