A good enough reason to seperate?

zzzLazyDaisy

Fang wrote: »

T While it's a noble gesture saying that you'll continue to pay 50% of the mortgage should you split up, but really, all you would have to pay is something like 15% of your income..

15% is only the starting point - it is what the CSA would award as maintenance for the child.

However, if the wife is a stay at home mum with a 6 month old baby, it is very likely that in the divorce an order would be made for spousal maintenance. Plus the court also has the power to order payment of the mortgage and the right for the wife to remain in the house until the child reaches a certain age - usually until s/he finished full time education. These are only options and it will depend on the parties incomes and circumstances whether these powers would be exercised, but my point is that 15% of income is the bare minimum and not necessarily the final figure.

gizmo111

In your post you say she has a blow up around once a month - I'm not in any way excusing her behaviour but do agree with other posters that medical advice would be a start to sorting this rather than seperation at this stage. It seems like it could well be a severe case of PMT - was she different when pregnant?

pupsicola

Could your wife be suffering from post natal depression? Some of the behaviour you describe sounds quite extreme.

I sympathise with you as I wouldn't want my partner constantly criticising and chipping away at me. She is treating you like a child, not someone who is her partner and equal. You should love someone for who they are and put up with their odd little ways, not run them down.

As for the swearing, well I think that is just vile. You are a grown man, would you let anyone else speak to you /treat you in that manner? Be calm but assertive and tell her straight that the way she is treating you is absolutely not on. It wont do your child one bit of good to grow up thinking that this atmosphere is normal.

I would try counselling, but it has to be something you are both happy to attempt or it wont work.

pupsicola

coolcait wrote: »

If this post had been presented as being written by a woman, talking about the way her husband treats her and speaks to her, I wonder what reaction it would have received?

I suspect that we might have seen more 'diagnoses' of domestic violence/abuse.

The behviour which is described is unacceptable. It is for the wife to change her behaviour. That may include seeking medical advice about possible depression, and getting treatment for it if relevant.

It should not include using 'depression' as a excuse for her behaviour, or as a reason for continuing to behave that way.

That is exactly what I thought and I am a survivor of domestic violence myself. Someone doesn't have to physically attack you to abuse you. There are patterns of behaviour to someone who is abusive and what was described in this post follows those patterns.

FBaby

sp1987 wrote: »

It reads a little like you are turning into her second child and she is turning into your second mother? I can say the romance must be lost a bit if you have lost your 'partnership' footing and you are now nagging/not listening to each other. She seems to shout and you seem to ignore her, so she shouts more and you ignore more.

Why is she blowing up at you? Very few people will care so much about how a surface is wiped that it will cause them enough anguish to argue over it. Is she getting controlling over the house as she spends so long in it that it is strange when you aren't there? If she has cleaned a surface during the day maybe she is overly particular about it? Is she lonely?

As for this 'making an effort' thing. She doesn't seem to think that you do make an effort. Do you? Can you both go out for the evening (or day if you can't find a babysitter, we go happily for romantic meals with our baby son in the middle of the day, lol) and both dress up? I do dress my partner a bit (he is perfect anyway I just like to and he seems to go along for the ride with it fine as it saves him picking clothes!), does your wife or do you try to resist? Lol. You haven't been married long so she may feel a bit like 'oh we are married now so we are never going to do anything spontaneous ever again'. Plus she is only 6 months post birth so is probably fatter/flabbier than she would like to be (even if you don't think she is). She may well be picking on your looks because she isn't comfortable with her own.

I totally agree with this. Have you considered for one second why she might be constantly nagging at you? Is it that she has unreasonable high standards, or is it that you are happy to let her do most of what needs to be done, thinking and acting-wise, and then complains when she gets fed up?

Can you trully look at your contribution to the household and say that you do as much as she does? Do you indeed make a real effort, or do you do just what you have to do for peace and quiet?

It sounds like your partner has been trying to tell you what frustrates her and you either are not listening, or not changing your ways, hence her frustration becoming aggressive.

You need to get together and really get down to it. If she tells you that she feels you spend too much time -doing sports - on the computer - working on your bike, etc..., or that it is always her -getting up at night or early morning with baby - doing all the cooking - cleaning - washing - don't give her enough attention - affection - compliments etc.... don't ignore it... it might sounds little bothers to you, but she might be spilling out all her heart to you. Don't consider that you just need to make a bit of an effort for a few weeks and all will be back to normal, she is most likely looking for on-going change.

