British Gas still using intimidatory tactics for smart meter appointments

Brie

OK - thanks to everyone who replied to me.....and I don't object to smart meters.  What I objected to was the line that "everyone would save money" with them.  

I don't have any way to easily read my meters.  I don't have a IHD, never have. In fact I don't know what they look like IRL.  I don't want an app on my phone (too crowded already).  There's nothing on my online account that shows a breakdown of use - just from 1/4 - 1/5 you used XXX and that costs YYY.  And I won't be switching just yet as I'm on a 2 year fix that will be hard to match when it finishes unless prices plunge massively.  Obviously when the time comes I'll see if there's a smart meter special rate - now that I know I should look for one.  

Spoonie_Turtle

On the subject of apps, are there any sites that work on desktop to view energy usage from a smart meter?

I object to unnecessary apps cluttering up my phone/tablet for sites that used to work just fine on browser so I do see that side of it, although for me monitoring energy usage would be something I'm willing to use an app for.  But for people who don't have smart devices like a phone or tablet (or have a device but really don't have room for another app), and whose IHD is either missing, inaccurate, or downright broken, having a desktop functionality would be useful.

MWT

Spoonie_Turtle said:

On the subject of apps, are there any sites that work on desktop to view energy usage from a smart meter?

Most suppliers provide web access to your energy data, Octopus for example make it easy to view and download your half-hour consumption figures.

wrf12345

Interesting, I recently had an email from BG saying they were fitting meters in the area and I could click on a link to book an appointment, which I did and received a similar confirmation email to the OP (who seems to have just been given the appointment without asking for it). But BG have at least two separate customer account systems so I guess it depends if you are on the new one or old one or some other foible of their systems or someone spilling coffee over the computer. In the past, I had endless texts and phone calls from some meter firm who said they were fitting meters in the area but could not be bothered with them at the time but now that energy costs are so high I suspect that people are going to get the best rates if they have smart meters fitted so don't want to miss out. Definitely the wrong way round in this case, making the customer cancel if they don't want it rather than asking them if they want one fitted - that should be an Ofgem fine but par for the course post Brexit where consumer rights have effectively been stripped away.

Mstty

wrf12345 said:

Interesting, I recently had an email from BG saying they were fitting meters in the area and I could click on a link to book an appointment, which I did and received a similar confirmation email to the OP (who seems to have just been given the appointment without asking for it). But BG have at least two separate customer account systems so I guess it depends if you are on the new one or old one or some other foible of their systems or someone spilling coffee over the computer. In the past, I had endless texts and phone calls from some meter firm who said they were fitting meters in the area but could not be bothered with them at the time but now that energy costs are so high I suspect that people are going to get the best rates if they have smart meters fitted so don't want to miss out. Definitely the wrong way round in this case, making the customer cancel if they don't want it rather than asking them if they want one fitted - that should be an Ofgem fine but par for the course post Brexit where consumer rights have effectively been stripped away.

Conversely I like the idea of maybe a £100+ fine. There are smart meter fitting targets to be met and as explained multiple times in this and other posts smart meters will save customers money with the tariffs they open up to customers with smart meters.

Maybe whack a £1000 fine in?

(We might as well be as outlandish as those with smart meter conspiracy theories)

agentcain

matt_drummer said:

agentcain said:

What the smart meter is doing for you in the case of a flexible tariff is what the supplier is supposed to be doing. The supplier's business model is supposed to be bringing in consumers together, predicting their usage and guarantying energy purchase in advance, i.e. hedging. If every consumer consumes according to a fluctuating rate, then there's no need for a supplier, is there? We just let the state form a billing department for the sole purpose of dealing with the bureaucracy of issuing bills and handling money transfers. 

That is exactly what smart meters enable.

In order to do as you suggest, they need to know how much you use and when.

It is exactly the point of them.

How would an energy supplier operate a flexible tariff, as you are advocating, without the data to make it work?

Energy supply and demand is not constant. It costs money to scale back generation when demand is low, by offering the excess generation to customers at these times they can reduce the cost to the customers that can make use of it.

They continue generating and reduce costs, it benefits all of us.

Another benefit is that energy consumed by people like me in low demand times makes more available at peak times, it eases the burden on the grid and reduces the chances of power cuts. If I didn't buy my electricity during the winter at night and store it, I would have to buy at peak times.

But, in order to do this, they need to know how much I use and when.

It's all pretty basic and really rather obvious.

Did you miss the part where I said "this is what the supplier is supposed to be doing"? And that the "flexible tarrifs are artificially kept low to make them more appealing to consumers"? Of course the meters work then! The point is that if suppliers where actually doing what they are supposed to be doing as a business, these meters would not be needed. Instead, by installing them, people make their life easier. I see how sending threats of fines appeals to them.matt_drummer said:

agentcain said:

You are arguing for the sake of arguing and in regards to "pedalling the same myths" you are talking nonsense.

The only reason you see benefit with smart meters and special tariffs is because these tariffs have been artificially made tempting to give incentives for smart meter installation. Yes, smart meters benefit the network, the generators and suppliers and I'm pretty sure someone in the government has a mate in those manufacturing and supply lines to actually procure meters. The end consumer though has zero financial benefit if they were already able to send readings and limit energy waste. For those end consumers who enjoy however the IHD, not having to send readings or are unwilling or unable to switch certain appliances off when its expensive to run them, then they yes indeed benefit from a smart meter. But for the sake of those, I would argue that this should be an opt in situation, with the cost of buying and fitting the meter going to the consumer who wants it, rather than everyone via increased charges.

