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Oldernotwiser

splishsplash wrote: »

i'm quite sure we are all capable of murder and robbery too.
There's a world of difference between 'being capable of' and 'engaging in'. While we are all certainly faced with choices, MOST remember the vows they took and honour them. MOST walk away from potential disaster situations without a second glance.

Without a doubt, anyone who chooses to go ahead and be unfaithful has already left the marriage far behind anyway.

Like any new behaviours, the first time is the hardest, after that, the pattern is there, the mindset that allows someone to rationalize what they're doing is learned, and so it is easier to repeat the behaviour.

So it is entirely reasonable to expect the OP to realise that her husband may revert to this type of thinking in the future... or revert to 'type'.

I'm in a long term faithful marriage and I do believe in the importance of fidelity. I'm also unsure whether I could forgive someone who'd done this to me.

However, I also have friends who have worked through an infidelity and now have a stronger relationship than before. That's not at all thing as someone who's a serial philanderer though.


Oh, and I wouldn't bandy words like "most" round quite so readily as it's considered that 60% of married men will have an extra marital affair in their lives and 40% of women also, so the majority of marriages will be affected by infidelity at some time.

Padstow

alias*alibi wrote: »

Newcook; husband told me she wanted kids with her ex but as he had 3 from a previous marriage he didn't want anymore. On one of the telephone conversations I've had with the OW when she found out she was pregnant she said to me 'this isn't what I planned to happen as I don't want kids'...so who knows who was telling the truth.

Edited to say she found out on boxing day she was pregnant; apparently they were going to the boxing day sales until she found out she was pregnant then she spent the day at home depressed and my husband went to his parents. Says it all how much that pregnancy was wanted.

Says even more about your husband's lack of compassion.

victory

The thing about not wanting anything to do with the baby is that however the baby was born into this world, obviously to yourself a constant reminder and through your husband that little baby is still innocent, is still blameless and still needs love, when the baby grows up and asks about his dad and gets told about the circumstances and how daddy did not want anything to do with you.....the situation will never go away, whether now you both do not want anything to do with the baby or not...

peachyprice

Kay_Peel wrote: »

And as for no solidarity amongst the "He's-A-Scumbag-And-How-Dare-He-Turn-His-Back-On-A-Baby" group - do me a favour! :whistle:

Kay, OP said specifically that there is solidarity for the OW, which I don't believe there is, at all.

alias*alibi wrote: »

If no baby was in the equation here would these posters still feel solidarity towards a woman who 'helped' tear a family apart?

Person_one

Oldernotwiser wrote: »

All men (and all women) are capable of infidelity in certain circumstances; there is no "type" and everybody is capable of change.

I don't believe that.

I know myself better than you possibly could and I know I will never be a cheat just like I know I will never be a murderer or an animal abuser or a bank robber.

princessdreamer

You need to realize this is all down to your husband. The OW is not a psyco she was lied to and betrayed just as you were. He needs to build a relationship with his child and you need to stay out of it.

Seanymph

Some people aren't capable of change - because they take the easy path again and again and again and their life is stacked up to support them in those choices. Including surrounding themselves with people who don't challenge them and collude in their behaviour.

Generally when people start challenging them, or holding the accountable they move on and find another willing soul to support their life choices.

My ex did this. He always lined up the next one, bad mouthed the last one, and moved along as a victim - invariably with no money, no where to live, and no job.

The poor sucker he had next lined up would offer him a roof, support him financially, and 'help' him (so would his parents, at nearly 40 he still drives a car owned by his fathers company that he doesn't work for!) - as and when they wise up after several years of him 'losing jobs' and them having to work two to pay the bills whilst he takes up hobbies and holidays that they support and they start asking more of him he lines up the next one and blames the last for his bankruptcy or debt crisis or whatever.

I didn't see the pattern until a long way down the path, but now know of four of us suckered the same way............. he won't change, he has no need to - he is abusive emotionally to the point that he doesn't get challenged and the poor woman is only too happy to walk on eggshells to keep him sweet because life is intolerable unless he is - and he won't work hard and be industrious because he doesn't need to. his system of approaching life works well for him and he couldn't give much of a stuff about anyone else. He sees his two children once a month for half a day when they are at their grandparents - their grandparents have regular access, pick them up and drop them off, and deliver them to a location closer to his home.

The OP's husband appears to use many similar tricks in avoiding responsibilities - he is a victim repeatedly, he lies, he threatens suicide and 'has breakdowns' when it isn't going his way. he also ensures the focus of the OP is on him, not on the child. And he avoids anything that will make him step up and be adult.

