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Help please with serious problems from Voda-evil
Comments
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Spirit, If I were you I'd stop responding to this thread. Whatever you say it's obvious that xxxx and you are never going to agree and this thread is going to end up consuming the whole of the MSE server.
We all have to accept at some point that you just can't help everyone...0 -
I appreciate your comment. But if you read all the tread, you will find I am in no way trying to link the two.
Indeed it was CNM and TMO, how were they able to offer cashback deals without having agreement with Vodafone in the first place? I never signed up with Vodafone, Vodafone just happened to be the airtime provider in both cases. I was put into a position to cope with the difficulties when their cashback collapsed. I got the deals from different selling agents, shouldn't they consider the 2 accounts in a separate manner? but Vodafone mixed them up completely against my will.
Sorry by your own comments you are saying you never signed up with Vodafone. Why do you now expect them to drop the charges. Vodafone will have paid CNM or TMO a fee for signing you up, which is what they use to give cashback. This had nothing to do with Vodafone, it's down to the retailer. Hence I can't see why your chasing vodafone, that would be like chasing Nintendo because tesco over charged you for a game. The two are not related,
Two lines usually end up on the same account, thats common, maybe it wasn't explained to you and thats another matter. It should have been obvious from the first combined bill and the amount you had going out in a direct debit had they had done this, so I'm not sure why you didn't realise this until they closed the account due to non payment.
I'm not commenting on the Christina / Chris comments, thats just getting picky.0 -
Good question, I am NOT chasing Vodafone for cashback at all but disputing the unreasonable charges imposed on my accounts.Sorry by your own comments you are saying you never signed up with Vodafone. Why do you now expect them to drop the charges. Vodafone will have paid CNM or TMO a fee for signing you up, which is what they use to give cashback. This had nothing to do with Vodafone, it's down to the retailer. Hence I can't see why your chasing vodafone, that would be like chasing Nintendo because tesco over charged you for a game. The two are not related,
The deals were signed up in different months with different selling agents, so when I first saw them sending me a combined bill, I immediately requested to have 2 accounts separated. And the bills were separated since, but they still mixed up with my 2 accounts when charging.Two lines usually end up on the same account, thats common, maybe it wasn't explained to you and thats another matter. It should have been obvious from the first combined bill and the amount you had going out in a direct debit had they had done this, so I'm not sure why you didn't realise this until they closed the account due to non payment.
OK, let us look at the facts:
1. While line 1 was requested disconnection, Vodafone continued billing for months before charging cancellation.
2. While line 1 was under dispute, they cut off line 2 again and again that was fully paid every month.
3. While line 2 was fully paid every month, Vodafone cut it off and charged cancellation as well.
Just one simple question:
As consumers, do you all find it reasonable and acceptable?Vodafone sucks. :mad:0 -
It is easy for some people now talked about the risks of cashback that we should be aware of when signing up. However, who truly understood the risks of cashback before the collapse of 'Dial a mobile Ltd.'? Just like who truly understood the risks of putting money in a bank before Northern Rock?
It is also easy for some people pointing fingers to those who took out cashback deals as greedy, while forgetting, in fact we are the victims of those unscrupulous rogues who had dishonoured and deceived.
Who is being greedy? Please do not make up your mind before looking at the factual figures:
Original deals that I signed up:
CNM with 12 month cashback £35X12 = £420
TMO with 12 month cashback £35X12 = £420
Over 12 months average monthly costs should be zero.
So far Vodafone had pocketed:
6 months on CNM Line 1 = £241
7 months on TMO Line 2 = £271
In total I have paid Vodafone = £512 minimum
While cashback received = 0
Over 12 months average monthly costs shoot up to £42,
made it average per line per month = £21 I have already paid to Vodafone (more than half price of £35 per month).
However, Vodafone is still demanding further £282 (while some invoices never presented), after they disrupted line 2 for 3 months then cut off the line and disabled the phone.
Ladies & gentlemen, may I ask? Who is the one actually being greedy?!
Vodafone sucks. :mad:0 -
So in total you agreed to pay Vodaphone £840, and even if you pay the £282 that Vodaphone are still demanding then you would only have paid £794. So you're £46 better off.Beware the deadly donkey, falling slowly from the sky. You can choose the way you live my friend, but not the way you die. (Edward Monkton)0
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Ladies & gentlemen, may I ask? Who is the one actually being greedy?!
To be honest, you.....
From the previous posts it looks like Vodafone have done much more than they were obliged to as a goodwill gesture (ie half price line rental etc), yet you were not happy unless you were getting everything for nothing.
