Maleth Aero flight delays (MLT1972 LGW- Barbados 6th January) & others delayed FROM a UK airport

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  • mdann52
    mdann52 Posts: 72 Forumite
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    Robo
    P o have offered no assistance or indeed an apology.  Maleth aero has issued acknowledgement of claim form, but as they are not part of the adr scheme I do not think they will pay up. 
    Indeed - from a legal standpoint, P&O do not have a legal obligation to assist in this circumstance, the regulations around the delay apply only to the operating air carrier, not the agent. Morally you may disagree, however it sounds like P&O are not using them beyond this season.

    If they don't pay up, unfortunately you'll need to try and claim via the courts. I, personally, don't think you will have much success via the UK courts, as any UK judgement will be as good as unenforceable unless bailiffs manage to seize a Maleth plane while on the ground in the UK (as as they have no other assets or UK presence), and you may well find permission to file in UK court is refused as a result.

    This is one of the few times where it might be worth contracting a no-win-no-fee Claim Management Company to deal with such cases if Maleth don't pay up, especially who have experience with Maltese Courts or the Cross-EU small claims procedures.
  • Suzycoll
    Suzycoll Posts: 149 Forumite
    First Post First Anniversary Name Dropper Combo Breaker
    mdann52 said:
    Robo
    P o have offered no assistance or indeed an apology.  Maleth aero has issued acknowledgement of claim form, but as they are not part of the adr scheme I do not think they will pay up. 
    Indeed - from a legal standpoint, P&O do not have a legal obligation to assist in this circumstance, the regulations around the delay apply only to the operating air carrier, not the agent. Morally you may disagree, however it sounds like P&O are not using them beyond this season.

    If they don't pay up, unfortunately you'll need to try and claim via the courts. I, personally, don't think you will have much success via the UK courts, as any UK judgement will be as good as unenforceable unless bailiffs manage to seize a Maleth plane while on the ground in the UK (as as they have no other assets or UK presence), and you may well find permission to file in UK court is refused as a result.

    This is one of the few times where it might be worth contracting a no-win-no-fee Claim Management Company to deal with such cases if Maleth don't pay up, especially who have experience with Maltese Courts or the Cross-EU small claims procedures.
    mdann52

    could you kindly stop jumping on this post with inaccurate information. Your 'advice' may confuse people reading the post. My original post referred to my flight from London Gatwick to Barbados. In light of this please see the following 

    Step 1: Is your flight EU/UK-regulated?

    All the rules we talk about below come from this simple fact. The flight must be regulated either by UK or EU rules (which are the same rules in effect). Here's what's covered:

    • ANY FLIGHT leaving a UK/EU airport
    • ANY UK or EU AIRLINE arriving at a UK/EU airport

    This means if it's a flight within the UK and EU, you're covered as it'll definitely have left a UK/EU airport. Where there's a question is if you've got a flight from outside the EU going back to the UK (or another EU airport). Then the airline matters.

    So a flight from Manchester to New York is covered by the rules regardless of the airline, but a flight from New York to Manchester would be covered on British Airways, but wouldn't on American Airlines.

  • bagand96
    bagand96 Posts: 6,100 Forumite
    Name Dropper First Anniversary First Post
    edited 11 February at 12:43AM
    Suzycoll said:
    mdann52 said:
    Robo
    P o have offered no assistance or indeed an apology.  Maleth aero has issued acknowledgement of claim form, but as they are not part of the adr scheme I do not think they will pay up. 
    Indeed - from a legal standpoint, P&O do not have a legal obligation to assist in this circumstance, the regulations around the delay apply only to the operating air carrier, not the agent. Morally you may disagree, however it sounds like P&O are not using them beyond this season.

    If they don't pay up, unfortunately you'll need to try and claim via the courts. I, personally, don't think you will have much success via the UK courts, as any UK judgement will be as good as unenforceable unless bailiffs manage to seize a Maleth plane while on the ground in the UK (as as they have no other assets or UK presence), and you may well find permission to file in UK court is refused as a result.

    This is one of the few times where it might be worth contracting a no-win-no-fee Claim Management Company to deal with such cases if Maleth don't pay up, especially who have experience with Maltese Courts or the Cross-EU small claims procedures.
    mdann52

    could you kindly stop jumping on this post with inaccurate information. Your 'advice' may confuse people reading the post. My original post referred to my flight from London Gatwick to Barbados. In light of this please see the following 

    Step 1: Is your flight EU/UK-regulated?