I feel so sorry for the OP, and know only too well that when you are deep in that level of being manipulated to allow a chink of truth through blows the whole thing wide open, so denial is a safe way and feels the only way. It's not, and eventually the light will get so bright she won't be able to ignore it any more. Hitching your wagon to such a person will mean she never feels on an even keel - and will never cope easily.

But it's not the OW that needs to change, nor the children, nor the OP. It's the husband.

Will he? Is everyone capable of change? I'd say no. Some people have coping mechanisms that serve them very well thankyou-very-much and I would put the OP's husband in that category - he's not the one suffering or making sacrifices - he has two women fighting over him, choices, and no one holding him accountable - it's not him in counselling it's the OP.

I personally think for the OP's peace of mind and the child of the marriages well being that he shouldn't be resident in the house. Certainly I wouldn't want him depressed, threatening suicide and making our home life so unstable for the child - he would have to prove himself rather than come back for me to parent him whilst our child watched............ but the OP will do it as she feels suitable. It's a shame though, generally such men choose caring, intelligent women who have just enough need about them that they work hard at a marriage that the men don't work at at all.

Will he do it again? Only if the OP asks something of him, or challenges him, or stops focusing on him and puts someone else, say their child, first.

But she appears to be happy being unhappy at the moment - and letting it be all about him.

However it's not sitting right is it OP? And there's your problem. Until you square up and get honest with yourself you won't ever be comfortable and that discomfort will rankle and that's why you can't settle.

I can't hate the OW at all, and OP I think you need to soften up a bit there - she's a victim of him too - when my ex left I wanted to email the latest target who he'd been seeing behind my back and let her know, but I knew she wouldn't listen, because I wouldn't have listed to his ex when I took him in - I'd been told how awful she was you see, and I'd seen her upset and yelling, and I knew she was to blame for his lack of work and lack of money...... I was silly, and wanted him so badly I believed him because that was easy. But not in the long run it wasn't. In the long run by not facing things and questioning them and being open to them early on you store up a lot more hurt.

I don't think the thread should be closed, there is a lot here that could help another member who may not want to post.

Marisco

Personally, I'd kick him out or leave myself. I know I couldn't "hack" it, with a "reminder" of what he had done! I know what I am like, and it wouldn't be fair to anyone to stay. I'd be continuously wondering if he was thinking about the other child, or worse, sneaking out to see her!!! That would inevitably cause arguments, which wouldn't be fair to my daughter, and I wouldn't want to live like that either. Only the op knows what she is like, but if she cannot "forget" (and the CSA is going to be there for 18 years!!) then it would be best to split.

I understand what people are saying about the father, and how he should have contact etc, but if he is adamant that he doesn't want to, then forcing him would only make things worse! The problem I would have, and I understand why the op is made up he doesn't want contact, is if he changed his mind a few months/couple of years down the line. The op would think everything has "settled down" then comes the bombshell! Personally, Id not want to live with that hanging over my head. But that is my personal view, everyone is different, and have to do what is best for them.

clairec79

A*A I hope you can get through this and that you and your daughter can have a good, happy life - I can't imagine having to deal with a living reminder of my husband's infidelity and it must be hard and noone would blame you if you decided you couldn't get past that, I hope that you do, at least to get through the anger.

A few things I do want to say about the baby, from what you have said about the OW I'm sure you can see why people are showing concern for her (child not the OW), if this was not your husband's child but she was, say, your next door neighbour and you knew a newborn was living with a parent in the situation she is would you ring social services (I know you work for them, so contact them however) - if that is the case, then refer her as the child may need help. If however you feel that the anger from the OW is aimed at your husband (and you - not saying she has any reason to be angry with you but it's easy to paint the OW as the bad guy and in her eyes you are the OW, despite being married to him) and the baby is safe then don't.

The other thing you may have to consider in the future is your daughter, does she/will she know that she has a half sister out there? what will you do if she asks about her. My husband had a half sister which he never met as didn't see his father from toddlerhood, he was aware she existed but no more - when she died (car accident when she was 18 or 19) he wished then that he had met her at least once because 'it wasn't her fault our father was a !!!!!!!!, and she was still my sister'

MoreOn

Seanymph wrote: »

But it's not the OW that needs to change, nor the children, nor the OP. It's the husband.

Will he? Is everyone capable of change? I'd say no.

I don't think the thread should be closed, there is a lot here that could help another member who may not want to post.

Absolutely, it could help some recognise there are so many individuals on the forum that mostly point blame for ills at the mans feet, noboday else could be to blame ... Perhaps the blame game comes from bitterness, I couldn't say that is true and i'm sure those individuals would accuse me of not understanding their situation... Well yep all true, yet those same indviduals feel they know people they haven't met and can judge their past and future....

I've never laughed so much in my life....

Mods please keep the thread open for pure comedy value.....