Bulk LPG - Cheapest suppliers / supply route?

caroline233

I had a visit from the Countrywide rep yesterday, who was very pleasant, wandered round my garden with me and had a look at my existing (Macgas/BP) tank. Having done my homework thanks to you all on here, I had already decided it wasn't in a suitable spot. He confirmed that its location, just over a metre away from a telegraph pole carrying high voltage cables and a metre from my boundary is completely unlawful, plus it is a metre from the wooden shed, has no concrete base and sits directly on the ground. When I had the emergency shut off valve relocated the engineer connected the new plastic pipe underground to the existing copper pipe, also against the law. Yet every time the driver has delivered to me, he must have certified that it is safe and complies fully. It really does amaze me how little the gas companies care about the regulations and how much they get away with.

chubbs85240

Well a bit of an update

I decided to move to avantigas at 43.9 +vat fixed for twelve months

I phoned Macgas and told them I was moving and therefore please do not fill me up

The next day I got a letter telling me that as i will have seen in the press most companies have put their price up and therefore they can no longer hold current price levels as propane prices have remained high so with immediette effect my price will increase by 5ppl to 76.95ppl + vat

I then arrived home to find they had put 750 litres in the next day

I therefore phoned Macgas and told them I wasn't happy as they knew I was moving

They were actually pretty good and said it was within 24 hours of my no fill up request and systems hadn't talked so they asked me what price I was getting

I said 42.95ppl

They said they would only charge me 42.95ppl for that delivery and if I stay with them they will fix my price at 42.95ppl for twelve months (previous their best deal was 49.95ppl fixed for 6 months)

So now a better deal available at Macgas and I am going to go back to avanti and see if I can squeeze them down a penny or two to continue with my transfer

PaulF81

Was offered 48ppl today by calor in the south west. Mac gas have just put their prices up to 55.9ppl, which is an absolute joke. They tried to twist my arm into a new contract the other day, mac gas can ram it.

So far, my experience of the bp takeover has been 2 snotty letters asking for payment (we had paid a week previous) and a price rise. So not so good so far.

Anyone know if a customer can buy their LPG tank?

chubbs85240

Not sure if you can, or whether anyone would then deliver to you, as your annual rental usually covers maintenance also.

However, if you look back through the last few pages, you will see the website to check which suppliers are available in your area, and you should be able to get a better deal than what Calor have offered

I live in the NE of Scotland and can get prices as low as 41.9 ppl + VAT for 3500 litres a year, so would expect you can get as low as this if you haggle with them all

LittleVermin

PaulF81 wrote: »

<snip>

Anyone know if a customer can buy their LPG tank?

YES.

The price for outgoing-incoming tank switches is worked out from the formulae in the Competition Commission Order based on their 2006 Report into Domestic Bulk LPG which came into effect in 2009 - and was partly designed to make the 'market' more competitive. (See Schedules 1 and 2 here - more CC stuff on LPG here).

I don't know whether an individual wishing to buy an existing tank off their outgoing supplier can use the formulae.

You might be better off buying a brand-new tank. Possibly one made in Turkey, rather than one made in the EU's high wage economies. DAVID.T (who works in the LPG industry) posted a price of £1500 (here) for installing a new tank (groundwork, pipe, tank) in 2010.

Many suppliers remove tanks after 20 years for a complete refurbishment. Tanks can apparently last for much longer, but it would probably be unwise to buy an old tank. Tanks have major tests at 10 and 20 years - the annual inspection (by the tanker driver) is just that - an inspection ... though there are many posts which report tanks which don't meet modern (or even old!) Codes of Practice being filled.

It would probably be unwise to buy an underground tank - I suggest you read some of the posts by people with underground tanks wanting to switch suppliers who had problems.

chubbs85240 wrote: »

..... or whether anyone would then deliver to you, as your annual rental usually covers maintenance also.

For nearly all suppliers, the tank rental only covers part of the cost to the supplier. Carver seems to be an exception.

You might want to talk to Cardiff Gas (who deliver to South Wales and the Bristol area) or Extra Fuel (nationwide) which both mention deliveries to customer-owned tanks on their websites.

I would certainly ask your potential suppliers - as determined from the UKLPG website plus others (see previous posts!) - if they would deliver to you. Certainly it would be good to have a range of possible suppliers, including independents. Quite possibly the majors might not be so keen on users having freedom to haggle for each fill (I suggest you read some of the CC documents to get a flavour of this lack of keenness! But it was, of course, for the best of all possible motives - SAFETY. So you may well wonder why there are so many reports of suppliers happily filling tanks very close to power lines, very old trees, panel fences, etc, etc!).

