Virgin Money 10.38% regular monthly saver

subjecttocontract

masonic said:

subjecttocontract said:

ircE said:

I called on Monday to have my account closed and interest accredited to my VM current account, which was done by Wednesday morning.

I received a feedback form via email today asking me about my experience calling them. I responded positively about the call itself but in the comments I stressed that I really shouldn't have had to call for something as simple as closing a savings account. Perhaps if enough of this do this they'll change it for future accounts, if they aren't planning to do so anyway.

Lets not pussyfoot around the issue here.......don't you think that they've been in the business long enough to know the score already ? Give them an inch and they'll take a mile, and that's exactly what they are doing here. It's ridiculous, awful, annoying, time consuming and they should know better AND if I didn't know better id say they have designed this process to create maximum annoyance among their customers on purpose. Surely no bank the size of Virgin could have done this by accident ? But I still have 4 accounts with Virgin and believe they can do better.......eventually.

But how does that benefit them? I'm not attributing it to malice when it can be adequately explained by incompetence. Even aligning the quarterly interest with the account year would have prevented them being swamped with closure requests.

Reading some of the posts in this thread of how Virgin CS gave out confusing/ incorrect/delaying closure information seems the ideal way of benefiting the bank........by slowing down the closure requests. They had a poorly designed reg saver and a large number of closure requests likely to land in their inbox at the same time. It's not rocket science to recognise, way in advance, that there was always going to be a bit of a problem. 

ThePirates

c37,000 people trying to close their account on the same day, they're struggling...

My wife and I used the online form at the same time in the 1st Aug. Mine closed today, she's still waiting. 
Be patient!

masonic

subjecttocontract said:

masonic said:

subjecttocontract said:

ircE said:

I called on Monday to have my account closed and interest accredited to my VM current account, which was done by Wednesday morning.

I received a feedback form via email today asking me about my experience calling them. I responded positively about the call itself but in the comments I stressed that I really shouldn't have had to call for something as simple as closing a savings account. Perhaps if enough of this do this they'll change it for future accounts, if they aren't planning to do so anyway.

Lets not pussyfoot around the issue here.......don't you think that they've been in the business long enough to know the score already ? Give them an inch and they'll take a mile, and that's exactly what they are doing here. It's ridiculous, awful, annoying, time consuming and they should know better AND if I didn't know better id say they have designed this process to create maximum annoyance among their customers on purpose. Surely no bank the size of Virgin could have done this by accident ? But I still have 4 accounts with Virgin and believe they can do better.......eventually.

But how does that benefit them? I'm not attributing it to malice when it can be adequately explained by incompetence. Even aligning the quarterly interest with the account year would have prevented them being swamped with closure requests.

Reading some of the posts in this thread of how Virgin CS gave out confusing/ incorrect/delaying closure information seems the ideal way of benefiting the bank........by slowing down the closure requests. They had a poorly designed reg saver and a large number of closure requests likely to land in their inbox at the same time. It's not rocket science to recognise, way in advance, that there was always going to be a bit of a problem. 

They'll be paying staff members who could have been getting on with more productive things to support the business, so each intervention will cost them more than the pennies they'll gain by delaying each closure. Manual processes are more costly in the long run than automation. There were clearly some clueless staff, but who could really blame them for believing a form that states it's for current accounts should only be used for current accounts.

Businesses often have inefficiencies that they do not address due to poor leadership and corporate culture. It's just plain stupid, not stupid evil.

I doubt the business plan was to carry more staff on their books to give themselves capacity to p-off customers who have to contact them unnecessarily.

If they wanted to reduce the losses they were making on this account, they could have made the interest rate annual @ 10% AER and most customers wouldn't have seen it as any less attractive. Makes no sense at all to have a plan to cling on to the money for an extra week or so to try to redress the balance.

But it is adequately explained by an organisational culture of drifting along, rudderless, within a legacy ecosystem, formed from the wreckage of colliding IT systems. In fact, Virgin Money could use that as their strapline.