    All the rules we talk about below come from this simple fact. The flight must be regulated either by UK or EU rules (which are the same rules in effect). Here's what's covered:

    • ANY FLIGHT leaving a UK/EU airport
    • ANY UK or EU AIRLINE arriving at a UK/EU airport

    This means if it's a flight within the UK and EU, you're covered as it'll definitely have left a UK/EU airport. Where there's a question is if you've got a flight from outside the EU going back to the UK (or another EU airport). Then the airline matters.

    So a flight from Manchester to New York is covered by the rules regardless of the airline, but a flight from New York to Manchester would be covered on British Airways, but wouldn't on American Airlines.

    Maybe an open internet forum wasn't the best place for you to start this conversation as you seem to want to moderate everyone who replies. 

    You are of course correct in stating when an EC261(UK) claim may apply.

    However @mdan52 is not denying this right. What they are saying is that trying to use the UK court system to sue a Maltese airline may prove very hard indeed. We all agree that on a UK departing flight, any airline is reposnsible for EC261 compensation under UK law.

    However, enforcing that right may prove more challenging if the airline isn't based in the UK. A UK court may agree with you but has no jurisdiction against a company based in Malta and can't make a enforceable judgement against them. 

    All this is academic at the moment though... Maleth may yet agree to legitimate claims. They may be very slow in doing so, but thats par for the course with international flag carriers let alone small charter outfits.

    Caribbean-UK is less clear if any law applies.

    And P&O or any agent of P&O have no legal reposnsibility at all. Their contact was to provide a flight to the ship as part of the package. And they did this, despite the collective outrage that it wasn't a TUI Boeing 787 or that there were delays. 
  • Suzycoll
    Suzycoll Posts: 149 Forumite
    First Post First Anniversary Name Dropper Combo Breaker
    bagand96 said:
    Suzycoll said:
    mdann52 said:
    Robo
    P o have offered no assistance or indeed an apology.  Maleth aero has issued acknowledgement of claim form, but as they are not part of the adr scheme I do not think they will pay up. 
    Indeed - from a legal standpoint, P&O do not have a legal obligation to assist in this circumstance, the regulations around the delay apply only to the operating air carrier, not the agent. Morally you may disagree, however it sounds like P&O are not using them beyond this season.

    If they don't pay up, unfortunately you'll need to try and claim via the courts. I, personally, don't think you will have much success via the UK courts, as any UK judgement will be as good as unenforceable unless bailiffs manage to seize a Maleth plane while on the ground in the UK (as as they have no other assets or UK presence), and you may well find permission to file in UK court is refused as a result.

    This is one of the few times where it might be worth contracting a no-win-no-fee Claim Management Company to deal with such cases if Maleth don't pay up, especially who have experience with Maltese Courts or the Cross-EU small claims procedures.
    mdann52

    could you kindly stop jumping on this post with inaccurate information. Your 'advice' may confuse people reading the post. My original post referred to my flight from London Gatwick to Barbados. In light of this please see the following 

    Step 1: Is your flight EU/UK-regulated?

    All the rules we talk about below come from this simple fact. The flight must be regulated either by UK or EU rules (which are the same rules in effect). Here's what's covered:

    • ANY FLIGHT leaving a UK/EU airport
    • ANY UK or EU AIRLINE arriving at a UK/EU airport

    This means if it's a flight within the UK and EU, you're covered as it'll definitely have left a UK/EU airport. Where there's a question is if you've got a flight from outside the EU going back to the UK (or another EU airport). Then the airline matters.

    So a flight from Manchester to New York is covered by the rules regardless of the airline, but a flight from New York to Manchester would be covered on British Airways, but wouldn't on American Airlines.

    Maybe an open internet forum wasn't the best place for you to start this conversation as you seem to want to moderate everyone who replies. 

    You are of course correct in stating when an EC261(UK) claim may apply.

    However @mdan52 is not denying this right. What they are saying is that trying to use the UK court system to sue a Maltese airline may prove very hard indeed. We all agree that on a UK departing flight, any airline is reposnsible for EC261 compensation under UK law.