When you took out the contract, you took the network contract with Vodafone through which you agreed to pay them £x per month. You then accepted a SEPARATE contract with the Dealer (Cool New Mobiles?) that they would then send you a cheque for £x every month or so many months: this amount just happened to match to the line rental amount with Vodafone, but is not linked to the Vodafone contract in any way. If you were not happy at losing out on the cashback then your only form of redress was to pursue the cashback Dealer. Vodafone have not fraudulently gained the contract through misrepresentation: the Vodafone contract was represented correctly - the cashback offer was at the time valid, all that happened was that the Dealer went bust.
All lines that you have with Vodafone exist on one account. When you pay money to Vodafone you pay it towards this account as a whole, not towards individual lines. Thus, if a payment is late on the account then the whole account (and every line on it) is suspended, and if no payment is recieved then they will eventually all be cancelled and you will be charegd early termination fees for all lines.I accept no liability if you chose to rely on my advice.0 -
It is easy for some people now talked about the risks of cashback that we should be aware of when signing up. However, who truly understood the risks of cashback before the collapse of 'Dial a mobile Ltd.'? Just like who truly understood the risks of putting money in a bank before Northern Rock?
I did, there have been warnings and comments on cashback schemes for years. A little research was all you needed to do. And apart from shareholders in Northern Rock (and I was one of those too) NO-ONE lost out with NR.
The way Cashback works is a network will say to a retailer "We will pay you £500 (for example) if you bring us a new customer". The Retailer can then decide what they want to do to bring in that new customer. What has happened is to get that new customer they offer £420 cashback (ie a years rental) so they have £80 left for their profits (£500 minus £420).
This is done WITHOUT any approval or authorisation form the airtime provider Vodafone really have nothing to answer to in this respect, your agreement is with the Cashback people for the cashback NOT vodafone. They have paid the "finders fee" out already and they don't want to be out of pocket.
Original deals that I signed up:
CNM with 12 month cashback £35X12 = £420
TMO with 12 month cashback £35X12 = £420
Over 12 months average monthly costs should be zero.
So far Vodafone had pocketed:
6 months on CNM Line 1 = £241
7 months on TMO Line 2 = £271
In total I have paid Vodafone = £512 minimum
While cashback received = 0
Over 12 months average monthly costs shoot up to £42,
made it average per line per month = £21 I have already paid to Vodafone (more than half price of £35 per month).
However, Vodafone is still demanding further £282 (while some invoices never presented), after they disrupted line 2 for 3 months then cut off the line and disabled the phone.
Ladies & gentlemen, may I ask? Who is the one actually being greedy?!
You are.
I'm sorry but you are repeatedly mixing up the contract you signed up for airtime with the cashback. They are two completly seperate entities. Your 12 month airtime contract is with Voda, your cash back with TMO or CNM.
You signed up to a 12 month contract with Vodafone. What you have or have not got back in cashback is irrelevent it's nothing to do with Vodafone, they didn't offer you the cashback. You agreed to two contracts at £35 each for twelve month so you owe Vodafone £840 for the year's service
Vodafone gave you airtime services for a year under the contract or at least until you stopped paying. YOU stopped paying so you broke the contract and Vodafone now want payment or compensation for the break of contract. As the account went into default they closed both lines on the account, thats standard practice. The payment you made on the second line would have effectivly paying off half the line rental on each line, not one line or the other.
You need to think long and hard what the future cost of this will be to you, and not just in money. You probably already have marks against you on your credit record for missed payments. If it goes further and to court you will most likely lose, unless you get really lax Vodafone laywers and a very sympathetic judge. At that point you will in all likelihood get a CCJ against you and if you still don't pay your going to get the debt passed to debt collectors or maybe whats called an attatchment of earnings order that will force payment out of your paypacket from your employer.
In this economic climate you DO NOT want this, any chance of credit at reasonable rates you have will vanish if you get CCJ's against you. You may find it difficult or impossible to get a mortgage or to remortgage. People with reasonable deposits and clean records are having problems so having any black marks will not work in your favour. CCJ's stay with you on your record for six years. I'm not defending Vodafone here but is it worth it?
Your not the only one in this situation, I too got nothing for my cashback, however you've left it far too long time after the initial event to complain in this way. if you'd tried to sort it out sooner you may have got more symphathy (I know I tried it on and got half price line rental). Remember Vodafone will have logged notes on every call and letter you made, can you say you have done the same?
Leaving aside your comments to Spirit if her dates are correct you've left this debt unpaid for over a year. It's been over a year since CNM went under (don't know when TMO went) and this too will work against you.