Ch1ll1Phlakes

masonic said:

subjecttocontract said:

masonic said:

subjecttocontract said:

ircE said:

I called on Monday to have my account closed and interest accredited to my VM current account, which was done by Wednesday morning.

I received a feedback form via email today asking me about my experience calling them. I responded positively about the call itself but in the comments I stressed that I really shouldn't have had to call for something as simple as closing a savings account. Perhaps if enough of this do this they'll change it for future accounts, if they aren't planning to do so anyway.

Lets not pussyfoot around the issue here.......don't you think that they've been in the business long enough to know the score already ? Give them an inch and they'll take a mile, and that's exactly what they are doing here. It's ridiculous, awful, annoying, time consuming and they should know better AND if I didn't know better id say they have designed this process to create maximum annoyance among their customers on purpose. Surely no bank the size of Virgin could have done this by accident ? But I still have 4 accounts with Virgin and believe they can do better.......eventually.

But how does that benefit them? I'm not attributing it to malice when it can be adequately explained by incompetence. Even aligning the quarterly interest with the account year would have prevented them being swamped with closure requests.

Reading some of the posts in this thread of how Virgin CS gave out confusing/ incorrect/delaying closure information seems the ideal way of benefiting the bank........by slowing down the closure requests. They had a poorly designed reg saver and a large number of closure requests likely to land in their inbox at the same time. It's not rocket science to recognise, way in advance, that there was always going to be a bit of a problem. 

They'll be paying staff members who could have been getting on with more productive things to support the business, so each intervention will cost them more than the pennies they'll gain by delaying each closure. Manual processes are more costly in the long run than automation. There were clearly some clueless staff, but who could really blame them for believing a form that states it's for current accounts should only be used for current accounts.

Businesses often have inefficiencies that they do not address due to poor leadership and corporate culture. It's just plain stupid, not stupid evil.

I doubt the business plan was to carry more staff on their books to give themselves capacity to p-off customers who have to contact them unnecessarily.

If they wanted to reduce the losses they were making on this account, they could have made the interest rate annual @ 10% AER and most customers wouldn't have seen it as any less attractive. Makes no sense at all to have a plan to cling on to the money for an extra week or so to try to redress the balance.

But it is adequately explained by an organisational culture of drifting along, rudderless, within a legacy ecosystem, formed from the wreckage of colliding IT systems. In fact, Virgin Money could use that as their strapline.

And I doubt Virgin Money will be putting anything towards upgrading and automating these systems. With the Nationwide takeover in the process, any changes and upgrades will be coming from Nationwide.

I'm not surprised Nationwide has opted for a 6 year timeframe for this as Virgin Money is currently a mess due to the reverse takeover by Clydesdale and Yorkshire bank, leaving them with system needing separate sort codes, account management systems, and product-specific portals. The 6 years needed is (I think) a clear indicator that Nationwide knows Virgin Money is currently a mess.

gt94sss2

Ch1ll1Phlakes said:

masonic said:

subjecttocontract said:

masonic said:

subjecttocontract said:

ircE said:

I called on Monday to have my account closed and interest accredited to my VM current account, which was done by Wednesday morning.

I received a feedback form via email today asking me about my experience calling them. I responded positively about the call itself but in the comments I stressed that I really shouldn't have had to call for something as simple as closing a savings account. Perhaps if enough of this do this they'll change it for future accounts, if they aren't planning to do so anyway.

Lets not pussyfoot around the issue here.......don't you think that they've been in the business long enough to know the score already ? Give them an inch and they'll take a mile, and that's exactly what they are doing here. It's ridiculous, awful, annoying, time consuming and they should know better AND if I didn't know better id say they have designed this process to create maximum annoyance among their customers on purpose. Surely no bank the size of Virgin could have done this by accident ? But I still have 4 accounts with Virgin and believe they can do better.......eventually.

But how does that benefit them? I'm not attributing it to malice when it can be adequately explained by incompetence. Even aligning the quarterly interest with the account year would have prevented them being swamped with closure requests.