    However, enforcing that right may prove more challenging if the airline isn't based in the UK. A UK court may agree with you but has no jurisdiction against a company based in Malta and can't make a enforceable judgement against them. 

    All this is academic at the moment though... Maleth may yet agree to legitimate claims. They may be very slow in doing so, but thats par for the course with international flag carriers let alone small charter outfits.

    Caribbean-UK is less clear if any law applies.

    And P&O or any agent of P&O have no legal reposnsibility at all. Their contact was to provide a flight to the ship as part of the package. And they did this, despite the collective outrage that it wasn't a TUI Boeing 787 or that there were delays. 
    Bagand96......thanks for your comments. Yes you are correct. In my naivety I thought people could stick to the topic as in my post and/or maybe look at other very useful posts/open their own post to discuss the pitfalls of claiming for flight delays -  alas not !
  • eskbanker
    eskbanker Posts: 30,979 Forumite
    First Anniversary Name Dropper Photogenic First Post
    @Suzycoll, if I could make a suggestion that'll hopefully be seen as constructive, perhaps you could use the first post to fulfil your tracking objective, i.e. creating and updating a simple summary with key information about dates and status for each contributor, something along the lines of:
    Poster 1:
    xx Jan 24 - flight delayed by n hours
    xy Jan 24 - claim submitted to airline
    yx Feb 24 - chased them after no response
    yy Feb 24 - response received, stating [...]

    Poster 2:
    [same sort of thing]

    etc
    which would be pretty straightforward to keep updated as and when affected passengers share their news, and would allow anyone affected to see quickly and easily what to expect?

    I get why you're frustrated that people aren't posting exactly how you'd wanted, but it does seem inevitable that at least some of the affected travellers will welcome useful pointers about their rights and if/how/when they might be enforced, as well as simply sharing dates of any progress, so personally don't see the wider discussion as being off topic as such, although imagine you may disagree!
  • coors
    coors Posts: 1 Newbie
    First Post
    December 1st flight delay 12 hours / claim submitted 17th December / no responce after 2 weeks / after multi emails have had 3 string along responcers such as , we are looking at your claim , send us your claim form again , send us flight number and date , I agree that the other posts are quite informative , All said I dont think maleth will be paying any  one out 
  • I too was on the 1st December flight from Antigua to Manchester that had a 12 hour delay.  Submitted my claim form on 4th December, have had no reply since.  Messaged Maleth via their instagram page for an update about 3 weeks ago and received a general response saying 'all forms are currently being processed' and have heard nothing else since.  
  • Suzycoll said:
    Graydo said:
    Hi
    I too was affected by Maleth aero on our return from Barbados to Manchester on 1/12/23.

    In our case a 10hr delay caused by a technical fault on the plane leaving Manchester, Maleth sourced another plane which also suffered a technical fault and finally a third from France (apparently) which was deemed airworthy but caused the 10 hr delay.

    I have submitted online claims via Maleth's webpage (after their statutory 72 hrs) for delays as requested by iglu cruise (the booking agent) AND another claim the next day with a booking reference that Maleth could recognise (they apparently do not acknowledge iglu booking ref's).

    Having no response from either email I resubmitted my claim at iglu's request yet again on the 19th January and finally again today.
    To date, I have had no reply from either Maleth or P and O and am  now looking into pursuing a pact claim via the CAA website.

    Iglu's best advice is to resubmit my claim every two weeks!

    I have no idea if I will ever see any compensation from Maleth or P and O but I do know it will be the last I fly/sail with either of them.

    Hope you have better luck than me

    Graydo
    Hi Graydo

    Thanks for your post. Quick update I have received a generic e mail reply from Maleth Aero today. Just saying thanks for claim and they will respond as soon as possible.

    Also to let you know - there is an old post on here entitled 'JET2 claim for late flight'. If you can find that there is a really useful letter template you can use to send to Maleth Aero (before going to CAA). I used it a few years back and got paid out.

    Good luck and keep posting with any news/no news etc 
    Did anybody manage to find the template that @Suzycoll mentioned - i've had look but can't find it. 
  • mdann52
    mdann52 Posts: 72 Forumite
    Name Dropper First Post First Anniversary
    eskbanker said:
    Just a reminder to anyone claiming here - as an EU carrier operating a flight into the UK, it's UK law that covers this (although untested law)
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