Rejecting new car due to dealer misfuel

99iainb

Herzlos said:

99iainb said:

Wonka_2 said:

99iainb said:

Wonka_2 said:

  - they claim that's from a 250 mile brand new car ? And have they sent you pics of the others for comparison ?

Unless someone technical wants to offer a better view there's no way misfuelling could cause that in isolation to a single cylinder/injector.

No pictures for comparison, I assume the others are mint

And this might be a pivotal point for your argument - you need the other pictures

The others, as far as I know, are fine and are in the engine. Why do you think I'd need pictures of the others?

because the fuel must have gone to all of the cylinders, and therefore if the issue was the fuel they'd all look bad.

If the rest are in mint condition, the problem is the injector was either faulty or installed incorrectly.

That's probably why the repairing dealer is saying it's not adding up and that cylinder 2 is showing signs of being tampered. Ithink what they're saying is that because it's a "misfuel" it's all not covered under warranty 

Robbo66

99iainb said:

So here are the images of the injector that was taken out of the engine, with the following comments from the repairing dealer "We have noted however upon removal of injectors for fuel rail cleaning, Cylinder 2 injector has been blowing by. Its seal that mates to the engine is loose in comparison to all other injectors and the rubber seal on the top that mates to the rail is perishing. We are concern that this defect is not of warrantable concern due to the damage to the rubber seal on top and the general condition of this injector"

There is no way that is from an engine that has only do a few hundred mile

sevenhills

99iainb said:

Wonka_2 said:

99iainb said:

Wonka_2 said:

  - they claim that's from a 250 mile brand new car ? And have they sent you pics of the others for comparison ?

Unless someone technical wants to offer a better view there's no way misfuelling could cause that in isolation to a single cylinder/injector.

No pictures for comparison, I assume the others are mint

And this might be a pivotal point for your argument - you need the other pictures

The others, as far as I know, are fine and are in the engine. Why do you think I'd need pictures of the others?

Surely they will inspect all the injectors 

99iainb

sevenhills said:

99iainb said:

Wonka_2 said:

99iainb said:

Wonka_2 said:

  - they claim that's from a 250 mile brand new car ? And have they sent you pics of the others for comparison ?

Unless someone technical wants to offer a better view there's no way misfuelling could cause that in isolation to a single cylinder/injector.

No pictures for comparison, I assume the others are mint

And this might be a pivotal point for your argument - you need the other pictures

The others, as far as I know, are fine and are in the engine. Why do you think I'd need pictures of the others?

Surely they will inspect all the injectors 

What you mean do a proper job? It is 2024 don't forget... those days are long gone I'm afraid. They've probably seen the fault computer say problem with cylinder 2 and just looked at that I would suspect

sevenhills

99iainb said:

What you mean do a proper job? It is 2024 don't forget... those days are long gone I'm afraid. They've probably seen the fault computer say problem with cylinder 2 and just looked at that I would suspect

Like someone has said, diesel mixed with the petrol would affect all the injectors.

99iainb

sevenhills said:

99iainb said:

What you mean do a proper job? It is 2024 don't forget... those days are long gone I'm afraid. They've probably seen the fault computer say problem with cylinder 2 and just looked at that I would suspect

Like someone has said, diesel mixed with the petrol would affect all the injectors.

Yeah, nothing in this whole sorry tale adds up 

Grumpy_chap

99iainb said:

99iainb said:

Do you have legal cover on your car (or home) insurance?

Sadly I do not

The fuel has been sent off for analysis today

Correction, I have just checked my home insurance policy, which just expired on the 14th of January and I did have legal protection. The relevant part of the policy says this: What is covered
Consumer disputes - to defend or pursue legal action arising from a contractual dispute relating 

to an agreement which an insured person has entered into for receiving services, buying, hiring or selling personal goods

And what about the new home insurance policy?  Does that also include legal protection?

99iainb

Grumpy_chap said:

99iainb said:

99iainb said:

Do you have legal cover on your car (or home) insurance?

Sadly I do not

The fuel has been sent off for analysis today

Correction, I have just checked my home insurance policy, which just expired on the 14th of January and I did have legal protection. The relevant part of the policy says this: What is covered
Consumer disputes - to defend or pursue legal action arising from a contractual dispute relating 

to an agreement which an insured person has entered into for receiving services, buying, hiring or selling personal goods

And what about the new home insurance policy?  Does that also include legal protection?

No, but I gave the previous company I was with, when the incident happened,  a call and they put me thorough to their legal advisors who seemed happy to help, they didn't really tell me anything I didn't already know other than within the first 30 days the burden of proof sits with the retailer. 

They said that if it did come down to legal proceedings then their legal team would have to review the case and determine if there was a greater than 50% chance of success. He also said that I may not actually be covered as a motor vehicle isn't covered under "goods" but said they may still possibly take it on should it come to that. 

All a bit non-committal, so I won't hold my breath... at least it wasn't outright bad news for a change 

Goudy

Robbo66 said:

99iainb said:

So here are the images of the injector that was taken out of the engine, with the following comments from the repairing dealer "We have noted however upon removal of injectors for fuel rail cleaning, Cylinder 2 injector has been blowing by. Its seal that mates to the engine is loose in comparison to all other injectors and the rubber seal on the top that mates to the rail is perishing. We are concern that this defect is not of warrantable concern due to the damage to the rubber seal on top and the general condition of this injector"

There is no way that is from an engine that has only do a few hundred mile

That is a injector that been blowing by and judging by the soot on it, it doesn't look like it's been running on unleaded alone.
A perfect combustion of petrol and air on an old engine leaves a tan deposit, but modern fuel and ignition systems these days leave more of a grey deposit.
There's a lot of black soot up the outer case and as said, the engine hasn't had chance to build up carbon as it's still very new.

The worn seal at the top is a result of it knocking.
The compression cycle (suck, squeeze, bang, blow) has hammered the injector in and out between the cylinder head and fuel rail so it's chaffed the seal to the fuel rail.

It's probably down to it having trouble compressing and igniting the petrol/diesel mix.
There's not enough compression in a petrol engine to auto ignite the diesel in there, so it's basically tried spitting the injector out on every compression stroke.

I would bet the others are in or near a similar state, particularly number three, as the inner cylinders tend to run a bit hotter and they tend to get up to peak compression a little faster.

99iainb

I've checked with the repairing dealer this morning about the other injectors, the reply was that the other injectors were all removed as part of the clean out process. Which is where the comparison was made and the reasoning for our concern. The other injectors are currently functioning as required