Reading some of the posts in this thread of how Virgin CS gave out confusing/ incorrect/delaying closure information seems the ideal way of benefiting the bank........by slowing down the closure requests. They had a poorly designed reg saver and a large number of closure requests likely to land in their inbox at the same time. It's not rocket science to recognise, way in advance, that there was always going to be a bit of a problem. 

They'll be paying staff members who could have been getting on with more productive things to support the business, so each intervention will cost them more than the pennies they'll gain by delaying each closure. Manual processes are more costly in the long run than automation. There were clearly some clueless staff, but who could really blame them for believing a form that states it's for current accounts should only be used for current accounts.

Businesses often have inefficiencies that they do not address due to poor leadership and corporate culture. It's just plain stupid, not stupid evil.

I doubt the business plan was to carry more staff on their books to give themselves capacity to p-off customers who have to contact them unnecessarily.

If they wanted to reduce the losses they were making on this account, they could have made the interest rate annual @ 10% AER and most customers wouldn't have seen it as any less attractive. Makes no sense at all to have a plan to cling on to the money for an extra week or so to try to redress the balance.

But it is adequately explained by an organisational culture of drifting along, rudderless, within a legacy ecosystem, formed from the wreckage of colliding IT systems. In fact, Virgin Money could use that as their strapline.

And I doubt Virgin Money will be putting anything towards upgrading and automating these systems. With the Nationwide takeover in the process, any changes and upgrades will be coming from Nationwide.

I'm not surprised Nationwide has opted for a 6 year timeframe for this as Virgin Money is currently a mess due to the reverse takeover by Clydesdale and Yorkshire bank, leaving them with system needing separate sort codes, account management systems, and product-specific portals. The 6 years needed is (I think) a clear indicator that Nationwide knows Virgin Money is currently a mess.

If you're interested in the state of Nationwide IT, have a look at https://www.google.com/share.google?q=QaulzKMx4m2oxnr0J

Ch1ll1Phlakes

gt94sss2 said:

Ch1ll1Phlakes said:

masonic said:

subjecttocontract said:

masonic said:

subjecttocontract said:

ircE said:

I called on Monday to have my account closed and interest accredited to my VM current account, which was done by Wednesday morning.

I received a feedback form via email today asking me about my experience calling them. I responded positively about the call itself but in the comments I stressed that I really shouldn't have had to call for something as simple as closing a savings account. Perhaps if enough of this do this they'll change it for future accounts, if they aren't planning to do so anyway.

Lets not pussyfoot around the issue here.......don't you think that they've been in the business long enough to know the score already ? Give them an inch and they'll take a mile, and that's exactly what they are doing here. It's ridiculous, awful, annoying, time consuming and they should know better AND if I didn't know better id say they have designed this process to create maximum annoyance among their customers on purpose. Surely no bank the size of Virgin could have done this by accident ? But I still have 4 accounts with Virgin and believe they can do better.......eventually.

But how does that benefit them? I'm not attributing it to malice when it can be adequately explained by incompetence. Even aligning the quarterly interest with the account year would have prevented them being swamped with closure requests.

Reading some of the posts in this thread of how Virgin CS gave out confusing/ incorrect/delaying closure information seems the ideal way of benefiting the bank........by slowing down the closure requests. They had a poorly designed reg saver and a large number of closure requests likely to land in their inbox at the same time. It's not rocket science to recognise, way in advance, that there was always going to be a bit of a problem. 

They'll be paying staff members who could have been getting on with more productive things to support the business, so each intervention will cost them more than the pennies they'll gain by delaying each closure. Manual processes are more costly in the long run than automation. There were clearly some clueless staff, but who could really blame them for believing a form that states it's for current accounts should only be used for current accounts.

Businesses often have inefficiencies that they do not address due to poor leadership and corporate culture. It's just plain stupid, not stupid evil.

I doubt the business plan was to carry more staff on their books to give themselves capacity to p-off customers who have to contact them unnecessarily.