Tank owners who have posted include molokoid (here), The Q (here) and islandlass (here).
..

dinnjo

Just for information. I’m getting towards the end of my first LPG contract. It is with Flogas and I am located in north Argyll. I started with a price of 40ppl in December 2010 which was fixed for 6 months and with no guarantee thereafter. Since then the price has risen to 48ppl and it is now 55ppl. I have just had my tank filled. I think I could have eked out my gas until the end of the contract but it finishes on Dec. 21st and it wouldn’t have taken much of a hitch with any possible change of supplier to leave me without heating, cooking and hot water over Christmas.

chubbs85240

chubbs85240 wrote: »

Well a bit of an update

I decided to move to avantigas at 43.9 +vat fixed for twelve months

I phoned Macgas and told them I was moving and therefore please do not fill me up

The next day I got a letter telling me that as i will have seen in the press most companies have put their price up and therefore they can no longer hold current price levels as propane prices have remained high so with immediette effect my price will increase by 5ppl to 76.95ppl + vat

I then arrived home to find they had put 750 litres in the next day

I therefore phoned Macgas and told them I wasn't happy as they knew I was moving

They were actually pretty good and said it was within 24 hours of my no fill up request and systems hadn't talked so they asked me what price I was getting

I said 42.95ppl

They said they would only charge me 42.95ppl for that delivery and if I stay with them they will fix my price at 42.95ppl for twelve months (previous their best deal was 49.95ppl fixed for 6 months)

So now a better deal available at Macgas and I am going to go back to avanti and see if I can squeeze them down a penny or two to continue with my transfer

So I went back to Avanti gas, told them about Macgas's offer.

They told me nothing they could do on the pence per litre.

I then asked for a reduced standing charge and they agreed to reduce this from £60+VAT to £32+VAT

That saves me teh equivalent of 1p a litre for the next 2 years, so makes it slightly better than Macgas.

Starting to enjoy this money saving and haggling :P

I reckon all in all I am going to be saving over £1,315 on Gas next year

:money::money::money::money::money::money::money:

chubbs85240

dinnjo wrote: »

Just for information. I’m getting towards the end of my first LPG contract. It is with Flogas and I am located in north Argyll. I started with a price of 40ppl in December 2010 which was fixed for 6 months and with no guarantee thereafter. Since then the price has risen to 48ppl and it is now 55ppl. I have just had my tank filled. I think I could have eked out my gas until the end of the contract but it finishes on Dec. 21st and it wouldn’t have taken much of a hitch with any possible change of supplier to leave me without heating, cooking and hot water over Christmas.

You know you can start the moving process 30 days in advance of the end of your contract (well thats what mine says), so get onto it now, with a view to the new contract being in place by Dec 22nd!

LittleVermin

LittleVermin wrote: »

Check this out:

http://www.malvernhills.gov.uk/cms/communications/news/2012/october/lpg%20fuel%20deal.aspx

Basically Malvern Hills district council has a deal with Lister Gases to provide anyone in the district with bulk LPG at a fixed price about wholesale (ANSI) - with the price changing at the beginning of each month.

October's price is 48.5ppl if you use over 2,500l p.a. - and tank rental is £50 p.a. for a 2000l above-ground tank.
..

November's price is 50.9ppl for those using over 2,500l p.a. Other details as before.

If you live in Malvern Hills district and are already a customer of Lister you can join the scheme - and pay less (I hope!).. Otherwise you have to wait to be out of contract before you can join.

If you live elsewhere in Worcestershire you might like to ask if the scheme will be extended. Please let us know!

Other on-line prices today are Cardiff Gas 50.0, Carver 54.9, LPGas Wales Direct 55.5, Extra Fuel 57.15 - all ppl and plus 5% VAT. You need to check the rental too.
..

Macadamia

Little Vermin - thanks for the update on prices on this scheme.

I live a hundred miles from Malvern, but think a similar scheme could work in my area. Most people here are on the grid but there are still many of us in the hills reliant on gas, oil, coke etc. who pay way over the average to stay warm.

I dropped my local councillor an email, including a link to the news article, explaining the costs of LPG etc. and suggesting it could be implemented here. He was most interested. He's a good ward councillor and raised the issue with the council officers. (Guess what, we are not a priority. For them fuel poverty happens in the inner city.)

But I still think it's worthwhile taking 5 minutes, and telling your local councillors etc about this scheme.