My energy provider is pushing me to have a smart meter

Emily_Joy

I don’t believe I have ever encountered a home insurance policy with “vague” terms around the periods of time a property might be empty for - on the contrary, my experience over the past 25 years or so has always been that this is something that is pretty clearly set out. 

Probably worth ensuring that in fact you have correctly stated your pattern of occupancy to your insurers, rather than worrying about the fact that they might request smart meter data to prove that in fact you were away more than their policy said was acceptable! 

The occupancy pattern changes from year to year, and also between different times of the year. My partner and I try make sure that at least one of us spends at least a couple of nights in the house every fortnight, but otherwise its pretty chaotic. Also "spending a night in the house" sometimes means getting back from work at 1am and leaving again at 10am.

badmemory

Netexporter said:

badmemory said:

I suspect it would have to be first all dumb meters off, whether this will include those smart meters that aren't working as they ought I'll leave to someone more technical, next they would take all smart meters that aren't paying the"fee" & finally in cases of dire necessity those paying the fee.  There will of course be no control by ofgem of the fee although I would hope it would include without charge those whose life depend on receiving power to stay alive.

All you are doing is demonstrating that you don't know how the grid works.

If I am so wrong it is based on the energy company promising to protect the supply of vulnerable people from power cuts.  Obviously I should have realised that was a lie.

QrizB

badmemory said:

I suspect it would have to be first all dumb meters off, whether this will include those smart meters that aren't working as they ought I'll leave to someone more technical, next they would take all smart meters that aren't paying the"fee" & finally in cases of dire necessity those paying the fee.  There will of course be no control by ofgem of the fee although I would hope it would include without charge those whose life depend on receiving power to stay alive.

The reason for Netexporter's comment is that there's no way to remotely switch off "dumb meters". So the way rolling blackouts have been implemented for the past 50+ years is by shutting off every circuit from the substation.
IIRC (I may well be wrong) the plan last winter was for people whose lives depend on electricity to be provided with alternative supplies (batteries / generators) prior to blackouts taking place, or to be moved out of their homes to ocations where electricity would still be available.

Netexporter

badmemory said:

Netexporter said:

badmemory said:

I suspect it would have to be first all dumb meters off, whether this will include those smart meters that aren't working as they ought I'll leave to someone more technical, next they would take all smart meters that aren't paying the"fee" & finally in cases of dire necessity those paying the fee.  There will of course be no control by ofgem of the fee although I would hope it would include without charge those whose life depend on receiving power to stay alive.

All you are doing is demonstrating that you don't know how the grid works.

If I am so wrong it is based on the energy company promising to protect the supply of vulnerable people from power cuts.  Obviously I should have realised that was a lie.

The only way you can switch off dumb meters, short of sending an engineer round to pull the main fuse, is to cut off an area at the sub-station. With smart meters in place you can selectively turn off individual supplies whilst leaving vulnerable users connected.

Chris_b2z

Emily_Joy said:

My partner and I try make sure that at least one of us spends at least a couple of nights in the house every fortnight, but otherwise its pretty chaotic.

As mentioned previously, you can always set the smart meter to send monthly readings rather than every half hour or daily which would not give away any details of your occupancy.

Gerry1

badmemory said:

Netexporter said:

badmemory said:

I suspect it would have to be first all dumb meters off, whether this will include those smart meters that aren't working as they ought I'll leave to someone more technical, next they would take all smart meters that aren't paying the"fee" & finally in cases of dire necessity those paying the fee.  There will of course be no control by ofgem of the fee although I would hope it would include without charge those whose life depend on receiving power to stay alive.

All you are doing is demonstrating that you don't know how the grid works.

If I am so wrong it is based on the energy company promising to protect the supply of vulnerable people from power cuts.  Obviously I should have realised that was a lie.

With traditional meters, if demand still exceeds supply even after a 6% voltage reduction then load shedding by power cuts has to be imposed.

Apart from battery backup or generators there's not much that can be done to protect vulnerable users, although substations serving critical hospitals won't be deliberately switched off.

If everyone has a smart meter then load shedding can be much more granular, targeting individual smart meters rather than substations serving whole neighbourhoods.

Users with life support and dialysis machines wouldn't be disconnected. No doubt this 'uninterruptible supply' benefit would be extended to ministers, MPs, royalty and other bigwigs, and probably also to those who agreed to pay a premium standing charge...

The principle isn't new, similar systems for landlines and mobiles have been in place for many decades.

ArbitraryRandom

It might be worth looking at what's been happening in South Africa for the last few years - with aging infrastructure and reliance on coal generation resulting in unplanned and uncontrollable load shedding. 

At the same time an unbelievable but also entirely possible situation for the uk to be in within a decade if we don't change the way we generate and use energy... for which smart metering/monitoring is a key requirement. 

Gerry1 said:

badmemory said:

Netexporter said:

badmemory said:

I suspect it would have to be first all dumb meters off, whether this will include those smart meters that aren't working as they ought I'll leave to someone more technical, next they would take all smart meters that aren't paying the"fee" & finally in cases of dire necessity those paying the fee.  There will of course be no control by ofgem of the fee although I would hope it would include without charge those whose life depend on receiving power to stay alive.

All you are doing is demonstrating that you don't know how the grid works.

If I am so wrong it is based on the energy company promising to protect the supply of vulnerable people from power cuts.  Obviously I should have realised that was a lie.

... probably also to those who agreed to pay a premium standing charge...

Likely the same or slightly less than a premium charged to anyone still connected to the grid with a 'traditional' meter at that point. 

[Deleted User]

At the same time an unbelievable but also entirely possible situation for the uk to be in within a decade if we don't change the way we generate and use energy... for which smart metering/monitoring is a key requirement. 

South Africa is not alone in having significant grid issues. Most developed countries have outdated grid infrastructure which needs to be updated to convey renewable energy from where it is produced to where it is needed. New renewable energy sources are presently having to wait years for a grid connection in the UK, and the lack of grid capacity is holding back development in some areas of the country.

This article explains the challenges in the US:

https://kleinmanenergy.upenn.edu/news-insights/why-we-need-a-smarter-electrical-grid/

As a body of consumers, we have to take a wider perspective on the need for smart meters and a smart grid than just ‘what is in it for me’?

2010

One of the great reasons given for getting a SM is accurate billing.

Energy firms held a combined £8.1bn of customers' bill overpayments at the start of 2023, new Ofgem figures show.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-66992865

[Deleted User]

One of the great reasons given for getting a SM is accurate billing.

On this point, I agree with the smart meter naysayers. Anyone who provides their supplier with frequent meter readings is already getting accurate billing. Similarly, there isn’t a smart meter in the country that is saving consumers money. The savings are either because consumers are turning things off or because they have chosen a tariff only available to smart metered homes.

These ‘messages’ come from the Government’s behavioural scientists.