For what it's worth you need to talk to Vodafone and work out payment before it goes to court, be that a lump sum, an installment plan or anything, not talking to them is absolutly the worst thing you can do, especially at the current time.0 -
Thank you for this info, just not sure if Voda actually paid up as their selling agent who seemed to blame not enough commission received from the network to pay out cashback.The way Cashback works is a network will say to a retailer "We will pay you £500 (for example) if you bring us a new customer". The Retailer can then decide what they want to do to bring in that new customer. What has happened is to get that new customer they offer £420 cashback (ie a years rental) so they have £80 left for their profits (£500 minus £420)... They have paid the "finders fee" out already and they don't want to be out of pocket.
As I repeatedly stressed on that no one is asking Voda to pay cashback, it was the unreasonable charges imposed on my accounts that I am disputing. It was the mixed up contracts that brought me into this situation, I have never said Voda is liable to any cashback.You signed up to a 12 month contract with Vodafone. What you have or have not got back in cashback is irrelevent it's nothing to do with Vodafone, they didn't offer you the cashback. You agreed to two contracts at £35 each for twelve month so you owe Vodafone £840 for the year's service
Standard practice or not, does not make such practice being fair and reasonable, especially considering they got these 2 contracts completely unrelated.As the account went into default they closed both lines on the account, thats standard practice.
They did not even do that. If so the full price I paid for £35 a month on second line would have been sufficient to cover both lines on the half price each they offered. Furthermore, if someone was unable to afford 2 lines, we should be able to have one line disconnected, why Voda had to carry on billing for months before charging cancellation???The payment you made on the second line would have effectivly paying off half the line rental on each line, not one line or the other.
Voda had already sent out debt collectors back in Feb 2008, otherwise I did not have to go to CAB and Otelo. A sympathetic judge is exactly what I need, as everyone can see that the aggressive party was Vodafone not me.If it goes further and to court you will most likely lose, unless you get really lax Vodafone laywers and a very sympathetic judge. At that point you will in all likelihood get a CCJ against you and if you still don't pay your going to get the debt passed to debt collectors...
I will happily pay it off if the court still rules that Vodafone has done nothing wrong and not at all being unfair and unreasonable!
Thanks for your kind advice. :A At least some people can see why Vodafone needs defending.In this economic climate you DO NOT want this, any chance of credit at reasonable rates you have will vanish if you get CCJ's against you. You may find it difficult or impossible to get a mortgage or to remortgage. People with reasonable deposits and clean records are having problems so having any black marks will not work in your favour. CCJ's stay with you on your record for six years. I'm not defending Vodafone here but is it worth it?
If I pay off the outstanding amount in case the CCJ was not in my favour, would it still stay as 'outstanding' on record for six years?
They did offer half price on both lines, but even so I was still unable to afford to keep both lines.Your not the only one in this situation, I too got nothing for my cashback, however you've left it far too long time after the initial event to complain in this way. if you'd tried to sort it out sooner you may have got more symphathy (I know I tried it on and got half price line rental).
I did not leave it for this long, I tried to resolve it with Voda for months as I was desperately needing help. As Voda seemed not to care at all so I took it to Otelo last March based on the CAB advice. It was then Otelo taking their time, I was truly surprised that after so long they chose to side with Vodafone.
My log was their paper letters and bills, as any evidence without a signature could be misleading, as demonstrated by 'Spirit''s log.Remember Vodafone will have logged notes on every call and letter you made, can you say you have done the same?
I agree 'not talking' is never an option, but I can not help it when Voda refused to talk but just keep demanding payments even after I had raised my concerns to them.For what it's worth you need to talk to Vodafone and work out payment before it goes to court, be that a lump sum, an installment plan or anything, not talking to them is absolutly the worst thing you can do, especially at the current time.
For what I have paid Vodafone = £512 minimum
The actual services I have received:
6 months on CNM Line 1
5 months on TMO Line 2
(The last 2 months was constantly disrupted before they cut off the line)
Actual monthly average costs me £46 per line per month.
I resume services then if Vodafone is so desperate to have my payment, considering it was them responsible of cutting off my second line.:eek:
I have booked another appointment this week to seek further advice on best options available. Meanwhile, I maintain that from the evidence and treatments I have received from Vodafone on both accounts, and every sensible person can see that, I have NOT been treated reasonably.Vodafone sucks. :mad:0 -
I have booked another appointment this week to seek further advice on best options available. Meanwhile, I maintain that from the evidence and treatments I have received from Vodafone on both accounts, and every sensible person can see that, I have NOT been treated reasonably.
Make sure you take ALL the info, not just the bits that you feel prove your case.
Enough people here have told you that you don't have a hope with this and getting advice on incomplete info will not help your case.0
, I wish I could take your advice seriously :rolleyes:. This discussion has been closed.
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