4658? 4659? The "is my Visa Debit card any good?" thread!

hate-banks

oh ok so there's no difference between Full Auth and Online then? Weird to have 2 different modes for the same thing. Thanks for your reply.

cd1951

I always thought that the first 4 digits of a card were the 'bank issuers' number - but this is or appears to be untrue!!

I know that the Electron card has been phased out and replaced by Visa Debit (I suppose it was the 'stigma' attached to the Electron card & that it was for electronic purchases only?).

I have 3 visa debit cards and they begin;-

4658 59 (Barclays)

4658 36 (ICICI Bank UK)

4508 75 (Coop Bank).

As far as I am aware they are all Electron replacement cards, I should also point out that with the demise of the Electron card some extra features have been added to the 'Debit Card' - mainly for use in 'Wi Fi' terminals. The original Electron card was not embossed-as in the USA a lot of merchants still use the old 'swipe (paper) machine-so therefore it could not be used there.

The Coop bank card did have issues with certain places (I was unable to pay my Capital One credit card bill online with it-as the 4508 numbers were not recognised-I remember that the 4508 numbers used to be ued by TSB credit cards!!) I am assuming that these problems have been sorted out now (have ditched the credit card!).

To throw a 'spanner in the works' my icici BANK vISA DEBIT CARD, WORKS IN 'PAY AT THE PUMP PETROL MACHINES - but the receipt comes up as 'VISA Debit SILVER'!! I can find no reference to Visa Debit Silver on Google or even the VISA own web site. ICICI Bank UK only issue the one Visa debit card, so I am puzzled why it comes up as Visa Debit Silver!!

When ICICI began issuing the Electron card, I did sit and read the little booklet that came with it and it had various 'things' that it could not be used for, mainly buying lottery tickets and gaming (online). I wondered how when i went to the Spar shop and bought groceries alongside lottery tickets, newspapers & fags-how could it tell that I was purchasing lottery tickets?? Sometimes it went through and sometimes it was declined. Also sometimes it said it was Declined but in actual fact the money was taken from the account!! Fortunately, I have other cards in my wallet-never relying on one at any time, as I have been caught out when a banks, link, visa system has gone down!!

So the theory that the first 4 numbers refer to the issuing bank aare 'thrown out of the water', as 4658 are both Barclays & Icici bank (ICICI bank use a LloydsTSB sorting code)-LLoydsTSB & Barclays are competitiors and 'not related'!!

A thing I would advise people to do, is to bear in kind that the various outlets that accept cards use various companies computers & networks and it only takes one to fail, for your transaction to decline or FAIL!! Two weeks ago, I used the ICICI card in the local chemist to get s'supplies' and I was told by the assistant that it had been DECLINED' - she gave me the slip, but when I got home and read it - it actually had said 'FAILED' - if this happens, it usually means that the shops internet connection has 'timed out'!! A lot of smaller shops still use 'dial up' to get authority for payment, even for 'offline cards' - it is part of the security to see if the card is valid and not registered a stolen!!

I keep a Prepaid Mastercard in addition to my other cards and about £30 in cash as 'back up' for when 'instances' occur!!

SO MUCH FOR A 'CASHLESS SOCIETY'!!

I think that most cards will be going for 'full authority' and only the 'wealthy' will not have to have their cards 'pre authorised', as the banks and terminal providers can make a 'few bob' sitting on 'verification' charges before they return then (if they do)!!

I have found that a Visa Debit card that I had from a UK bank (but issued in Cyprus), which is no longer around - I had a verficiation payment by ASDA for home delivery 'taken' from the account for £86 plus when the goods were delivered it was charged again. It took me a month+ and a lot of phone calls to get the £86 refunded!! Similarly Google Checkout are 'shy' about returning £1 verification charges!!

Prepaid Mastercards and some small UK banks do not recognise the 'Verfication' charges as a 'pending' items and they actually charge the account - so be warned!! Keep a check on these as I ran up £6 worth on a prepaid mastercard (kalixa) with Play.com and i had to make several phone calls to Jersey and landed up speaking to someone in the Philipines!! It was only when I got in touch with Jersey Trading Standards that I managed to get the refunds-but no compensation, so PLAY>COM is now blacklisted by me - they do not even reply to Recorded Delivery letters!!