If they wanted to reduce the losses they were making on this account, they could have made the interest rate annual @ 10% AER and most customers wouldn't have seen it as any less attractive. Makes no sense at all to have a plan to cling on to the money for an extra week or so to try to redress the balance.

But it is adequately explained by an organisational culture of drifting along, rudderless, within a legacy ecosystem, formed from the wreckage of colliding IT systems. In fact, Virgin Money could use that as their strapline.

And I doubt Virgin Money will be putting anything towards upgrading and automating these systems. With the Nationwide takeover in the process, any changes and upgrades will be coming from Nationwide.

I'm not surprised Nationwide has opted for a 6 year timeframe for this as Virgin Money is currently a mess due to the reverse takeover by Clydesdale and Yorkshire bank, leaving them with system needing separate sort codes, account management systems, and product-specific portals. The 6 years needed is (I think) a clear indicator that Nationwide knows Virgin Money is currently a mess.

If you're interested in the state of Nationwide IT, have a look at https://www.google.com/share.google?q=QaulzKMx4m2oxnr0J

Thanks, nice read. To quote “For us, the best payments platform is the one no one notices,”

Sums up the problems with Virgin Money, that customers are noticing their systems at the moment.

subjecttocontract

But wasn't the reverse takeover by Clydesdale & Yorkshire Bank some years ago ? Surely they have had plenty of time to sort out the mess but have chosen not to on purpose knowing their customers will continue to suffer ? What's their excuse......I bet they have one ?

masonic

subjecttocontract said:

But wasn't the reverse takeover by Clydesdale & Yorkshire Bank some years ago ? Surely they have had plenty of time to sort out the mess but have chosen not to on purpose knowing their customers will continue to suffer ? What's their excuse......I bet they have one ?

They've chosen not to. It won't be because of a conscious effort to make their customers suffer. Making customers suffer tends to drive them away, leading to loss of revenue, loss of shareholder value, and ultimately failure of their company. No business owner or investor would want that. And they wouldn't want staff below them destroying the company from within.

The reason will be a combination of failure to recognise the strategic benefits, lack of appetite to find the money to invest in a new platform in the short term, unwillingness of relevant individuals to put their neck on the line, and lack of clarity over the future of the business.

It's been a rocky road throughout, starting with CYBG being dumped by National Australia Bank in 2016 at a loss of £2bn plus another £1.7bn set aside to cover misselling claims. Post floatation, CYBG went through a period of cost saving measures including branch closures, then perversely purchased VM for £1.7bn in 2018. Customers were migrated into the VM brand between 2019-2021, alongside mass redundancies, Covid, and from there things were clearly not rosy, hence just a couple of years later Nationwide is being courted as a potential buyer. Is it any wonder that through that mayhem there was a lack of strategic action?

subjecttocontract

Well at least we agree that they have chosen not to improve their systems......but that choice was when they already knew their customers would be likely to suffer as a result of their inaction. Perhaps their plan all along was to mitigate that customer dissatisfaction by offering a market busting 10% account.

masonic

subjecttocontract said:

Well at least we agree that they have chosen not to improve their systems......but that choice was when they already knew their customers would be likely to suffer as a result of their inaction.

I can't agree that they would have already known in 2018 that a customer in 2025 filling out an web-based account closure form and waiting 3-5 working days would consider themselves to be "suffering" as a result. I do hope that, in time, you'll be able to come to terms with this obviously difficult chapter.

They certainly could not have foreseen the launch of this regular saver, the associated interest payment schedule, and the scramble to close the account at the fixed end date. The mistakes made as a result of this cannot be pinned on CYBG. What can be pinned on them is the challenges the systems would pose when they were brought together, but again, that is likely something they didn't bargain for... stupid, not stupid evil.

subjecttocontract said:

Perhaps their plan all along was to mitigate that customer dissatisfaction by offering a market busting 10% account.

I doubt that was the plan, but even if it was, sadly it doesn't seem to have worked in all cases.