termination or single parent? PLEASE HELP

ftbworried

hobo28 wrote:

Quite frankly I don't think he'll want to know anyway and is probably more concerned about possibly having to pay maintenance. I bet if she told him she wouldn't pursue him for maintenance and she was moving to oz he'd probably be relieved.

I know this is totally contraversial but when there is an unplanned pregnancy the decision should be BOTH of the parents- the father SHOULD get a say in it. If the father does not want a child you can't blame him- no one can force you to want to have children. He shouldn't try to force the lady but what rights has he got? none. If he doesn't want to be a father then why should he have to? Everyone here is (quite rightly) talking about how he is FORCING her to have an abortion, but is anyone quite so quick to sympathise with the guy who's being FORCED into being a parent if she does keep it?

He has made his stand clear. If the OP's friend wants to keep the baby then that's fine (:j ) but I don't think that she should then FORCE parental responsibility (financial and moral) on the father because it was HER choice and HER choice only to keep it.

...and I know what's coming now... "Well if he didn't want to be a father then why did he have sex....". The same comments could be applied to a woman who wants an abortion but no one would ever say that- she'd still get her abortion just as she chose! Where as a man CANNOT chose.

To the OP. The choice whether to keep the baby is definitiely HERS- the guy cannot (and shouldnt) force her into a decision. But the guy has made his wishes known and she should respect his wish not to be a father to the child in which ever decision she makes.

hobo28

In an ideal world I would agree with you. As a man of course its awful to think that we could end up supporting a child I really didn't want.

That said, at the end of the day its the woman who carries the pregnancy and is likely to have to raise the child. Its her body, it really has to be her choice. Whats the alternative? Forcing a woman to carry a child she doesn't want?

Until someone comes up with a better system, I agree that the man should have a say but ultimate responsibility is hers alone.

FZwanab

Inkie you are right, but did you hear of the case of baby ann in Ireland, she was born to a young student and given up for adoption, she was loved and cared for by adoptive parents for 2 years and then the birth mother got married to the birth father and wanted her back, the high court there have allowed the birth parents to have the child back.

TheWhiteRabbit

ftbworried wrote:

I know this is totally contraversial but when there is an unplanned pregnancy the decision should be BOTH of the parents- the father SHOULD get a say in it. If the father does not want a child you can't blame him- no one can force you to want to have children. He shouldn't try to force the lady but what rights has he got? none. If he doesn't want to be a father then why should he have to? Everyone here is (quite rightly) talking about how he is FORCING her to have an abortion, but is anyone quite so quick to sympathise with the guy who's being FORCED into being a parent if she does keep it?

thanks again for more replies and help!
I do agree with ftbworried and have said this to my friend...
I havent seen her today, but I have been reading the emails between her and the ex... quite frankly I can understand 100% where he's coming from and he has a right to choose not to want to be a father... which in this instance my friend have told him that if she decides to keep the baby, she will take full responsibility for it and wont ever ask him for anything...
she has an appointment booked to see a counsellor at a local health clinic on friday - hopefully this will help her in her choice - finger's crossed

Contains_Mild_Peril

FZwanab wrote:

She could also place the baby in foster care until such time as she feels able to cope with a baby.

I would only suggest that if she really really couldn't cope at all, otherwise it's just not worth the risk. I've heard far too many horror stories about parents turning to Social Services for short-term help and never getting their kids back.
Since she's lucky enough to have supportive family and friends, there's no reason it should come to that.
From what's been said on this thread, it seems clear to me that the pregnant mother is not one of those who (as her ex seems to imply should be the case) can regard termination as a belated form of contraception and simply get on with their lives afterwards as though nothing happened. If she already knows she would feel very guilty about it, then she would probably spend the rest of her life regretting it, especially if, for whatever reason, she should finish up childless. I don't think she actually has a valid reason for an abortion under British law anyway: it doesn't sound to me as though having a baby would be a greater risk to her health than having an abortion.
Her ex does not deserve a child, and since he's indicated he doesn't want this one, I'd advise her to try to have as little to do with him as possible. His current girlfriend doesn't need to know if your friend can manage without his financial support for the child and if he has no plans to take any active part in the child's upbringing. I'd advise her to ask him not to contact her again, and tell him it's her decision, and if he doesn't want to be a dad he should just go away and leave her to raise the child alone. If he wants to talk things over, I'd suggest doing so in the presence of his new girlfriend or not at all! If he wants to keep it a secret from her he should be willing to back off.
If she does decide to ask for a termination, she should find out as much as possible about the procedure, and the stage of development of the foetus especially if that makes a difference to how acceptable the option of termination would be to her. Pictures here show babies at 8 and 10 weeks gestation as well as later stages.

normallysomeoneelse

I have kept an eye on this thread and felt better about my earlier post when I read 99 % of the posts but the post by Contains Mild Peril made me want to post again.

