9 yr about to be excluded again :(

elisebutt65

Awww hugs!!!!
Know what you're going through - my 11yr ol went back after a weeks suspension on Monday only to then spit at someone and get a days' internal exclusion on Tuesday!!!

He can't explain why he does what he does either - only that he can't help it and then cries his heart out when he gets home!

He sees the ed psych every week now in school as well as the child psych every fotnight after school.

Still wondering whether to bother doing my appeal for DLA - Can't get hold of CAB on phone and haven't much energy left for anything else at the mo.

mariejader

Sorry to hear you are still having a bad time, have you visited CAMH's yet?

I am including a link to another site which you may find usefull

http://www.inclusive-solutions.com/

I am sure you are not just dealing with a naughty boy here so please don't feel like you have failed I know it's easier said than done, from what you have posted before I am sure you have a child who has other issues and once you find out what they are you will be able to put things in place to help him

Carrera74

He's been excluded. Got the call at 2.45pm as he had lost it again and had hit a teacher and a child. I've just gone to pick him up and my Mum had got there first and had managed to calm him down. When I went in he looked at me and his little face looked so sad. He was bright red with crying He said I don't like him now because of today. (I sat with him last night and told him I wanted him to get to the end of the week with no more calls from school and that if he got excluded I would be really angry and upset). I told him of course I like him and I wouldn't shout and let's go home.

The Head said he had started from nothing. One minute he was sat on his chair and then he just got up and sat on the bench at the side of the room. The teacher told him to go to the quiet area which he did but then he came back in the room. I'm not exactly sure what happened next but he ended up hitting a teacher and then 2 teachers sat beside him in the corridor so he couldn't hurt anyone else. He had lost it and was lashing out. The Head said she then came and he ran to the library which is his quiet area and she had left him in there. When I went in he has marks on both of his forearms which looks like he's been dragged. I went out of the room and spoke to the Head and she said she had to take him to one side as he was lashing out and she may have done it to one of his arms. She was apologetic and I know how he gets. I was full of bruises the other week and they had obviously had him hitting anything and anyone. The Head is going to access training for staff as she was that concerned about how he was. I'm mad because when we went in the other week when he was lashing out the SENCO made a point of telling us how to restrain him if we needed to and to definitely not drag him by his arm and yet that's what appears to have happened.

He needs help. I don't see this getting any better until he's assessed and hopefully they'll find something to help us fix my little boy.

He sat with me last night like the good little boy he can. We spoke about what had happened at school yesterday and I explained the strategies again with him. I told him I don't expect him to be perfect but me and oh are doing everything we can to help him, school are and now he needs to help us too. He seemed to take it all in. When he went to bed he had a smile on his face and he got up this morning all chirpy and put his uniform on without being asked to! but then the angry little boy is back this afternoon and it's back to square 1

andycarmi

Carrera74 wrote:

The Head said he had started from nothing.

Oh ((((hugs)))) honey. It strated from something!!!!! Just she and/or others didn't know what it was maybe DS doesn't know, but its something!

It sounds to me your Son, You, family amd school... Are going round in circle. The cycle needs to be broken but how I don't know! I just wanted to wish you get things get track very soon.

Also wanted to say your DS needs you and your are doing the very best for him. Well Done.:A

Nikki

Your problems are sounding very familliar!! DS1 is very like this he too is a good kid at heart. I've had endless probs at school with him(and home). He was treated like a naughty kid from day 1 at primary and he was excluded on several occasions. He got a dx of adhd aged 7, but this didn't change the schools attitude towards him. The adhd dx didn't really cover his behaviour and last month he was dx with mild autism, the adhd looks to be a misdiagnosis that seemed to fit at the time. If a child with autism doesn't want to do something there is nothing that will make them do it, and if they are forced a temper tantrum will follow!! This is what your sons behaviour looks like to me. DS1 cannot see things from anyone elses point of view and believes ALL of his actions are justified. If a teacher made him make tents when he didn't want to he would feel kicking all the other tents over was a justified reaction and the teachers fault for making him go out to make tents! Was your son crying out of frustration? DS1 only really cries for this reason, people being angry at him and for reasons he cannot understand makes him cry with frustration. Making silly noises are normal too. I could write pages of behaviours and the problems they cause but I won't. Sadly DS1's autism dx came a little too late as I took him out of senior school after only 5 weeks. I have since found out that the problems he had(reading a book about autism and preparing for adulthood)are normal for autistic children in senior school, but the school refused to listen or support and prefered to punish. I completely understand your situation as I always felt like I was getting nowhere fast too. I think you should try looking into autistic spectrum disorder too.

