Strange fine and poor response

madashe11

Hi all, will try to keep this as brief as possible. We were looking for a pub meal. We stopped at a pub we had been to the previous year whose car park is across a busy road. We know from the last time we were there that you have to give your registration details when you dine there. The employee asked us for this when she asked if we were there to eat. We assumed they did this so that no one could "do a runner" after eating (there are some picnic tables near the car park where I think you could have drinks).

One of our small party has a dietary requirement but the last time we were there it was no problem and we assumed it would be the same. However this time we checked out the menu board and saw nothing suitable so we waited for an exployee to appear so we could ask her. When someone did appear we asked if there was anything suitable. She gave us a menu to look at but again there was nothing suitable. She said she would ask the chef so we stood there for a few minutes waiting for her return. When she did she told us the chef said there nothing available which we thought was odd but had no choice then but to leave to find somewhere else.

We did not even sit down. No one asked us for any details and though there are signs that say customers have to give registration details/get a parking permit, as we were not able to be customers and we didnt even get to sit down, we assumed it was not relevant to us.

A short while later we received a parking fine in the post for £100 because we didn't give our registration. We assumed, as any reasonable person would, that they had made a mistake and when we "appealed" they would see what happened and cancel the fine but of course they did not. We called the pub who were absolutely not on our side and repeated over and over that there are signs. They did not care at all and they even said that we "evaded" offering our registration. "For what reason" we asked but no reply. "What would we have gained?" we asked but no reply. We were also told that they have a 10 minute leeway and that we stayed over that. When asked by how much we were told "2 minutes".

So we appealed to them (civil enforcement) thinking surely they would see the obvious but we received a reply saying they did not. No we have a few more days to appeal to "popla". Out of principal I do not want to pay. It is clearly an outrageous scam however someone else involved is worried about having credit etc ruined and is unsure.

Does anyone have any suggestions at all? Thank you in advance.

Grizebeck

1. its not a fine
2. its not a fine
3. why would a credit file be ruined?
4. There are not ruined credit files in relation to this
5. Find out who owns the pub and if its a chain/managed house complain to the head office

fisherjim

It's not a fine it's an invoice from a scamming parking company that provide their services for free to the pub for the joy of sending out these ridiculous charges.

You make a mistake, or the pub doesn't do their job the PPC starts the scam rolling they get no money by letting accepting your appeal they want people like you it pays!

It's not "strange" it's what they do, you cannot get a ruined credit out of the blue that's ridiculous, read the newbies thread on here the whole scam is explained as are the steps to take, though you seem to have tried plan A already.

Your POPLA appeal cannot be an explanation of what happened on the day, it has to debunk their procedures, signage, adherence to the BPA COP etc etc

Coupon-mad

It's not a fine - and it's not unusual or strange.  We see cases like yours all the time.  No-one pays.

You won't be wasting time on POPLA either because it's considered a .

It's not independent and you won't win, AND that kangaroo court would cost CEL £27 which means they'll dig their heels later, in unless you have a robust MP who will push hard.  So do not try POPLA.

it is funded by the private parking old boys' club, for them and essentially it runs in their interests.  Does not consider mitigating circumstances.

This is why the Government is replacing POPLA and its rival, and is robustly regulating this rogue industry.

Email the Pub Head Office because - even if they knock you back - it is good evidence for later (when CEL sue you but they'll lose) that you tried to resolve it. Don't phone.

You have read NEWBIES PLEASE READ THESE FAQS FIRST?  Top of the forum.

madashe11

Thank you both for your replies. I know it is scam but it appears, from what I have read, that it is a legal scam. usually when something is not paid it affects your credit which is why I mentioned being concerned about that. I soent hours last night trying to find out who owned the pub but was not able to. I could have paid for more in depth information but I was not sure if that "paid for" info would include the owner's information. I don't think they are ownder by a brewery as I can see nothing about that kind of thing on their websites.  Do you think it would be worth paying for more info and hope to find ownership info?

With regard @fisherjim to debunking their procedures do you have suggestions? There is signage, they appear to have done the things that are mentioned on the site such as the ntk being sent, photos and times of the car, list showing other cars that day who paid etc. The only thing I can say about the sign is that it says "The ---- Inn customers must obtain a parking permit inside the pub" and technically we were not customers as we were not able to be. Can that be used in my POPLA appeal?

Coupon-mad

But the NEWBIES FAQS sticky thread explains that even losing in court doesn't leave a CCJ (unless you didn't do or pay what a Judge ordered).

We do this a dozen times every single day here and we never put people's credit at risk.

YOU AREN'T DOING A POPLA APPEAL.

Do not waste time or CEL's money on it.

madashe11

I did read the Newbies FAQs but I was a little unsure when reading " WE WIN 99% OF WELL-DEFENDED COURT CLAIMS! "- does this suggest that someone can/will help with court? Is court a definite? You mentioned again about finding the owner- as mentioned above, I have tried hard to who the owner is with no luck. I found other info but not the current owners- only managers.

Coupon-mad

We help everyone write a winning defence.

Easy copy & paste stuff to which you just add your facts.

You've complained to the Managers?  

I don't mean CEL!

madashe11

 I was also a little unsure despite reading the Newbie FAQ after reading other pages such as the page titled "Fight unfair private parking tickets" which suggests some things a little differently than the Newbie FAQ page. For example-

" Proof of mitigating circumstances. " which says to Keep anything relevant, such as receipts from a recovery company if you were broken down."  but the advice above on this post is to not try using mitigating circumstances as it wont make a difference. 

In addition to that is the following advice which is contrary to what you have suggested above- hence my uncertainty. The advice on this post is not to appeal as it is a waste of time and will not be accepted but the screenshot below suggests that appealing is a part of the process and offers advice for a successful appealincluding template- so just not sure really what I should be doing.

On the Newbie FAQ it says "the discount (the 14 day discount) is a bribe so that you dont appeal- is that just to save them the £27 cost of the appeal?

fisherjim

Why not name the pub we can see if it's cropped up before, and even do a little more delving maybe.

madashe11

@Coupon-mad I didn't think you meant CEL.  We complained to the managers of the pub via phone as soon as we received the notification. We thought she would hear what happened and take action to stop the notification immediately but she did not.

She just kept repeating that there are signs to say we have to give our registration details even though we explained clearly that if we were going to stay for food or even a drink we would have done so but as we did not stay we assumed there was no reason to do so. We didn't even get to sit down and the waitress didnt even mention it was necessary, we guessed because we were were not staying.

It is so logical and common sense we are astounded that anyone would disagree- yet she did. When she was told that we had come there for a meal once before she changed her tune just a tiny bit,  and said she was sending an email telling them what we told her but as far as we know she didn't or perhaps she did and they just ignored it- either way, she was absoutely unreasonable, showed zero concern, was insulting and continually tried to defend the notice saying it was fair because there were signs. 

As I mentioned above she even said we had "evaded" giving them our details as though we were getting away with something but goodness knows what- We had only wanted stop off for a family meal! We literally parked, went in to have a meal, could not have a meal because they had nothing suitable after asking the chef as we thank you anyway and left. Thats it.