I don't feel that this post was at all helpful to the OP, the suggestion that she should perhaps view pictures of a 8 week foetus is at best insensitive and worse could be described as spiteful, both to the OP and to those who have been truthful and honest enough to describe their experiences.

The passive threat that the OP might remain childless is an example of the worst form of emotional blackmail that I have read on this forum.

Also the suggestion that a termination based on the OP situation would be unlawful is unkind and likely to cause extra worry and stress, which at this time is the last thing that the OP or anyone in her situation would need.

This is a very emotive subject and of course people are allowed to express their own views but I feel given the sensitive nature of this debate, this post is out of place.

pandapiglet

normallysomeoneelse wrote:

I don't feel that this post was at all helpful to the OP, the suggestion that she should perhaps view pictures of a 8 week foetus is at best insensitive and worse could be described as spiteful, both to the OP and to those who have been truthful and honest enough to describe their experiences.

This is a very emotive subject and of course people are allowed to express their own views but I feel given the sensitive nature of this debate, this post is out of place.

i totally agree with normallysomeoneelse's post. This is the wrong place to express those types of views.

i too have used a different username and had an abortion (when i was 17), i was with my boyfriend for a yr (1st boyf, but now my hubby) when i fell pregnant, i was so confused about what to do, but in the end decided that because of my age a termination would be best - if there is a best in those circumstances.
my boyfriend stood by me 100% and i decided on the 'medical abortion' (taking 2 pills). I found the pain both physically and emotionally excrutiating. Afterwards i did nothing but cry, i didn't eat and i was a mess. (looking back i was probably depressed) I constantly craved the 'baby' i had lost and felt a big void in my life. I decided to start a fresh and enrol at college and get my life back on track, but something was still missing. Anyway to cut a very long story short at 18 i had my son, who has been the best thing in my life.

i'm still not sure how but 3 years ago i fell pregnant again, except this time i knew immediately that i could not, and did not want to keep the child. So i opted for a 2nd termination (something i thought i would never do) it was still hard, but i immediately felt a sense of relief afterwards.

I still can't understand how i related to each termination so differently. But what i'm trying to say is that it really does depend on the OP's friend's emotions and feelings towards the 'baby', and also how strong she is as a person. One thing i would definately not recommend is mildperils suggestion of looking at the foetuses onine, i did this and it was awful, and made me feel 100 times worse.
also, i don't know how true it is but i remember reading an article which went undercover to a few charity pregnancy 'counselling' centres and it turned out that many were run by pro-life campaigners, who actively discouraged terminations to their clients.

sorry about the long thread, and i know people won't agree with what i've done, but abortion is a personal choice/view.

coyotekate

pandapiglet wrote:

sorry about the long thread, and i know people won't agree with what i've done, but abortion is a personal choice/view.

I agree it is and thank you for sharing your story

bella4uk

Her father sounds so supportive and you sound like a wonderful friend that I'm sure this child will be brought into a world where he/she will be truly loved and you will look back and wonder why you ever worried....maybe?
But....spermdonor has made it quite clear he will not be around, which is quite hard to take, not for the child so much, they know no different ...silly things like going to parents evening, xmas concerts....of course many married couples end up with only one actively invovled parent also but it almost feels like a rejection that they don't want to know..... These are just occasional thoughts...single parents don't have too much time to dwell.
I am of the thought that abortion is not to be taken lightly and i also feel...(treading on dangerous grounds here.)...that if you are irresponsible in the hope of trapping someone or even just lapse and careless that maybe you should face up to the consequences. Unless of course it will mean your friend will be mentally ill over this...
Good luck...

BrandNewDay

normallysomeoneelse wrote:

I have kept an eye on this thread and felt better about my earlier post when I read 99 % of the posts but the post by Contains Mild Peril made me want to post again.

I don't feel that this post was at all helpful to the OP, the suggestion that she should perhaps view pictures of a 8 week foetus is at best insensitive and worse could be described as spiteful, both to the OP and to those who have been truthful and honest enough to describe their experiences.

The passive threat that the OP might remain childless is an example of the worst form of emotional blackmail that I have read on this forum.

Also the suggestion that a termination based on the OP situation would be unlawful is unkind and likely to cause extra worry and stress, which at this time is the last thing that the OP or anyone in her situation would need.

This is a very emotive subject and of course people are allowed to express their own views but I feel given the sensitive nature of this debate, this post is out of place.

Huh? I didn't see that at all. I thought the post was perfectly logical and not at all spiteful in tone. That it is biased against abortion as a moral choice I can't deny, but you can't just decry that as spiteful or viscious or even out of place just because it might hurt your feelings.