This doesn't mean that you are hopeless and she is perfect, but your relationship is unlikely to work if she has so much frustration that might accumulate and become resentment and you fail to consider that you both need to implement change together. You need to sit down and really talk to each other about what is getting to you both and then you need to listen and REALLY make efforts to make changes. The good thing is, a lot of the time, when love is still very much present, just a little bit of effort will bring drastic change and remind you why you've decided to share your life together.

londoner1998

averagejoe78 wrote: »

Hi,

Not posted on here before but been a long time visitor. Really not sure what to do for the best and racked with uncertainty really. Its a long story but i'll try to keep it brief.

I've been married to my wife for two yrs and we've been together ten yrs and have a six mth old. The relationship (like most) has had its ups and downs however recently things just seem to have gotten worse, or my tolerance has got less. My wife is very opinionated and blunt and is always pointing out my inadequecies and jumping on the smallest thing I have done wrong/forgotten to do to have a go. Example could be taking the bin out, wiping surfaces, buying the wrong brand of shampoo, saying something to my family without consulting her...anything really. I'm not a complete sop and do stand up for myself (hence the arguements) and point out that I'm not perfect but the things she "blows up" over are trivial and dont warrrant her reaction which usually involves swearing and some name calling. This is mostly in private but on the odd occassion has been in front of others.

To be honest I think I've just become hardened to this over the years and just put up with it, on average there's probably one big blow up a month but it's more the constant chipping away with small comments about things i've done wrong that gets to me. She also quick to point out any failings in the way i look, the clothes i wear insisting she's just being honest as she wants me to look my best and "make an effort". Of course this is all amplified now having a young child and my big concern, which i have told her is that i do not want my child growing up hearing his mummy shouting and swearing at their daddy as happens now. Her response is its my fault she shouts as i don't do enough/get things wrong or don't listen to her. In fairness she has a point with the not listening bit as over the years i've got that used to constant verbals/nagging from her i tend to switch off and then of course i miss something she has asked me to do/said, respond correctly/do it/do it wrong and another row kicks off.

Inbetween bickering we do get on and both love our child and I can't deny she's a great mum it's just that the whole relationship seems a constant battle. I hate shopping but i've found myself offering to go do the food shop just for some peace and space - that's how bad its got!!!

So it's been feeling like things have been coming to a head for a while and we have discussed seperating not that long ago. It's such a big step though and at the forefront of my mind is our child and the effect it would have. I want to be a proper dad and contribute properly but wouldn't really know where to start with seperation/access/child maintainance/the house (we have a joint mortgage with 50k equity). If we did seperate i'd expect i'd be the one to move out but not sure what i could afford on my own if i had to pay my half of mtg and all bills on house as well. Also in mid 30's and going back to living alone and socializing seems scary and daunting especially as most of my friends are now settled themselves.


Any advice on anything appreciated, maybe i just need the chance to have a moan and be told to stop being soft more than anything.



Joe

Hey Joe
I'm sorry you are having to go through this. I'll give you my opinion, from the other side... I can be like your wife, blunt, opinionated and an obsesive in terms of 'wipe this', 'put this away', 'this is not done like that' etc... all in search of perfection. My OH is a lovely, patient and laid back man, a bit younger than me and I always have taken the lead, early days in the relationship I did most of the practical things, while he has been a great support when I was doing my Masters, etc... After my father's death I started to be like your wife, almost constantly nagging him and pointing out the things that were not done 'perfectly' according to my standards. My home became almost an obsession and through counselling, I came to understand it is my way of trying to keep things going, trying to keep it all together (my background is complicated and I lived through really horrible things with my parents, until my mum died of alcoholism and it was me who found her) and I am almost always on a high state of anxiety, which I had to learn to recognise and deal with. I realised I was also exhausted having to think for two. My OH is a relaxed chap, never too worried about standards of cleanliness or tidiness (he is my opposite), but I need things in order, otherwise, it all gets difficult.

In my opinion, your wife has got to used to this, probably as a coping mechanism- of course, I am no psychiatrist, but it seems that she is anxious and you bear the brunt. It is not fair on you and you need to talk to her and be open about how this is making you feel. I did with OH, from my perspective and he know contributes more in the house , which stops me from making comments so often. If I know he will do something for me, I will feel more in control and relax a bit more. Also she probably thinks, as you said that you don't take it seriously enough and therefore, only gets worse. She seems to struggle and try to do everything right, but is going the wrong way about it. May be she feels she is not good enough and it all comes out to you. I would say counselling would really help you both. I am not excusing her behaviour- I have done it and I can tell you it was my lowest point- OH didn't know what else to do to make me happy- it was all to do with feeling safe. Fortunately I had a great therapist and I knew the errors of my ways, so I was on time to sort it out and tell my partner exactly what I needed from him- ie to show he also cared about our home and relieved me of the day to day grind a little bit.
I don't get the feeling from your post that you have stopped loving her. I second the advice on going out for quality time just the two of you- we had virtually stopped going out (due t lack of money and grief) and all we had to talk about was work and the house...