andyrules

He's OK at home, what is he like anywhere else? Is it mainly school where he kicks off? Does he do anything else, football, swimming, I seem to think this was mentioned earlier. I'm trying to establish what environment/activity sets him off.

I agree with andycarmi, something happened, even something seemingly small, but not in his perception. I still think he's frightened, uneasy, challenged by something, and has a knee-jerk reaction rather than bad behaviour. I seem to do nothing but rain questions at you Carrera, but here goes again! Is there ANYTHING that he finds a problem, can he read OK, is there a particular lesson, a particular focus (eg, mental maths - they do it most maths lessons for 10 mins) which triggers the switch?

The only child I've seen like this was autistic, and I've seen plenty of kids who push the boundary!!

I said it back in the thread, and I'll say it again, I think you are a fantastic mum with the way you are supporting him. Trouble is, you know if you don't, who will? Please don't give up, people keep posting various links. Find out as much as you can.

Keep going
xx

Zara33

When your son has these tantrums, do you punish him for his behaviour?
How much of the domestic abuse did your son witness?

Carrera74

I spoke to him last night and his version of events was that he was getting frustrated with a piece of work and had asked for help but the teacher said she had explained it and to get on with it. He told me that he had been asked to leave class if he couldn’t sit on his chair as he was walking around the room being silly. His time out area was being used by another child so he couldn't go there so he didn't know where to go.

I’ve been into school this morning because he also told me they pinned him down and took his shoes off – the Head told me noone had touched him they had just sat beside him to stop him from hurting anyone else – I should have realised that wasn’t right as when he’s flipped he lashes out and sitting next to him quietly is impossible.

The 2 teachers took me through the day. The first lesson was Maths and he said he wanted to play a game but was told once he had done the work he could play a game and they also said that it wasn’t a hard lesson and he should have managed fine (maths tends to be his fave subject). He was shoving his work off the desk, squeaking his hands down the desk and tapping his fingers. At one point the teacher went over and asked if everything was okay and that he obviously wanted her attention and here she was to help and he told her to go away which she did. She then ignored him and at one point he answered a question and then began to do some work. By the end of the lesson he had managed to draw a square and the teacher praised him for the work he had done. It was then DT after playtime and they were building wooden shelters. He told me it had frustrated him and his teacher couldn’t help but his class teacher said a boy in class had offered to help to work with him as long as he ‘wasn’t upset’ (the description the class use when he has his moments). She said it started well but then the boy went to the teacher to say he wanted to work on his own so the class teacher then worked with my son 1:1. She said she tried everything, all the strategies but it was impossible to get him on side. He had thrown some material at someones face (he told me this but said it was an accident!?!) and then it appears to have all gone pear shaped. He was told he had 5 mins to either stay seated or to leave the class and then he ended up outside of the class and the teacher tried to stop him going back in. He punched her in the stomach and kicked her and she tried to guide him down the corridor as she didn’t want him going into class and doing it to children. She then said to his class teacher that they needed to get the children out of class out of the way. As the children were leaving and going past him he kicked 2 and punched another (he denies this and says the teachers are lying) and then the teachers decided to restrain him I could see they were upset and obviously didn’t want to do this but they had to do this to stop him hurting the teachers, children and of course himself. They did say he started to calm down but when the Head got there she told them to let go and he ran into the library and tried to baracade himself in. I think he did this as he was scared. He knows as soon as she arrives its gone too far.

His teacher said that it was like a battle of wills all day. Usually he just shuts down but yesterday and Wednesday had been a bit different. It ended up that way eventually with him tears, hands over his ears and refusing to talk but all day he had been refusing to do anything and trying to get his own way.

It’s like he can only come down once it’s escalated out of control.