Of all the excellent posters on here, @[Deleted User] is the least likely to talk nonsense, especially about smart meters!

We already have energy meters, the `mate' of somebody in government was already making energy meters and had been for decades, you argument does not make sense.

I don't know, but I would imagine that a smart meter is cheaper to produce than older analogue type meters.

And, like many things, old style analogue meters are no longer produced or supported, the world has moved on. We don't have VHS recorders produced anymore, they are the past, it's done with.

You make a lot of assumptions. First that I take your word for whatever Dolor is. I don't know them, I don't know their posts but I do know that what he tried to write is nonsense. Second, if we are to talk electricity, technology advancement and all the nuances, let's make another thread and I'll be happy to contribute as it so happens I'm an electrical and electronics engineer, so right down my alley. Third, I do understand that meters get old and need replacement but we are talking about forcing it on everyone even when a replacement is not needed at the threat of a fine if you miss an appointment you didn't make. If we do consider what is cheaper to do, the cheapest solution is to follow one of the R's; reuse. People in the UK and many other advanced markets seem to be too eager to replace perfectly working equipment.

Your VHS example is inaccurate.The VHS technology does not even deliver the same performance as DVD or Blu-ray. Smart and non smart meters do exactly the same thing, the main difference being that one has an IHD and transmits the readings. For the sake of argument, electrical labs and ground work still use analog devices instead of digital, because they work equally as good and therefore don't need to be replaced. Should the smart meters be, I don't know, more accurate in their readings then I would say yes it make sense to replace all of them. But we're not even arguing about analog Vs digital here as there are plenty of digital meters out there that just happens to not be smart. In all, a smart meter is cheaper than an analogue one but still more expensive than a non smart digital. The mate of the government is a different one each time (hopefully, otherwise we're just feeding the same fat pigs).

TheElectricCow

badmemory said:

But I can read my old meter I just worry that the difficulties in reading the new ones, with the buttons to press etc, might make them in practical terms inaccessible for me.  As in I can bend but bending AND turning has some issues & I think smaller numbers too. 

How difficult the meter is to read is more to do with the actual model of the meter itself rather than whether or not it’s a smart meter.

For example, with my smart meter (fitted by Eon) there’s nothing special to do to take a reading and no buttons to press - the reading simply displays on the screen constantly so it can be read by just looking at it. The meter does have two buttons, and pressing either of them once will light up the display nice and brightly to make it easier to read if needed.

On this model the only time you ever need to worry about button pressing is if on a dual rate or export tariff, where the supplier would need multiple different readings e.g. to measure night time usage or electric exported to the grid from solar panels (which does not apply to most people).

But of course in an ideal world you wouldn’t actually need to read it yourself anyway as the readings would be sent to your supplier automatically, so you’d be able to do away with the bending altogether. If you do decide to consider getting one fitted it might be worth checking with your supplier what model they’d install, to see whether or not it really would be any more complicated than it is for you now.

shinytop

I wish I were as lucky as the OP. I'm with BG and want a smart meter so I can take advantage of TOU tariffs.  I've registered my interest with BG and they are not fitting them in my area and they will get back to me within 12 months with an update.  

Marvel1

Mstty said:
wrf12345 said:

Interesting, I recently had an email from BG saying they were fitting meters in the area and I could click on a link to book an appointment, which I did and received a similar confirmation email to the OP (who seems to have just been given the appointment without asking for it). But BG have at least two separate customer account systems so I guess it depends if you are on the new one or old one or some other foible of their systems or someone spilling coffee over the computer. In the past, I had endless texts and phone calls from some meter firm who said they were fitting meters in the area but could not be bothered with them at the time but now that energy costs are so high I suspect that people are going to get the best rates if they have smart meters fitted so don't want to miss out. Definitely the wrong way round in this case, making the customer cancel if they don't want it rather than asking them if they want one fitted - that should be an Ofgem fine but par for the course post Brexit where consumer rights have effectively been stripped away.

Conversely I like the idea of maybe a £100+ fine. There are smart meter fitting targets to be met and as explained multiple times in this and other posts smart meters will save customers money with the tariffs they open up to customers with smart meters.

Maybe whack a £1000 fine in?

(We might as well be as outlandish as those with smart meter conspiracy theories)

Again, but to add, have they ever gone over the current rate set rates?

Marvel1 said:

Mstty said:

littlemoney said:

About 5 years ago I had a phone call from my energy provider stating that it was a legal requirement to have a smart meter fitted. I responded to say they have a legal requirement to inform me about smart meters but I didn't have to have one.

Never heard any more after that conversation. I think it was a time when the government had given energy provider targets for meter installations. Presumably they were missing their target.

With a username like littemoney perhaps a smart meter could have cut your energy costs by a third if you had accepted the smart meter and got onboard with time of use tariffs.

The reluctance of people getting smart meters does still baffle me but always good to point out savings that you could have been receiving and getting now as this is a money saving board. 

Who are the providers offering this, as I'm looking into getting one.

Info, in case needed

My annual electric from 08-05-22 to now = 1490 kWh
My annual gas from 08-05-22 to now = 1999 kWh

Current rate for electric: 32.110p per kWh
Current rate for gas: 10.467p per kWh

Somniac

shinytop said:

I wish I were as lucky as the OP. I'm with BG and want a smart meter so I can take advantage of TOU tariffs.  I've registered my interest with BG and they are not fitting them in my area and they will get back to me within 12 months with an update.  

Does BG have TOU rates available? I can’t find reference to them.