I think you both need to talk and make a plan together- it would be a pity of you separated- please, think about it and talk to her...

Good luck
Ax

paddy's_mum

I couldn't agree more with FBaby and indeed, had there not been visitors for lunch, I would have written something very similar myself earlier in the day. I'm frankly amazed that so many seem to be laying much of the responsibility for this pickle at the feet of the wife when by his own admission, the OP is being careless, lazy and self oriented.

Does the wife work as well as run the home? Has all this been brought to a head because with a small child to care for, she needs practical, reliable help and the old slapdash ways now constitute insulting, highly negligent behaviour?

What does it mean when a husband says "saying something to my family without consulting her"? Is this shorthand for 'I make arrangements without her knowledge or consent and then expect her to just go along with them without protest, even though I know she hates being painted into a corner'.

What does a husband mean when he says "I don't listen to her"; "I switch off"?

I may be a mile wide of the mark but I would suggest that if the animosity has peaked since the birth of your child, although you've rubbed along together okay for ten years, then perhaps you should be looking to see whether your own laziness is the root cause. Could it be that it is her tolerance of your slapdash or slovenly ways that is fast running out?

I can tell you now that if you chose to consistently ignore me, frustration and resentment wouldn't take long to reach boiling point. Perhaps the only abuse going on in this marriage is that of a small child - masquerading as a husband - who wishes to be mollycoddled and forgiven his transgressions just like Mummy used to do!

I'd give a great deal to hear Mrs OP's side of this debate. I bet it would begin with something like 'he leaves everything to me, but calls me bossy and blunt when he doesn't like what I have to say ...'.

I wish you well OP but until you both start really listening, you're together on a rocky road to disaster.

Britwife

Relationships take 2 and lots of communication.

I'm sorry but I have to take her side based on what you say. Mainly because I have 3 children. I stay home and do all the mom/wife jobs and play with my children, cook dinner and so on. My husband does his job and will play with the children, but it ends there. That means, all the household duties are left to me.

See, I feel I never get a day off while he does. That part doesn't bother me. What does bother me, is he has it pretty easy for the most part so if there is one thing I expect, it's to clean up after himself. We moms have enough to do and if our guys can clean up after themselves, that is one less thing we have to do, which we shouldn't have to do for a grown man. I will happily do what I have to do, I love it and appreciate that he does work so I can stay home.

Sit down and talk with her and make it a point to clean up after yourself and take the bin out. Try going out for a nice family meal or even a date with her. Having a new baby is really hard and the first year can take a toll if you let it.

I hope things work out

clearingout

zzzLazyDaisy wrote: »

15% is only the starting point - it is what the CSA would award as maintenance for the child.

However, if the wife is a stay at home mum with a 6 month old baby, it is very likely that in the divorce an order would be made for spousal maintenance. Plus the court also has the power to order payment of the mortgage and the right for the wife to remain in the house until the child reaches a certain age - usually until s/he finished full time education. These are only options and it will depend on the parties incomes and circumstances whether these powers would be exercised, but my point is that 15% of income is the bare minimum and not necessarily the final figure.

I think there's a need to take care with this kind of thing at this point. Without detailed financial information, it's impossible to make any kind of judgement as to what may or may not happen financially. So's as not to scare the OP away from divorce if that's what he wants - my ex left me with 2 young children and a third on the way. I have a Masters degree and have always worked but after having children only part-time - at the point my ex left me I had one days' work a week and was living with a huge mortgage on a modest home in the south east. My solicitor laughed in my face (literally!) when I suggested that spousal maintenance might be a possibility whilst I got myself back on my feet - we did manage to get an Order for the ex to pay the mortgage on the family home pending its sale but that was it. Of course, it does depend very much on circumstances and finances but the bottom line is that the court system aims to send two people back out into the world on as fair a basis as possible with the two of them having roofs over their heads big enough for staying contact with the child and secure incomes. I had to accept being on benefits with no mortgage and no maintenance from my ex (self employed, CSA nightmare). I manage, I get by. So he got away with a more or less 50/50 split of capital and no on-going payments (until the CSA catch up with him, anyway).

We are, however, free of my ex which, as the adverts say, is priceless! :rotfl:

ruthber

AverageJoe, Have you had a chance to read these comments yet? It would be useful to find out which ones have been helpful to you.
i personally think that counselling/marriage therapy is the way to go. Do not give up on your marriage too easily. your wife needs a lot of support from you with the baby.