His teacher said this morning that there had been 2 incidences of him crying at school. One yesterday morning and once on Wednesday. I spoke to him about this and he said he doesn’t know what’s making him sad but he did agree that he feels sad inside. It's breaking my heart that I can't fix it.

We are going round in circles. I feel so sorry for him. I’m going to ring round the different agencies again today for support and hopefully to help us get the help we need asap.

The edpsyc was in yesterday and made a point of saying that the department is down by 2 people and the next short stay school panel meeting is in March so if she doesn’t do the assessment the short stay school won’t even consider him and he’ll go back to school and this will happen again but this time it’ll be a permanent exclusion.

Anyone got a magic wand?

Carrera74

andyrules wrote:

He's OK at home, what is he like anywhere else? Is it mainly school where he kicks off? Does he do anything else, football, swimming, I seem to think this was mentioned earlier. I'm trying to establish what environment/activity sets him off.

I agree with andycarmi, something happened, even something seemingly small, but not in his perception. I still think he's frightened, uneasy, challenged by something, and has a knee-jerk reaction rather than bad behaviour. I seem to do nothing but rain questions at you Carrera, but here goes again! Is there ANYTHING that he finds a problem, can he read OK, is there a particular lesson, a particular focus (eg, mental maths - they do it most maths lessons for 10 mins) which triggers the switch?

The only child I've seen like this was autistic, and I've seen plenty of kids who push the boundary!!

I said it back in the thread, and I'll say it again, I think you are a fantastic mum with the way you are supporting him. Trouble is, you know if you don't, who will? Please don't give up, people keep posting various links. Find out as much as you can.

Keep going
xx

I say he’s okay at home. We manage it. It’s easy to give him the option of doing something and following it through at home as we can walk away if he decides to have a tantrum. It is mainly school where he kicks off but he’s had his moments at my Mum’s house but I’ve explained how to handle him and it seems to work and he’s acted this way when he’s been at his Dad’s. When we go out to restaurants he’s hyper but we can control it – we always make sure he’s got somewhere to run his energy off - wacky warehouse saves the day He used to go to football after school and he was fine there. I’d say wherever we take him he’s always a bit ‘hyper’ but manageable. It’s very rare that it escalates to how it gets at school although it used to be like that at home and everywhere else. But it’s like he knows his boundaries and can usually behave properly. He reads fine and has always enjoyed his maths. School aren’t concerned about his learning just his behaviour but I’ve seen him get frustrated with work he’s brought home when he been excluded and he does generally need a lot of attention starting off. He can’t just read it and get on with it. He needs me to go through it with him (which is fine) but every 5/10 mins he’s asking for help. Usually he knows the answer he’s just a bit unsure I think and wants to get it right. The only other thing that can trigger him off is if he doesn’t get his own way or if he’s playing a game with his sister he hates losing. The short stay co-ordinator who has been seeing him once a week has been playing games with him and has mentioned this to him – that some children hate losing and my son said he doesn’t mind it's the taking part! He’s very good at pulling the wool over peoples eyes.

Carrera74

Zara33 wrote:

When your son has these tantrums, do you punish him for his behaviour?
How much of the domestic abuse did your son witness?

We do punish him. He has a PSP and an Xbox and they both go for a week when he’s pushed it too far. He also loves the simpsons and watches it every night but that stops too if he’s played up. My OH had managed to get 2 tickets for Man U a week on Saturday. My son absolutely loves Man U! and we had told him as an incentive to have a good week that as long as he got to Friday he could go. Told him about the tickets yesterday morning and he was so excited. I now wonder if that was the right thing to do cause now he is disappointed he’s not going but understood the consequence of his actions albeit 4 hours later. So to punish him we take away things he likes.

I think he saw a lot of the DV but I'm not sure what he remembers. He was only small when it started so was generally in the same room. It wasn’t always violence towards me it was the way he spoke to me or that he’d pull the phone out of the wall or shout at me about this and that. If it wasn't happening in the same room the kids would be straight to me to try and cheer me up and they saw me in some states. It hurts thinking back at those times when my own kids were trying to console me cause of how their Dad was treating me.

He grew up with that around him and for a long time he wanted to be a policeman when he grew up, just so he could arrest his Dad