I keep a track of my money using Quicken on my PC., as living in the sticks and the hopeless shops that I have in the nearest town forces me to buy online - these verification 'charges' can soon mount up. I am still due £1.00 for a DVD I bought in July from an online shop who uses Paypoint as their payments clearer, even though I have sent copies of my bank statements showing the actual charge-they still refuse to refund it!! The retailer got the full price for the DVD-so Paypoint are £1 richer because of my purchase-how many other people have Paypoint 'ripped off'?? All these £1's will go a very long way to their staff''s Xmas party if not their Xmas bonus??

All comments accepted for the above-quite a lot to get through, but showing people or trying to, to be careful with what they do and always have back up-especially now that the cheque guarantee card has finished!!

Toe-Jam

cd1951 wrote: »

I always thought that the first 4 digits of a card were the 'bank issuers' number - but this is or appears to be untrue!!


I have 3 visa debit cards and they begin;-

4658 59 (Barclays)

4658 36 (ICICI Bank UK)

4508 75 (Coop Bank).
!

You answered your own question here, and even went on to give the correct examples.

The first 4 numbers is a routing number an "IN" for short the BIN is made up of the first 6 numbers, it is this combination that determines the card type and organisation.

savagej

Also there is no "Visa Silver" product as such, the receipt simply states what the card provider tells it to put on it so ICICI have tagged this on the chip. It is like AMEX cards they usual show as "personal account".

SnowTiger

cd1951 wrote: »

I always thought that the first 4 digits of a card were the 'bank issuers' number - but this is or appears to be untrue!!

I know that the Electron card has been phased out and replaced by Visa Debit (I suppose it was the 'stigma' attached to the Electron card & that it was for electronic purchases only?).

I have 3 visa debit cards and they begin;-

4658 59 (Barclays)

4658 36 (ICICI Bank UK)

4508 75 (Coop Bank).

According to Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bank_card_number):

An ISO/IEC 7812 number is typically 16 digits in length. It consists of:
a six-digit Issuer Identification Number (IIN), the first digit of which is the Major Industry Identifier (MII),
a variable length (up to 12 digits) individual account identifier,
a single check digit calculated using the Luhn algorithm.

And there's a list of Bank Identification Numbers at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Bank_Identification_Numbers.

First_Sea_Lord

Toe-Jam wrote: »

Natwest, RBS, Co-OP, Have their Basic visa debit cards blocked from Pay @ Pump usage. So if you have the blue natwest card, or the RBS card that doesn't say servicecard, or the co op card thats really an electron (the one with the cashminder) they don't work.

I'm also pretty sure hsbc has its card without the cheque guarantee blocked as well.

The barclays basic one is not blocked, as you've just said. and neither is any maestro card, or solo. And also lloyds tsb basic card is not blocked aswell.

Santander's basic card also works.

It has nothing to do with the card number being 4658 or 4659.

Don't think SOLO works at pay at pump. Not many of these cards going about now right enough

stclair

First_Sea_Lord wrote: »

Don't think SOLO works at pay at pump. Not many of these cards going about now right enough

Solo cards are defunct now have been since the end of March and should not be accepted by retailers as a valid payment method.

Bosie

I have an HSBC Advance account and my card number isn't on the Wiki list:j My first 6 digits are: 4659 44. The one on the list is 4659 42 and says Visa Debit, but mine is defininitely above?

Was wondering if it is an offline or online?

Bosie

Just found this on another card info site:

4659 41 - HSBC Bank (UK)
* 4659 42 - HSBC Bank (UK) Visa Debit Card
* 4659 43 - HSBC Bank (UK) Visa Debit, NO Cheque Guarantee
* 4659 45 - HSBC(UK) Plus Visa Debit Card
* 4659 46 - Debit cards by First Direct (UK) - Division of HSBC UK

Still none with the 44, but I think the Advance account replaced the Plus account?

mikesten

I have a Bank of Cyprus UK Visa Debit card, the numbers being 4751 46. According to the Wiki list (which I appreciate is incomplete) this is an RBS card? :-/